winninguglyin83 Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 Edwin Jackson for Jeffrey Marquez. Or maybe Wilson Betemit. Do it, Kenny Stanford. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (greg775 @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 01:46 PM) None. That's why I said "creative" ways to trade. I think Jackson and Quentin for Rasmus would be idiotic. Jackson must be a headcase cause he still has good stuff (I guess Cooper can't fix this one) and Quentin is a good player. well please, be creative and show us how it could work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenksycat Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 02:00 PM) well please, be creative and show us how it could work Yeah you keep clamoring for this Greg, its just not going to happen. We're not trading Dunn, period. Nobody will take Rios unless we throw in Danks, Q, Beckham, and maybe Sale for good measure. And trading Juan is pointless, you can just cut him. We don't have a prime Miguel Cabrera to get someone to take Rios with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogan873 Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 02:00 PM) well please, be creative and show us how it could work Rasmus for Rios, Jackson, and the Goose Island Brewery...oh, wait Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (GoSox05 @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 06:53 PM) Trade Quentin for a young pitcher. Than trade Jackson for a young hitter. That would be nice. And gain what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (greg775 @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 01:46 PM) None. That's why I said "creative" ways to trade. I think Jackson and Quentin for Rasmus would be idiotic. Jackson must be a headcase cause he still has good stuff (I guess Cooper can't fix this one) and Quentin is a good player. You're incorrectly evaluating Jackson and Quentin because you aren't taking their contexts into consideration. Jackson has to go, period, because we will lose him at the end of the year, and we have 5 starters already. He is a borderline type B right now, so you try to trade him for more value than a supplemental pick. To get max value, we have to trade him. Quentin is good, but very streaky and inconsistent, and will make $8m next year. We have a younger, cheaper, high-upside replacement in Viciedo in AAA. It doesn't make sense to pony up for CQ in this case. I'm not saying these are bad players, I'm saying that circumstances make it a good idea to move them for other things we need. A power-hitting, high-upside CF like Rasmus would be a great grab for us. No one wants Rios without us eating the contract, so it makes no sense to sell low on him. We can move him to RF and put Viciedo in LF next year. Viciedo/Rasmus/Rios is better and cheaper than De Aza/Rios/Quentin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 02:20 PM) And gain what? A possible future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 07:51 PM) I don't know if Jackson is a headcase...I think his biggest problem is the lack of a third remotely effective pitch. He's all 2 pitches...fastball slider. If both of those pitches are on 100% of the time, then he's near unhittable. If either of those pitches isn't giving him control that day though, then he's rapidly a 1-pitch pitcher or worse. He can still win some of those games because 1 of those pitches is a 96 mph fastball, but he has to throw a lot of pitches to win a game like that if he doesn't have the slider. Throw in one more pitch that comes in the low to mid 80's, even if it's not hugely effective every game, and suddenly even on days where he has no control over the slider, he can keep people off balance by changing velocity. Or, similarly, get him to do a better job of changing up the velocity on his fastball. Something. He just doesn't have the repertoire needed to be an everyday starter unless his 2 pitches are there all the time. I would think this is right on. It amazes me with Edwin that even on days when he doesn't seem to have it and the guy throws 120 pitches he can still keep the opposition down to like 4 runs. He is a real enigma. So much talent and so little success. I think some team might be willing to gamble on him and give a respectable amount of talent (young hopefully) back for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenksycat Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 02:23 PM) A possible future. You really think the haul for those 2 is going to be enough to save the franchise? Trade Jackson cause you're not resigning him anyway, keep Q so you can have him and Viciedo (hopefully) tear it up for the rest of this and next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 02:20 PM) And gain what? $15 millionish dollars and some young talent? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (Jenksy Cat @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 02:26 PM) You really think the haul for those 2 is going to be enough to save the franchise? Trade Jackson cause you're not resigning him anyway, keep Q so you can have him and Viciedo (hopefully) tear it up for the rest of this and next year. You have to get something worth the equivalent of a sandwich pick, or you need to just keep him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (Jenksy Cat @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 03:26 PM) You really think the haul for those 2 is going to be enough to save the franchise? If the White Sox were to trade those 2 to restock just a little, and came back next year with almost the same mix except for Sale somehow moved into the rotation and a little more bullpen depth, we'd still say this team had a good shot to compete. But just like this year...if Dunn, Peavy, Rios, and a few others didn't perform...that would be a major hurt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (Jenksy Cat @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 02:26 PM) You really think the haul for those 2 is going to be enough to save the franchise? Trade Jackson cause you're not resigning him anyway, keep Q so you can have him and Viciedo (hopefully) tear it up for the rest of this and next year. Not those moves alone, no. It'd have to be a sustained plan. And