The Sir Posted July 14, 2011 Author Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 08:09 AM) I'm doing the same with California. You beat me to it. Add Massachusetts in there too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 09:10 AM) Which means anytime Barack goes to church, you should be upset. What are talking about? Muslims pray at mosques. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (FlySox87 @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 09:12 AM) You beat me to it. Add Massachusetts in there too. Yeah who needs California and Massachusetts? We need more states like Alabama and Arkansas. Leaders of innovation! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 The Flying Spaghetti Monster rules all. /thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 09:11 AM) Do you even bother reading what I write any more? I don't think you even read what you post most of the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (FlySox87 @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 09:08 AM) I disagree. No one is forced to attend, and no tax dollars are funding this thing. The Constitution doesn't prohibit politicians from being openly religious. That's not the goal of the First Amendment. Do you disagree that a link on an official government website promoting a religious event is a violation of the first amendment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 10:14 AM) I don't think you even read what you post most of the time. I defend Rick Perry and you can't even be troubled to pay attention to it. That just pisses me off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 10:14 AM) Do you disagree that a link on an official government website promoting a religious event is a violation of the first amendment? Yeah, I'd say I disagree on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 09:17 AM) Yeah, I'd say I disagree on that. How far does one have to go to violate the first? Would "Islam is the Light" being in 40 pt font on illinois.gov be ok? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 10:18 AM) How far does one have to go to violate the first? Would "Islam is the Light" being in 40 pt font on illinois.gov be ok? Depends on the context, I'd say. Overhauling the entire Illinois State Website to support Allah is one thing. Listing public events at a Mosque is another. You might be able to get me more annoyed if Perry launched, you know a state funded ad campaign to support the thing, but I'd hope most taxpayers would get annoyed with that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 I suppose we'll just have to agree to disagree on that one. This seems pretty clearly like government endorsement of a particular religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (FlySox87 @ Jul 13, 2011 -> 09:19 PM) Freedom From Religion Foundation files federal lawsuit against Rick Perry for Prayer Day. EDIT: This is the correct link. The other one is relevant and interesting, but this is the lawsuit one. I'm sure most of you will think it's silly that he's going to an event to pray our problems away. Hell, I'm a fan of God myself, but He's not going to make the debt go away or reduce the deficit. So I'd prefer more practical solutions from our politicians. That said, he's entitled to his religious beliefs. It'd be one thing if he were using taxpayer funds for this. But he's not. As the article states, it's privately funded. So he's going on his own time, on his own dime. No one is being forced to attend. So this group's claim that he's breaking the constitutional prohibition against the establishment of a national religion is just idiotic. I'm curious how you would react if Obama started going to national prayer events held at mosques. Of course it would be on his free time and these would be privately funded events. For some reason, and I don't know why, I could imagine a huge uproar from you and most conservatives in this country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenksismyhero Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 09:17 AM) Yeah, I'd say I disagree on that. Same. Course this is one of the oldest constitutional arguments around - does the Constitution ban the government's involvement in religion completely, or just from promoting one religion in particular (and really the Constitution only speaks of passing LAWS respecting the establishment of religion) But, as the Constitution has been bastardized on this issue, we are where we are now - anytime the government is associated with any religion at all it's a violation of the Constitution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenksismyhero Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 09:22 AM) I'm curious how you would react if Obama started going to national prayer events held at mosques. Of course it would be on his free time and these would be privately funded events. For some reason, and I don't know why, I could imagine a huge uproar from you and most conservatives in this country. I doubt it would be on constitutional grounds though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sir Posted July 14, 2011 Author Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 08:20 AM) Depends on the context, I'd say. Overhauling the entire Illinois State Website to support Allah is one thing. Listing public events at a Mosque is another. You might be able to get me more annoyed if Perry launched, you know a state funded ad campaign to support the thing, but I'd hope most taxpayers would get annoyed with that too. This. Rick Perry simply endorsed an event he's attending (similar to listing the mosque events as mentioned by Balta) on his website. And then responded to the criticism of the event using the same platform. I'd say that's totally legitimate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sir Posted July 14, 2011 Author Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 08:22 AM) I'm curious how you would react if Obama started going to national prayer events held at mosques. Of course it would be on his free time and these would be privately funded events. For some reason, and I don't know why, I could imagine a huge uproar from you and most conservatives in this country. He's free to do it if its on his own free time and no tax dollars were funding it. My response would be to encourage everyone I know to vote against him and to vote against him myself. I wouldn't file a lawsuit to stop his private beliefs though. That would be the actual violation of the Constitution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (FlySox87 @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 09:26 AM) He's free to do it if its on his own free time and no tax dollars were funding it. My response would be to encourage everyone I know to vote against him and to vote against him myself. I wouldn't file a lawsuit to stop his private beliefs though. That would be the actual violation of the Constitution. Because of the hypothetical scenario i came up with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 An appropriate place to put this... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 09:22 AM) I'm curious how you would react if Obama started going to national prayer events held at mosques. Of course it would be on his free time and these would be privately funded events. For some reason, and I don't know why, I could imagine a huge uproar from you and most conservatives in this country. There are media pictures of him at church all of the time. I am sure he doesn't walk, and he doesn't leave the secret service at home. I am also sure he doesn't leave it off of his public agenda. Honestly this is something that happens all of the time, and always has happened throughout our history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 The lawsuit isn't over him attending a religious event or listing it on his agenda, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoSox05 Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 09:40 AM) An appropriate place to put this... Oprah is the anti-christ and evil gay sex. Two things that are important to rebuilding the country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 09:53 AM) The lawsuit isn't over him attending a religious event or listing it on his agenda, though. putting it on his website? You are claiming that makes it an official state endorsement. Presidents have always done that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 09:55 AM) putting it on his website? You are claiming that makes it an official state endorsement. Presidents have always done that. What about making videos like the one I posted, endorsing this event in what appears to be an official video from the Governor's office, flags in the background and all. If this is all on his free time then why did he make a video like that? Why not one where he's in his regular clothes in his backyard? Edited July 14, 2011 by BigSqwert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 09:57 AM) What about making videos like the one I posted, endorsing this event in what appears to be an official video from the Governor's office, flags in the background and all. If this is all on his free time then why did he make a video like that? Why not one where he's in his regular clothes in his backyard? So how is that any different than saying a specific religions prayer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 14, 2011 -> 09:59 AM) So how is that any different than saying a specific religions prayer? I honestly do not understand your question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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