harfman77 Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 I really don't get all the love that is thrown on Rick Hahn? Is he not part of the front office that has this organization in shambles? Will he magically convince JR to start paying +slot money to build talent in the farm system? Does he have some connections in Latin America that will help the Sox starting acquiring some international talent? What makes him any different than his current boss? I am asking out of curiosity as many on this board seem to think he is the answer going forward. I would much rather have a guy that has experience in player development rather than a former agent who is good at negotiating contracts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 I'd call it back up quarterback syndrome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chetkincaid Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 17, 2011 -> 03:27 PM) I'd call it back up quarterback syndrome. Survey SAYS: DINGDINGDINGDINGDING!!!!!! That's exactly what it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Aug 17, 2011 -> 02:26 PM) I really don't get all the love that is thrown on Rick Hahn? Is he not part of the front office that has this organization in shambles? Will he magically convince JR to start paying +slot money to build talent in the farm system? Does he have some connections in Latin America that will help the Sox starting acquiring some international talent? What makes him any different than his current boss? I am asking out of curiosity as many on this board seem to think he is the answer going forward. I would much rather have a guy that has experience in player development rather than a former agent who is good at negotiating contracts. That is how I feel as well...as the pool of eligible candidates to fulfill the latter criteria is much larger than the pool of eligible candidates to fulfill the former. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 QUOTE (iamshack @ Aug 17, 2011 -> 03:32 PM) That is how I feel as well...as the pool of eligible candidates to fulfill the latter criteria is much larger than the pool of eligible candidates to fulfill the former. I haven't met the guy, and I don't think anybody else here has, so it's hard to really get a good gauge on him. But there are a vast number of people around that league that give him a ton of respect and there is a general opinion that he is very smart. Now the biggest question is, can he transfer that ability to being baseball smart, kind of like Jon Daniels. And a shakeup in organizational philosophy could do wonders if done right. Just like a company, if a new CEO is brought in he may not have the biggest connections around, but if he knows how to get the right people into the right spots then that's his real job. Hahn or any GM wouldn't be scouting the players, that's micromanaging, he may do so occasionally (like first round picks) but it is/would be mostly up to the scouts and people that he chooses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodAsGould Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Wasn't Dave Wilder supposedly a hot commodity too, It just seems whoever is 2nd in command for the Wsox is next in line to get a gm job somewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco72 Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 On one hand, it appears that Hahn is well respected within and outside the White Sox organization. However, there is a long-standing view in management theory that real change only comes from changing the GM. Therefore, it really depends on what the Sox want to do. Hiring an internal candidate will only lead to incremental change, at best, not the radical change that some SoxTalkers desperately want. I think a Hahn-as-GM could work, if done properly. He'd have to have the ability to make some changes (e.g., the field manager and drafting) while continuing to do the things that the organization does correctly (e.g., the pre-Rios and Peavy financial decisions, a focus on good pitching). We really don't know his true philosophy for running an organization nor how much freedom he would have to implement changes, so even if he's the best-GM-in-the-world, he could be unable to implement his ideas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Hahn's supposed to be one of the best negotiators in all of baseball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHITESOXRANDY Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 (edited) Hahn's supposed to be one of the best negotiators in all of baseball. But, does he have any sons that made their high school teams so that the Sox can draft them real high ? Edited August 17, 2011 by WHITESOXRANDY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Aug 17, 2011 -> 02:51 PM) I haven't met the guy, and I don't think anybody else here has, so it's hard to really get a good gauge on him. But there are a vast number of people around that league that give him a ton of respect and there is a general opinion that he is very smart. Now the biggest question is, can he transfer that ability to being baseball smart, kind of like Jon Daniels. And a shakeup in organizational philosophy could do wonders if done right. Just like a