c'mon, do you really think Quentin will tear it up the rest of this year and next? The guy is erratic as hell, and there's a good chance he has a terrible year or that he breaks his wrist wiping his ass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 03:30 PM) Not those moves alone, no. It'd have to be a sustained plan. And c'mon, do you really think Quentin will tear it up the rest of this year and next? The guy is erratic as hell, and there's a good chance he has a terrible year or that he breaks his wrist wiping his ass. If we're out of it this year...with what we have sitting on this roster and in the minors, Carlos has to be a top candidate to be moved. He could single-handedly win the division for us next year, but even if he does that, he'd be gone right afterwards. He's healthy now, he's moveable now, there's demand for him right now. If we throw in the towel, he's got to be at the top of the list. And Hell, I'd actually like to see if De Aza can give the big league club anything productive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 02:35 PM) If we're out of it this year...with what we have sitting on this roster and in the minors, Carlos has to be a top candidate to be moved. He could single-handedly win the division for us next year, but even if he does that, he'd be gone right afterwards. He's healthy now, he's moveable now, there's demand for him right now. If we throw in the towel, he's got to be at the top of the list. And Hell, I'd actually like to see if De Aza can give the big league club anything productive. He and John Danks are 1 and 1a Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 02:30 PM) Not those moves alone, no. It'd have to be a sustained plan. And c'mon, do you really think Quentin will tear it up the rest of this year and next? The guy is erratic as hell, and there's a good chance he has a terrible year or that he breaks his wrist wiping his ass. Exactly. Paying Quentin now is paying for his peak performance while probably not getting 70% of it. It doesn't make financial sense when you have Viciedo to replace him on the cheap. Only logical move is to cash him in while he's most valuable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 02:36 PM) Exactly. Paying Quentin now is paying for his peak performance while probably not getting 70% of it. It doesn't make financial sense when you have Viciedo to replace him on the cheap. Only logical move is to cash him in while he's most valuable. I don't think there is a doubt in my mind that Carlos will be hated by whatever fanbase there is on the team he signs his "big" contract with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 01:27 PM) I wouldn't trade Q alone for Rasmus, let alone with Jackson. That seems unbelievable to me, given the financial considerations and the upside and the injury risk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 03:35 PM) He and John Danks are 1 and 1a I dunno about Danks...Between the fact that he's been hurt this year and the fact that he's struggled this year, I wonder if it isn't entirely possible that we couldn't get fair value for him right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 http://bleacherreport.com/articles/757184-...-jacksons-value Sports Illustrated's Jon Heyman reported yesterday that the Chicago White Sox are "fielding calls" on pitcher Edwin Jackson: as he put it, "in this market he may be the best out there as far as starting pitchers." That's got to be pretty disappointing (and rather sad) news to the teams out there looking to bolster their rotations. Jackson has one major thing going for him at this point--he can eat up innings. He's gone six or more innings in his last seven starts, having racked up over 100 at this point from the fourth spot in the rotation. But the 27-year-old boasts just five wins (seven losses) in 17 starts and his ERA is over 4.00. More to the point, what does it say if the third-place and four-games-under-.500 White Sox are looking to give up on you? Still, there should be a major interest in Jackson from some teams looking to find that fourth starter or just add depth to the rotation. Certainly those pennant-contending clubs out there who have plenty of arms--Atlanta, Philadelphia, San Francisco--aren't going to pick up the phone. But you know that the Red Sox and Yankees are going to show interest: they always do and they can afford to overpay for someone like Jackson. But I don't see that happening this year, at least not at this particular point in the season. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised to see Jackson head over to the National League, and not far from where he is right now. The St. Louis Cardinals have done a decent job of overcoming the loss of Adam Wainwright, but with Chris Carpenter not exactly at his peak and Jake Westbrook struggling, I think Jackson might be able to ease Tony LaRussa (and the fans') minds a bit down the stretch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 02:42 PM) I dunno about Danks...Between the fact that he's been hurt this year and the fact that he's struggled this year, I wonder if it isn't entirely possible that we couldn't get fair value for him right now. Edwin Jackson is being described as possibly the best starting pitcher on the market. Stop and think about that for a second in terms of what that means Danks would be work on the open market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 03:58 PM) Edwin Jackson is being described as possibly the best starting pitcher on the market. Stop and think about that for a second in terms of what that means Danks would be work on the open market. That also means that Danks is not expected to be on the open market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 03:00 PM) That also means that Danks is not expected to be on the open market. If continue on our recent trajectory, he should be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 12, 2011 -> 04:02 PM) If continue on our recent trajectory, he should be. I'd listen, but I'd demand a very high price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 You could probably get Alonzo from the Reds for Edwin and flip him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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