Home s*** Home

[BigSqwert]

Am I seriously the only person who thinks this means nothing and is just randomization?

 

No. Most people would agree with you.

[southsider2k5]

No, I explained the distinction I was making later on in the thread...you and he apparently aren't understanding that distinction, even though it is spelled-out very simply.

 

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink...

 

By repeating it as many times as he felt necesary, I think that is exactly Ptatc's point.

[iamshack]

Am I seriously the only person who thinks this means nothing and is just randomization?

No, I think the majority of the people posting in this thread agree with that.

 

I think the statistical evidence for it lies with Quentin. Why he hits so poorly at home this year, probably just random.

[ptatc]

If he wants others to show up to watch in my building he's going to have to buy the beer.

 

This is getting better and better...

 

Only if we get to throw it at you.

[iamshack]

By repeating it as many times as he felt necesary, I think that is exactly Ptatc's point.

Dude, I have tried to be polite with you here, but you are just being incredibly f***ing obtuse.

 

MANY people in this thread have conceded that some players may be affected by the increased pressure to perform at home and the obvious human preference to not receive negative treatment.

 

NOT ONE other than yourself has made the argument that this is a material or significant cause for the large disparity in record between home and road games.

 

Your premise is f***ing stupid. Get over it already.

[ptatc]

No. Most people would agree with you.

 

And most are wrong. Working at a university I find that to be the case most often. Most people take a little bit of information and perceive it to mean whatever they want. Instead of getting all of the information and allowing everything to form a a more inclusive picture.

 

[BigSqwert]

And most are wrong. Working at a university I find that to be the case most often. Most people take a little bit of information and perceive it to mean whatever they want. Instead of getting all of the information and allowing everything to form a a more inclusive picture.

 

The problem is you really have no quantifiable information to prove anything. Hanging out in the locker room does not prove a thing.

[southsider2k5]

I'm not saying all, but judging by the splits, you have to wonder if it is contributing, especially because it has gotten worse as people have stayed away, and those who have come have gotten more aggressive in their dissent.

 

 

Dude, I have tried to be polite with you here, but you are just being incredibly f***ing obtuse.

 

MANY people in this thread have conceded that some players may be affected by the increased pressure to perform at home and the obvious human preference to not receive negative treatment.

 

NOT ONE other than yourself has made the argument that this is a material or significant cause for the large disparity in record between home and road games.

 

Your premise is f***ing stupid. Get over it already.

 

I guess reading really is fundamental.

[southsider2k5]

The problem is you really have no quantifiable information to prove anything. Hanging out in the locker room does not prove a thing.

 

It is better than just pulling something out of your ass.

[BigSqwert]

It is better than just pulling something out of your ass.

Actually it isn't. I have provided several facts that disprove this idiotic theory of yours.

[iamshack]

I guess reading really is fundamental.

See posts 12 and 13, where you admitted that was your premise.

[southsider2k5]

Actually it isn't. I have provided several facts that disprove this idiotic theory of yours.

 

Apparently actual player reactions isn't a fact?

[southsider2k5]

See posts 12 and 13, where you admitted that was your premise.

 

That's what you got out of those two posts? Seriously, you need to work on the reading comp.

[iamshack]

And most are wrong. Working at a university I find that to be the case most often. Most people take a little bit of information and perceive it to mean whatever they want. Instead of getting all of the information and allowing everything to form a a more inclusive picture.

I would have sworn we've covered this already in today's class.

 

There is little to no statistical evidence to prove what you're arguing, which isn't surprising, because as someone else has pointed out, it is most likely only noise statistically.

 

In fact, the players who show the largest disparity between home and road are those who don't get negative treatment at home at all.

 

Finally, the player you swear revels in negative treatment, because "he talks about it alot," AJ, is by far a better player at home this season than on the road.

 

 

[BigSqwert]

Apparently actual player reactions isn't a fact?

 

No. What the hell does that even mean? Did ptac talk to each player individually and interview them? What are the quantifiable results of these interviews? Why are the pitchers performing worse when they aren't being booed? Carlos isn't being booed so why are his numbers worse? Why is Rios playing better at home even though he's getting booed? Why is AJ playing better at home while getting booed on the road? Explain the s***ty home record before June when no one was getting booed.

Edited August 8, 2011 by BigSqwert

[iamshack]

That's what you got out of those two posts? Seriously, you need to work on the reading comp.

What the hell else could one get out of them?