company, if a new CEO is brought in he may not have the biggest connections around, but if he knows how to get the right people into the right spots then that's his real job. Hahn or any GM wouldn't be scouting the players, that's micromanaging, he may do so occasionally (like first round picks) but it is/would be mostly up to the scouts and people that he chooses. It doesn't seem like Jon Daniels really got on the right track until Nolan Ryan came in though...it could just be a coincidence, but there does seem to be a correlation there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 QUOTE (iamshack @ Aug 17, 2011 -> 04:22 PM) It doesn't seem like Jon Daniels really got on the right track until Nolan Ryan came in though...it could just be a coincidence, but there does seem to be a correlation there. That's why I said getting the right people into place. Maybe he lucked into it, but just like with any business, a CEO can only do so much by themselves, it's really the choices they make in how/who they surround themselves with and how well they listen to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsidepride15 Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 QUOTE (WHITESOXRANDY @ Aug 17, 2011 -> 04:08 PM) But, does he have any sons that made their high school teams so that the Sox can draft them real high ? Easy on KW Jr. LOL I remember he played for the Ju-Co WS Champions (where I went to JC) with Jerry Manuel's son....they hooked me up with tickets in the Wives Section (I didn't know that's why there was a ton of hot chicks around me....Singleton's wife was the best) tickets and I proceeded to get drunk and swear a lot at Manuel for misusing the bullpen. Mrs. Manuel was seated 2 rows down directly in front of me....luckily she was understanding and I got to stay in my seat for the duration. We lost the game and I cursed Jerry's name all I wanted on the way down the ramps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 QUOTE (southsidepride15 @ Aug 17, 2011 -> 04:29 PM) Easy on KW Jr. LOL I remember he played for the Ju-Co WS Champions (where I went to JC) with Jerry Manuel's son....they hooked me up with tickets in the Wives Section (I didn't know that's why there was a ton of hot chicks around me....Singleton's wife was the best) tickets and I proceeded to get drunk and swear a lot at Manuel for misusing the bullpen. Mrs. Manuel was seated 2 rows down directly in front of me....luckily she was understanding and I got to stay in my seat for the duration. We lost the game and I cursed Jerry's name all I wanted on the way down the ramps Jerry Manuel's son gets you tickets and you act like that. That's classy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Every great GM has started off as an unknown quantity, just with different backgrounds and levels of experience. Hahn may not have a scouting or player development background, but he's got 11 years experience in a major league front office. Furthermore, he's incredibly intelligent with graduate degrees from both Harvard Law and Kellogg. He's got the business background that's becoming more common with new GM hires, and let's be honest, those guys have been doing a tremendous job so far. On top of that, he's a tremendous negotiator, which is a great skill to have in the current baseball environment. Beyond his resume, he's been rated as a top two GM candidate by Baseball America two years in a row. Those rankings are based on feedback from executives around the league. Plus he's been asked to interview for several GM openings in the past few years. I can't recall which positions, maybe the Pirates and Mets, but I do know the guy has turned some interviews down. So not only do other organizations value him, he must think pretty highly of himself to pass on available opportunities when there are only 30 positions in total. There's obviously a lot of risk in hiring Hahn, but not any more than hiring any other rookie GM candidate. Surround him with the right baseball people and I think he could build a quality organization. Unfortunately for us, we might have to make a decision on him this off-season, since I have a feeling the Cubs will be calling and that's one of the few jobs he's probably holding out for. So if we do make the playoffs, JR may have to make a tough decision between Hahn and KW. It's never easy going with an unknown quantity at the GM position while trying to compete, but other organizations have done so recently and successfully. If Reinsdorf thinks as highly of Hahn as those around the league do, then he very well could knock KW out of the GM position in the off-season even if we make the playoffs this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 1. Rick Hahn, Assistant GM, Chicago White Sox First: Sports agent, Steinberg Moorad & Dunn School: Michigan, Harvard Law, Kellogg MBA. Baseball: High school Strength: Contract negotiation Weakness: Scouting Quote: "[being included] certainly is a compliment, and I do appreciate being included on these lists. But, frankly, it's not the same as the organization being cited for having one of top on-field prospects. In fact, if there was a way to trade me for Mike Trout, I'm guessing Kenny would drive me to the airport to make