soxsoxsoxsox Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 AaronBoone_ESPN Aaron Boone Ludwick doubles off Ubaldo for two RBI. Both guys rumored to be heading to Cleveland. Keeps getting more bizarre. 8 minutes ago Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (Melissa1334 @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 08:07 PM) well maybe thats not the right word but meaning if you know 95% ur trading him and u tell him and then u still want him to pitch like that? Rockies wanted more. They apparently called the Indians' bluff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melissa1334 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 well they told him its done Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 08:09 PM) Rockies wanted more. They apparently called the Indians' bluff. And the Indians should fold that hand. The Rockies better hope for their sake Ubaldo doesn't get injured. Very weird seeing my second favorite team handling a trade situation like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (SoxAce @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 07:17 PM) And the Indians should fold that hand. The Rockies better hope for their sake Ubaldo doesn't get injured. Very weird seeing my second favorite team handling a trade situation like this. i think it was brilliant wanted a fourth player and said "hey, we aren't afraid to keep our guy if you don't give us a 4th" and it worked. love it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 But doesn't that open them up to having to at least give Ubaldo a pretty thorough physical exam and battery of MRI's before it's approved? Especially if his velocity was noticeably down? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 07:21 PM) But doesn't that open them up to having to at least give Ubaldo a pretty thorough physical exam and battery of MRI's before it's approved? Especially if his velocity was noticeably down? it was just one inning. i'm pretty sure the indians don't care that much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 They should if they were around for the Sirotka/David Wells trade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Reddy @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 08:22 PM) it was just one inning. i'm pretty sure the indians don't care that much. Yes I'm sure they don't care a guy they want is mentally unstable. (not to mention getting shelled doesn't feel too good to the psyche, and velocity was down 3 MPH) I feel for Ubaldo, but it is a business. Just don't like how the Rockies handled that one at all regardless of price demands. Other GMs also talk around the league about handling specific business. s***, getting either White or Pomeranz was a great deal for the Rockies, yet alone getting BOTH guys (though we'll see that comes to be true of the rumors). Edited July 31, 2011 by SoxAce Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (SoxAce @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 09:25 PM) Yes I'm sure they don't care a guy they want is mentally unstable. (not to mention getting shelled doesn't feel too good to the psyche, and velocity was down 3 MPH) I feel for Ubaldo, but it is a business. Just don't like how the Rockies handled that one at all regardless of price demands. Other GMs also talk around the league about handling specific business. s***, getting either White or Pomeranz was a great deal for the Rockies, yet alone getting BOTH guys. You've got to figure that the Rockies had motive to do that...that they felt Cleveland was dragging their feet or something like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 (edited) It's like one of those movies where they ask the protagonist to shoot someone (who's blindfolded) in the head to see if he'll go through with it...only later does the shooter find out he actually didn't kill anyone. It might work...but it's foolhardy as a long-term method of "honest dealing." Win the battle, lose the war, etc. Edited July 31, 2011 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 The Rockies stated all along they wanted four close to mlb ready players. The risk of injury is absolutely minimal. He could injure himself simply if the negotiations were to take place tomorrow instead of today. The Rockies were prepared to hold on to him if they didn't get exactly what they wanted, and so they pitched him, as they normally would, until they got exactly that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 08:33 PM) The Rockies stated all along they wanted four close to mlb ready players. The risk of injury is absolutely minimal. He could injure himself simply if the negotiations were to take place tomorrow instead of today. The Rockies were prepared to hold on to him if they didn't get exactly what they wanted, and so they pitched him, as they normally would, until they got exactly that. It is one thing when they state their demands and the sides are negotiating/far apart. Its another when the two sides have pretty much agreed to 95% of it and they wanted prospect A instead of prospect B as the 4th player and STILL pitch the guy they no longer will be their property. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 well regardless - helluva deal for Colorado. Pomeranz, White, McBride and Joe Gardner. Sick. For a pitcher who isn't even all that good (Jimenez) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (Reddy @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 09:46 PM) For a pitcher who isn't even all that good (Jimenez) You wanna back that up with some stats to convince me? Because, despite everything, he seemed really darn good last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (Reddy @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 07:46 PM) well regardless - helluva deal for Colorado. Pomeranz, White, McBride and Joe Gardner. Sick. For a pitcher who isn't even all that good (Jimenez) How do you explain your opinion of Rasmus if you're going to say that about Ubaldo? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 Rockies just played Cleveland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderBolt Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 I really like this deal for the Rockies. Always been a big fan of Pomeranz. never saw the sense on shipping out Ubaldo this early into a team friendly deal, but for this package i can understand the move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted July 31, 2011 Author Share Posted July 31, 2011 Jimenez since 2010 All-Star break (not counting today): 35 GS, 216.2 IP, 4.03 ERA, 1.32 WHIP, 9.0 K/9, 8.2 H/9, 3.9 BB/9, 2.33 K/BB and his fastball is down from an average velocity of 96.1 last year to 93.4 this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 07:55 PM) How do you explain your opinion of Rasmus if you're going to say that about Ubaldo? 1) position scarcity. much harder to find a good CF than SP 2) Rasmus is MUCH younger. Rasmus already has a great track record, especially for a guy his age. He's already outproduced guys like Beltran at the same age. 1) Since June 1 of last year he's had about a 4 ERA (4 this year and 4.08 from june on last season). Which is the outlier? 2) Ubaldo is already 27 and hit his peak. And that was a fantastic 2010. This year he's got a 4 era. I think that's a lot more likely going forward than sub-3, though I'd imagine he'll be a mid-high 3's more often than not Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Kalapse @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 09:17 PM) Jimenez since 2010 All-Star break (not counting today): 35 GS, 216.2 IP, 4.03 ERA, 1.32 WHIP, 9.0 K/9, 8.2 H/9, 3.9 BB/9, 2.33 K/BB and his fastball is down from an average velocity of 96.1 last year to 93.4 this year. Hasn't Ubaldo's velocity increased the last month or so? I know it was down to start the season. But in the games I've seen of late he's been consistently poppin' 95. Edited July 31, 2011 by Jordan4life Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (Kalapse @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 08:17 PM) Jimenez since 2010 All-Star break (not counting today): 35 GS, 216.2 IP, 4.03 ERA, 1.32 WHIP, 9.0 K/9, 8.2 H/9, 3.9 BB/9, 2.33 K/BB and his fastball is down from an average velocity of 96.1 last year to 93.4 this year. a-thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted July 31, 2011 Author Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 09:23 PM) Hasn't Ubaldo's velocity increased the last month or so? I know it was down to start the season. But in the games I've seen of late he's been consistently poppin' 95. His velocity has been inconsistent His average fastball in his last start was 93.3/93.8 (FF/FT) topping out at 96.2, he hit 95+ 7 times out of 47 fastballs. In the start before that he was at 94.4/93.7 topping out 96.3 hitting 95+ 21 times out of 67 fastballs. Here's his velocity chart from fangraphs: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (Kalapse @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 08:38 PM) His velocity has been inconsistent His average fastball in his last start was 93.3/93.8 (FF/FT) topping out at 96.2, he hit 95+ 7 times out of 47 fastballs. In the start before that he was at 94.4/93.7 topping out 96.3 hitting 95+ 21 times out of 67 fastballs. Here's his velocity chart from fangraphs: wow. that paints a pretty obvious picture there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulstar Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 Good trade for both teams. Jimenez is cost friendly and at worst a solid no. 3 with Cy Young potential. Gave up two really good pitching prospects, but prospects living up to their hype is at best 50/50. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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