Paulie4Pres Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 I'd say they are likely in first place, regardless of their inconsistency. He has been a black hole in this lineup all season long. The worst every day hitter in the Major Leagues, and it isn't even close. You put just an AVERAGE guy at DH this season, and the Sox likely have 5-6 more wins, if not more. Hell, you put Lilli at 1B, move PK to DH, and this team is likely running away with first in the Central... Is there any doubt about that? Really, I think Dunn has been THAT negative of an impact to the Sox this season. Only the White Sox would trot a guy out every day that is batting .165. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 But you can always play this game. Last year it was Kotsay/Jones instead of Thome. This year, it's Dunn over Victor Martinez. Or not having a 5th starter in 2003. Imagine they didn't have Humber, Santos and Konerko played more like you would expect someone his age (say, Vladimir Guerrero) to play? We'd be 20 games under .500, possibly below the Royals with this offense, even with a replacement level DH. Beckham, Rios, Pierre for the first 2 1/2 months, Morel....there have beeen a LOT more issues, Dunn is just the most convenient target. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 I do think if they would have moved Dunn out of the clean up spot or 3 hole sooner, even if they kept him in the line up, they would probably have at least a couple more victories. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 I'm sure the argument will be that they should have replaced Dunn when Viciedo was hot (at least against LHP) and then rotating in with the outfielders as well....and brought up DeAza to light a fire under Rios much earlier...then the season could/would have been saved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bighurt52235 Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 Why is this topic continuously brought up? I feel like we all know the situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maggsmaggs Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 QUOTE (Bighurt52235 @ Aug 12, 2011 -> 06:04 AM) Why is this topic continuously brought up? I feel like we all know the situation. It is ubiquitous on this board, but it's brought up because Ozzie's arrogance and stubbornness of playing him in the lineup every game will likely cost us the division. While he still needs some PT, he never should start against a lefty and should never be batting third or fourth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 Hollywood's track record of acquiring big names who contribute is spotty at best. Wonder who scouted Dunn last year? There were warning signs the second half. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Aug 12, 2011 -> 07:30 AM) Hollywood's track record of acquiring big names who contribute is spotty at best. Wonder who scouted Dunn last year? There were warning signs the second half. "Hollywood" Guillen isn't exactly helping the situation either by refusing to do something with Dunn. He has been Ozzie's responsibility for 117 games now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 12, 2011 -> 07:35 AM) "Hollywood" Guillen isn't exactly helping the situation either by refusing to do something with Dunn. He has been Ozzie's responsibility for 117 games now. What's he going to do with him. Hollywood said the contracts are "his problem, not Ozzie's or Jerry's." Very big of Hollywood, but what he neglected to say was that those contracts remain on Ozzie's 25-man roster and Jerry is obligated to pay them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Aug 12, 2011 -> 07:42 AM) What's he going to do with him. Hollywood said the contracts are "his problem, not Ozzie's or Jerry's." Very big of Hollywood, but what he neglected to say was that those contracts remain on Ozzie's 25-man roster and Jerry is obligated to pay them. Yes, but see, there is no law he hit in the #3 spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 Judging from recent lineups, I'm hoping Ozzie will be smart enough to bench Dunn on Friday & Sunday vs. the LHP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Aug 12, 2011 -> 07:43 AM) Yes, but see, there is no law he hit in the #3 spot. 3 spot or 7 spot hardly makes a difference. Edited August 12, 2011 by Marty34 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Aug 12, 2011 -> 07:42 AM) What's he going to do with him. Hollywood said the contracts are "his problem, not Ozzie's or Jerry's." Very big of Hollywood, but what he neglected to say was that those contracts remain on Ozzie's 25-man roster and Jerry is obligated to pay them. Hollywood Guillen also makes the f***ing line ups. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donny Lucy's Avocado Farm Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Aug 12, 2011 -> 08:32 AM) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RME JICO Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 I guess it is because just how bad Dunn has been this season. He is literally the worst hitter in the league, and it is not even close. According to BP, he is dead last in VORP and BWARP and Rios is not that far ahead. The worst part is they are the only terrible batters with over 400 PA's. Dunn's (-16.9) is the worst VORP in the last decade. Looking at this is pretty funny, #844 out of 844: http://www.baseballprospectus.com/sortable...php?cid=1012588 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard Zelig Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Aug 12, 2011 -> 07:30 AM) Hollywood's track record of acquiring big names who contribute is spotty at best. Wonder who scouted Dunn last year? There were warning signs the second half. What were the warning signs? He hit 21 HRs in the second half of the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 QUOTE (Leonard Zelig @ Aug 12, 2011 -> 08:45 AM) What were the warning signs? He hit 21 HRs in the second half of the season. marty was warned retroactively with 20/20 goggles that were provided to him from future kenny williams. present kenny williams has not invented them yet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Marty34 @ Aug 12, 2011 -> 07:42 AM) What's he going to do with him. Hollywood said the contracts are "his problem, not Ozzie's or Jerry's." Very big of Hollywood, but what he neglected to say was that those contracts remain on Ozzie's 25-man roster and Jerry is obligated to pay them. Pay not play, thats Ozzie Einstein's call putting him in the 4 spot. Finally he moves him down and the team starts scoring some runs. Go figure. Its a very telling sign of where Adam Dunn's head is at when he runs harder to first base after drawing a walk, than he does when he hits a grounder to the second baseman playing in short RF. Edited August 12, 2011 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiguy79 Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 We would also be in first if Pierre could catch fly balls and Thornton was ready to pitch in April. If we are going to make a run, Dunn should not be in the lineup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 Oh great, does Dunn now become the lone scapegoat for this season, thus allowing the team to make no changes because "all they need is for him to hit closer to his normal numbers next year"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JorgeFabregas Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 QUOTE (RME JICO @ Aug 12, 2011 -> 08:42 AM) I guess it is because just how bad Dunn has been this season. He is literally the worst hitter in the league, and it is not even close. According to BP, he is dead last in VORP and BWARP and Rios is not that far ahead. The worst part is they are the only terrible batters with over 400 PA's. Dunn's (-16.9) is the worst VORP in the last decade. Looking at this is pretty funny, #844 out of 844: http://www.baseballprospectus.com/sortable...php?cid=1012588 Worst player, not worst hitter. He's getting dinged in the "replacement player" stats because he's a DH and DHs are supposed to hit. The worst wOBA in the league? That's Alex Rios. Doh! Worst wRC+ plus is also Rios by a long stretch. I was also using a minimum of 400 PAs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulie4Pres Posted August 12, 2011 Author Share Posted August 12, 2011 I have never seen an every day DH bat ~.160 over the course of an entire season. It blows my mind he is still in the lineup pretty much every day. Do people realize how bad you have to be, to bat .161? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (chiguy79 @ Aug 12, 2011 -> 02:40 PM) We would also be in first if Pierre could catch fly balls and Thornton was ready to pitch in April. If we are going to make a run, Dunn should not be in the lineup. QUOTE (Paulie4Pres @ Aug 12, 2011 -> 06:09 PM) I have never seen an every day DH bat ~.160 over the course of an entire season. It blows my mind he is still in the lineup pretty much every day. Do people realize how bad you have to be, to bat .161? 1.) How many games did Juan cost us? I love how this has become a commonly accepted belief on here that somehow Juan Pierre has cost us as much as Dunn/Rios, etc. Bulls***. AJ and Juan have had surprisingly good seasons and both get no love. 2.) Yes we do. We know how bad Adam has been, how historically bad. Edited August 12, 2011 by greg775 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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