southsider2k5 Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Jul 22, 2011 -> 07:37 AM) I can't believe the prevailing opinion on this board doesn't hold Kenny Hollywood accountable for this mess. So who do you think the Steelers will sign when the lockout ends? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Jul 22, 2011 -> 07:37 AM) I can't believe the prevailing opinion on this board doesn't hold Kenny Hollywood accountable for this mess. I doubt there is anyone on this board that doesn't give KW any blame for this current mess. He should be accountable, so should Ozzie, so should JR, so should the coaches, so should the players. I don't know if you have noticed, it seems the most frustrating part of this season is how no one IS apparently taking accountablity. Nothing changes. If the Sox don't win this division and this brand of baseball continues the next 64 games, when they give you the line they gave after 2007 that no one could have seen this coming, maybe not, but certainly a lot of teams would have done SOMETHING about it by now. The problem is the GM and manager apparently don't get along and seem IMO to be trying to get the Chairman to be on their side. They are working harder at winning over JR than they are at trying to win games, and each has too big of ego and is too stubborn apparently to admit they were wrong and change it up a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 Dunn — who is batting .158 with 124 strikeouts — played catch and shagged flies during batting practice Wednesday, so a trip to the 15-day disabled list would seem suspicious. Gotta love the tribune calling out this concept as "Suspicious". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bighurt574 Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 In a rational world, management would understand the concept of "sunk costs" and play the guys who give us the best chance to win, regardless of salary. The problem is that if we give up on Dunn and Rios, KW is pretty much admitting failure in acquiring those guys, so we're trotting them out there every day still hoping they turn it around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 QUOTE (bighurt574 @ Jul 22, 2011 -> 10:20 AM) In a rational world, management would understand the concept of "sunk costs" and play the guys who give us the best chance to win, regardless of salary. The problem is that if we give up on Dunn and Rios, KW is pretty much admitting failure in acquiring those guys, so we're trotting them out there every day still hoping they turn it around. I asked this the other day, but got no answer... what is the biggest contract anyone has just given up on as an organization? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 22, 2011 -> 08:14 AM) I doubt there is anyone on this board that doesn't give KW any blame for this current mess. He should be accountable, so should Ozzie, so should JR, so should the coaches, so should the players. I don't know if you have noticed, it seems the most frustrating part of this season is how no one IS apparently taking accountablity. Nothing changes. If the Sox don't win this division and this brand of baseball continues the next 64 games, when they give you the line they gave after 2007 that no one could have seen this coming, maybe not, but certainly a lot of teams would have done SOMETHING about it by now. The problem is the GM and manager apparently don't get along and seem IMO to be trying to get the Chairman to be on their side. They are working harder at winning over JR than they are at trying to win games, and each has too big of ego and is too stubborn apparently to admit they were wrong and change it up a bit. You said it, brother. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bighurt574 Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 I don't blame KW for signing Dunn, he was arguably the most consistent player in baseball over the past 5-10 years, I don't think KW could or should have foreseen this dropoff of truly historic proportions. But at some point, you have to blame KW and Ozzie for how they're handling it. It's premature to just write off all 4 years of his contract, but he just doesn't have it this year. Get Viciedo in there. Either send Dunn to the DL followed by some time in the minors, or have him come off the bench for a while. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 QUOTE (since56 @ Jul 22, 2011 -> 01:50 PM) There is plenty of blame to go around............Then again a little winning streak and there will be plenty of credit to go around. However, I am beginning to doubt whether that winning streak will happen this season. It better be a helluva win streak in an "All-In Season." I'm firmly convinced the Sox gameplan is to win the division by one game or in a playoff. That's no approach to winning the s***ty Central. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macsandz Posted July 27, 2011 Author Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Jul 21, 2011 -> 07:44 PM) Miraculously this team is still in the race. But, it's cross-roads time for the White Sox and if this team wants to make the post-season, tough decisions have to be made. I'm not talking about "buyers or sellers" at the trade-deadline and hoping to find a team willing to make that all important deal. I'm talking about OZ, KW and JR sitting down and changing the direction of this team for a 60 game 2011 season. This is not some pipe-dream panic scramble. This is as simple as two roster moves that could be made in a couple phone calls. Today. This was to be a season of "all in" and the franchise promoted that to the public as it's 2011 motto. While that effectively described the 2011 OFF-SEASON, it has yet to be implemented during the season by management. As we all know this team's offense has underachieved greatly through the first 100 games and the highest paid players are most responsible. If this team wants to make a push and reach the postseason, it's time to enforce the "all in" approach and make some difficult choices. The challenge is in front of not only the players and management, but also lies in front of executive-level personnel as well. The dilemma is this: Continue with the roster as-is and hope that players that have drastically underachieved somehow turn their seasons around OR Reduce playing time for under-performers regardless of salary, and move forward with players that have the best chance of helping the team win NOW. My solution? Bench Dunn and Rios for Viciedo and DeAza for the next several series. (send down Morel and DL Dunn (knee) or Rios (toe)) That's extended playing time in games against the best in the AL as well as key rivals that could potentially make all the difference in how this team finishes 2011. Not sit Dunn and Rios for a few games and work them back into the lineup. I'm talking about brining up young, motivated players that have MLB experience and have played at a very high level all season in Charlotte. We don't need miracle production from Viciedo and DeAza, just play their game at replacement level and this team would be better immediately. Will Reinsdorf put his mouth where his money is and allow high-priced, low production players to collect a check on the bench? Will Ozzie put his money where his mouth is and step away from being the "player's manager"? Will Kenny put his ego in check and perform the duties of an actual GM with or without his Manager's "approval?" This is a lot to ask. This would be bold baseball. This would be that gamble consistant with the poker metaphor the Sox have been referencing all season. This is what needs to be done. Afterall, we've all played poker and "all in" is ALL IN. KW to Ozzie last night (6/26) "Do not worry about the size of the contracts, worry about putting the players out there that can HELP YOU WIN." Thank You Kenny for doing what needs to be done. Now let's do this thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldsox Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 22, 2011 -> 09:21 AM) I asked this the other day, but got no answer... what is the biggest contract anyone has just given up on as an organization? Someone answered... Russ Ortiz, D-Backs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Jul 22, 2011 -> 12:37 PM) I can't believe the prevailing opinion on this board doesn't hold Kenny Hollywood accountable for this mess. He's made some horrible moves, that is for sure. Rios, Dunn, Teahen, dumping some good pitchers and losing those trades. I would think there will be a housecleaning after the season. It's a little scary that an outgoing GM will be in charge of rebooting the roster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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