Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted August 8, 2003 Share Posted August 8, 2003 So stats don't mean s***, but the look you saw in his eyes 3 or 4 years ago is more important? You are kidding yourself, Michelle. Any kind of objectivity at all, would allow you to say "Hey, Kip has gotten better and he is a pretty good pitcher". Time to take the blinders off. yeah time for you to get a f***in clue.. kip is no better than when he left here and he sucked here he had one good season.. thats f***in it one... get a grip on reality for a change........the kids got no f***in confidence and will never ever be half the pitcher he was touted as............another over hyped blow out...........period....... I'm going to choose to end this because your point is baseless. lol now thats surprising .. you leaving in the middle of a debate cause you think your right all the time........lmao....... Give one reason that can be backed up to prove your point other than the look in Kip's eyes 3-4 years ago. You can't. The numbers don't back you up. I don't see anyone else coming to your defense on this point, because anyone with any objectivity can see you are wrong. I don't have to be right Michelle. But if you are going to tell me I am wrong, back it up and prove your point. I have yet to see that happen. compare his numbers with anyones... hes not God and was hyped to be so...........he had one, count it, ONE.. good season with the sox and tanked the rest of his time here..........not exactly what i would call living up to the hype that was put around him........hes not doing that hot in pitts either.....put him on any freakin team you want to .. if you dont have CONFIDENCE in yourself to do your job then your gonna suck at it...and with his past and present situations he gets in, and the way he handles himself he just doesnt have what it takes to be a comanding pitcher..........youve been around players for cryin out loud... tell me im wrong.. .you know when someone has it and when they dont...........period........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmr31 Posted August 8, 2003 Share Posted August 8, 2003 Unless Michelle lied to me, it would be hard for you to be Cotts when the two of you met up in Vegas recently. I know for a fact, Cotts was not there. How would u know where Cotts is? You his dad? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted August 8, 2003 Share Posted August 8, 2003 Unless Michelle lied to me, it would be hard for you to be Cotts when the two of you met up in Vegas recently. I know for a fact, Cotts was not there. well he dont have to be cotts it was just an example of one never knowing who they are talking to on a message board.......... yeah we did meet up and i know who he is......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doubleM23 Posted August 8, 2003 Share Posted August 8, 2003 Jesus... The guy's ERA last year was 3 1/2 in a more hitter-friendly park than Comiskey/U.S. Cellular Field. He'd be ahead of all but 1 of our starters with an ERA like that. No one's saying he was a huge hit with the Sox, but to say he sucks is utterly absurd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted August 8, 2003 Share Posted August 8, 2003 So stats don't mean s***, but the look you saw in his eyes 3 or 4 years ago is more important? You are kidding yourself, Michelle. Any kind of objectivity at all, would allow you to say "Hey, Kip has gotten better and he is a pretty good pitcher". Time to take the blinders off. yeah time for you to get a f***in clue.. kip is no better than when he left here and he sucked here he had one good season.. thats f***in it one... get a grip on reality for a change........the kids got no f***in confidence and will never ever be half the pitcher he was touted as............another over hyped blow out...........period....... I'm going to choose to end this because your point is baseless. lol now thats surprising .. you leaving in the middle of a debate cause you think your right all the time........lmao....... Give one reason that can be backed up to prove your point other than the look in Kip's eyes 3-4 years ago. You can't. The numbers don't back you up. I don't see anyone else coming to your defense on this point, because anyone with any objectivity can see you are wrong. I don't have to be right Michelle. But if you are going to tell me I am wrong, back it up and prove your point. I have yet to see that happen. compare his numbers with anyones... hes not God and was hyped to be so...........he had one, count it, ONE.. good season with the sox and tanked the rest of his time here..........not exactly what i would call living up to the hype that was put around him........hes not doing that hot in pitts either.....put him on any freakin team you want to .. if you dont have CONFIDENCE in yourself to do your job then your gonna suck at it...and with his past and present situations he gets in, and the way he handles himself he just doesnt have what it takes to be a comanding pitcher..........youve been around players for cryin out loud... tell me im wrong.. .you know when someone has it and when they dont...........period........ I posted his numbers 3 pages ago, right alongside Mark's. Go back and look and tell me they don't compare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted August 8, 2003 Share Posted August 8, 2003 How would u know where Cotts is? You his dad? Because I see him everyday at the ballpark? How difficult is that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmr31 Posted August 8, 2003 Share Posted August 8, 2003 Because I see him everyday at the ballpark? How difficult is that? You stalking him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted August 8, 2003 Share Posted August 8, 2003 So stats don't mean s***, but the look you saw in his eyes 3 or 4 years ago is more important? You are kidding yourself, Michelle. Any kind of objectivity at all, would allow you to say "Hey, Kip has gotten better and he is a pretty good pitcher". Time to take the blinders off. yeah time for you to get a f***in clue.. kip is no better than when he left here and he sucked here he had one good season.. thats f***in it one... get a grip on reality for a change........the kids got no f***in confidence and will never ever be half the pitcher he was touted as............another over hyped blow out...........period....... I'm going to choose to end this because your point is baseless. lol now thats surprising .. you leaving in the middle of a debate cause you think your right all the time........lmao....... Give one reason that can be backed up to prove your point other than the look in Kip's eyes 3-4 years ago. You can't. The numbers don't back you up. I don't see anyone else coming to your defense on this point, because anyone with any objectivity can see you are wrong. I don't have to be right Michelle. But if you are going to tell me I am wrong, back it up and prove your point. I have yet to see that happen. compare his numbers with anyones... hes not God and was hyped to be so...........he had one, count it, ONE.. good season with the sox and tanked the rest of his time here..........not exactly what i would call living up to the hype that was put around him........hes not doing that hot in pitts either.....put him on any freakin team you want to .. if you dont have CONFIDENCE in yourself to do your job then your gonna suck at it...and with his past and present situations he gets in, and the way he handles himself he just doesnt have what it takes to be a comanding pitcher..........youve been around players for cryin out loud... tell me im wrong.. .you know when someone has it and when they dont...........period........ I posted his numbers 3 pages ago, right alongside Mark's. Go back and look and tell me they don't compare. marks got about 50 more innings pitched than wells.. and their numbers arent that close......when kips got that many innings under his belt for the season.. lets talk......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted August 8, 2003 Share Posted August 8, 2003 So stats don't mean s***, but the look you saw in his eyes 3 or 4 years ago is more important? You are kidding yourself, Michelle. Any kind of objectivity at all, would allow you to say "Hey, Kip has gotten better and he is a pretty good pitcher". Time to take the blinders off. yeah time for you to get a f***in clue.. kip is no better than when he left here and he sucked here he had one good season.. thats f***in it one... get a grip on reality for a change........the kids got no f***in confidence and will never ever be half the pitcher he was touted as............another over hyped blow out...........period....... I'm going to choose to end this because your point is baseless. lol now thats surprising .. you leaving in the middle of a debate cause you think your right all the time........lmao....... Give one reason that can be backed up to prove your point other than the look in Kip's eyes 3-4 years ago. You can't. The numbers don't back you up. I don't see anyone else coming to your defense on this point, because anyone with any objectivity can see you are wrong. I don't have to be right Michelle. But if you are going to tell me I am wrong, back it up and prove your point. I have yet to see that happen. compare his numbers with anyones... hes not God and was hyped to be so...........he had one, count it, ONE.. good season with the sox and tanked the rest of his time here..........not exactly what i would call living up to the hype that was put around him........hes not doing that hot in pitts either.....put him on any freakin team you want to .. if you dont have CONFIDENCE in yourself to do your job then your gonna suck at it...and with his past and present situations he gets in, and the way he handles himself he just doesnt have what it takes to be a comanding pitcher..........youve been around players for cryin out loud... tell me im wrong.. .you know when someone has it and when they dont...........period........ I posted his numbers 3 pages ago, right alongside Mark's. Go back and look and tell me they don't compare. marks got about 50 more innings pitched than wells.. and their numbers arent that close......when kips got that many innings under his belt for the season.. lets talk......... Kip was on the DL.......... his hits/innings pitched ratio is much better....... his ERA is lower in a hitter's park...... his strikeout rate is better........ on the flip side, his walk rate is not as good as MB's, and he gives up HR's at a slightly higher rate..... Neither player's stats stand out from the others Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerbaho-WG Posted August 8, 2003 Author Share Posted August 8, 2003 Wow, look what I've missed. I get to see people bashing on Kip Wells, but they're ignorant to what he is now. Kip Wells hit 99 MPH last year, ahd an ERA of 3.59 in just about 200 IP, and only gave up 71 BB, which isn't horrible. There are two main reasons why Kip Wells failed for the Sox; one being he was rushed heavily (went from W-S to Chicago in one year. Only had 150 IP in the minors), and had Nardi Contreras as a pitching coach. Look at Wells' minor-league numbers, they were very solid. Wells had a very acceptable WHIP last year, decent BB/9IP ratio and was a good 2-3 starter for the Pirates. Anyone who thinks Kip Wells is still washed up, simply stated, does not know baseball. Now, onto Neal Cotts. As many of you know, I go by stats to evaluate players, mainly because I haven't seen a lot of them. Cotts' numbers are sick, to put it bluntly. Yes, he's walking some people, but his OBA is .170. That is probably one of the lowest OBA throughout the entire minor leagues. When I did see Cotts pitch at the Future's Game, I saw some positives and negatives. His changeup seemed very natural, and changed locations (up-down, left-right) with his fastball. He nibbled a bit too much, but over his last four starts, it seemed to me that he improved on this. In my opinion, I project Cotts to be a solid #2, but hell, I think Honel could turn out into a #1, so what do I know? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MnSoxFan Posted August 8, 2003 Share Posted August 8, 2003 Having fun Rex, this bmr fellow must be a real pain in the ass for ya. I am with Rex and Cerbaho, I like Kip Wells and would really enjoy him still being with the Sox. I am not ready to put all my cards behind Cotts, but Rex is a good judge of talent bmr, you are just trying to get Rex riled up, glad he is man enough to not let you get him in that mode. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted August 8, 2003 Share Posted August 8, 2003 Having fun Rex, this bmr fellow must be a real pain in the ass for ya. I am with Rex and Cerbaho, I like Kip Wells and would really enjoy him still being with the Sox. I am not ready to put all my cards behind Cotts, but Rex is a good judge of talent bmr, you are just trying to get Rex riled up, glad he is man enough to not let you get him in that mode. My whole thing with Cotts is that right now, I think he is as good of an option that we have for the 5th starter. I think he will have initial success in Majors. He will have to continue to work to keep his walks down and being efficient so his pitch counts don't get too high. Could he need to start in AAA next year? Sure...... But in my mind, that would not preclude him from having success right now. Look at all of the other young guys that have come up and made contributions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MnSoxFan Posted August 8, 2003 Share Posted August 8, 2003 I expected to see better stuff from him in Tucson, did not see a good breaking ball or anything hard. Seems like DBacks hit him a bit. But hard to argue with those impressive numbers, he has to be hard to hit for the stats he has put up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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