 

In one post, Sqwert asserts that it is your premise that the disparity in records is due to the booing from the fans. In the next post, your own, you then say the following:

 

Why? You don't think you would do better at work in a hostile environment, do you?

 

Hmm, that sure seems like someone who is defending their own premise to me...

 

You then go on to debate this with Sqwert over the course of the next several posts...

 

Now tell me, if this was not your premise, why the hell did you make such an effort to defend it?

[southsider2k5]

No. What the hell does that even mean? Did ptac talk to each player individually and interview them? What are the quantifiable results of these interviews? Why are the pitchers performing worse when they aren't being booed? Carlos isn't being booed so why are his numbers worse? Why is Rios playing better at home even though he's getting booed? Why is AJ playing better at home while getting booed on the road? Explain the s***ty home record before June when no one was getting booed.

 

I see. What players think the effect is, apparently doesn't actually matter. That makes sense, because baseball is played on OOTP instead of the field somewhere.

[greg775]

I hate to say this, but playing lousy at home is the sign of a bad team.

Until the Sox prove otherwise, the Sox are a bad team.

 

 

[southsider2k5]

What the hell else could one get out of them?

 

In one post, Sqwert asserts that it is your premise that the disparity in records is due to the booing from the fans. In the next post, your own, you then say the following:

 

 

 

Hmm, that sure seems like someone who is defending their own premise to me...

 

You then go on to debate this with Sqwert over the course of the next several posts...

 

Now tell me, if this was not your premise, why the hell did you make such an effort to defend it?

 

Which in my very post before that I said wasn't totally responsible. Geesh speaking of intentionally obtuse.

[BigSqwert]

I see. What players think the effect is, apparently doesn't actually matter. That makes sense, because baseball is played on OOTP instead of the field somewhere.

 

Show me some evidence that the entire team was asked how the fan reactions affect their play at home. Heck, show me 2 or 3 players' reactions.

[ptatc]

The problem is you really have no quantifiable information to prove anything. Hanging out in the locker room does not prove a thing.

 

When players hang their head and are dejected by the way the fans treat them, it effects them. Human behaviour is rarely quantifiable and if you think it can be your wrong. No I don't have numbers to prove that behaviour can change numbers. But you can see by a player's body language if he is confident and ready or unfocused and not ready. You cannot judge everything by number. Not everything is a quantitative study when it comes to people most studies are qualitative in nature. This is because people cannot be reduced to numbers.

 

The players aren't open about this in the locker room where it can be heard and disseminated by reporters or many others there. However, in the training room where no one else is allowed they will talk about it and let loose. I did more than hang out in a locker room I worked with these guys for hours everyday and got to know them quite well. They would tell us stuff they wouldn't even tell the coaches.

 

Believe what your numbers say but player performance is influenced by fans reactions.

[southsider2k5]

Show me some evidence that the entire team was asked how the fan reactions affect their play at home. Heck, show me 2 or 3 players' reactions.

 

Ptatc has tried multiple times to do just that. Everyone just seems to ignore it.

[BigSqwert]

Ptatc has tried multiple times to do just that. Everyone just seems to ignore it.

 

Everything sounded extremely anecdotal as far as I gathered. he didn't say how many or who he actually talked to and what specifically was discussed. How you turned that into "fans booing is the reason we suck at home" is beyond me.

[southsider2k5]

Everything sounded extremely anecdotal as far as I gathered. he didn't say how many or who he actually talked to and what specifically was discussed. How you turned that into "fans booing is the reason we suck at home" is beyond me.

 

I'm not quite sure how you did either, because I never said that.

[ptatc]

I would have sworn we've covered this already in today's class.

 

There is little to no statistical evidence to prove what you're arguing, which isn't surprising, because as someone else has pointed out, it is most likely only noise statistically.

 

In fact, the players who show the largest disparity between home and road are those who don't get negative treatment at home at all.

 

Finally, the player you swear revels in negative treatment, because "he talks about it alot," AJ, is by far a better player at home this season than on the road.

 

another factor you may be missing is the press. Fans aren't the only ones telling them how bad they are. It's in every paper, it's on the news, it's on the colbert report. Do you think that magically the player forgets everything when they are on the road. Geography makes them forget how they were treated yesterday. This is only about home and road. Human behaviour is not tied to timeframes either. I never said that is was only home or only away just that players talk about it and are effected by it.

 

I know you don't agree but people are influenced by the reaction of others around them.