sure that deal goes through -- and I would understand." The one problem with Hahn is that he might be too good at his job. The Chicagoland native has become such an integral part of the White Sox front office that it will take the perfect offer to get him to move. Many inside baseball think that Hahn's best opportunity will be to take over from Kenny Williams, though there's no indication that's going to happen soon. Hahn has interviewed for jobs in the past, but has seldom pushed for a job, furthering the thought that he's "too comfortable." Some AGM's like Hahn, David Forst in Oakland, or Chris Antonetti in Cleveland had enough autonomy and enough of a voice before moving up that moving to some jobs would be lateral. Many expected Hahn to be a stronger candidate for the Padres job a couple years ago due to his longtime connections to Padres owner Jeff Moorad, but some think it's that very association that held him back. Hahn's name is at the top of any list an owner will put together this offseason. Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writ...l#ixzz1VLSfiqv2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 I've had the argument against Hahn for the contracts of Teahen and Dunn amongst others with my guy on 35th. My guy insists he that takes his marching orders from Hollywood, which are sign these guys at the best possible price within reason. He said the team on the field is not a reflection of Rick Hahn. As I've mentioned before, he refers to Hahn as being brilliant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 QUOTE (fathom @ Aug 17, 2011 -> 04:02 PM) Hahn's supposed to be one of the best negotiators in all of baseball. He is also a very big saber guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolishPrince34 Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 QUOTE (WHITESOXRANDY @ Aug 17, 2011 -> 04:08 PM) But, does he have any sons that made their high school teams so that the Sox can draft them real high ? He did a great job negotiating with Teahen and Dunn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 QUOTE (fathom @ Aug 17, 2011 -> 04:02 PM) Hahn's supposed to be one of the best negotiators in all of baseball. Mark Teahen's and Adam Dunn's agents concur. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Aug 17, 2011 -> 11:23 PM) I've had the argument against Hahn for the contracts of Teahen and Dunn amongst others with my guy on 35th. My guy insists he that takes his marching orders from Hollywood, which are sign these guys at the best possible price within reason. He said the team on the field is not a reflection of Rick Hahn. As I've mentioned before, he refers to Hahn as being brilliant. He takes his marching order from Kenny Williams, you know, his boss? If your boss tells you to negotiate a deal, that's what you do. I'm not sure what Ozzie has to do with this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Jeez I hate that argument. If your boss says go sign someone you do it, you may give a bit of your opinion first but if he still insists to get the job done then you have to. If Kenny told him to get Teahen at 3 years at a starting 3B salary, then Hahn did a decent job (though hindsight crushes it, and many never thought he would be a starter). And Dunn's contract was market value, the number of years wasn't ridiculous, and the salary wasn't overcumbersome. The main problem with these deals is that they players arent/werent producing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 18, 2011 -> 07:55 AM) He takes his marching order from Kenny Williams, you know, his boss? If your boss tells you to negotiate a deal, that's what you do. I'm not sure what Ozzie has to do with this. I see what you did there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Aug 18, 2011 -> 07:56 AM) And Dunn's contract was market value, the number of years wasn't ridiculous, and the salary wasn't overcumbersome. The main problem with these deals is that they players arent/werent producing. I find it hilarious people say that it was awful now, as if they knew he was going to have one of the worst seasons in MLB history after he signed it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Aug 18, 2011 -> 07:56 AM) Jeez I hate that argument. If your boss says go sign someone you do it, you may give a bit of your opinion first but if he still insists to get the job done then you have to. If Kenny told him to get Teahen at 3 years at a starting 3B salary, then Hahn did a decent job (though hindsight crushes it, and many never thought he would be a starter). And Dunn's contract was market value, the number of years wasn't ridiculous, and the salary wasn't overcumbersome. The main problem with these deals is that they players arent/werent producing. Plus it isn't even like the Sox were the only ones after Dunn. Washington was trying to get him back on a similar salary, but for a three year deal. Detroit really wanted him, but he wasn't interested. Knowing the Tigers they would have spend at least what we did too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 QUOTE (SoxAce @ Aug 18, 2011 -> 08:03 AM) I find it hilarious people say that it was awful now, as if they knew he was going to have one of the worst seasons in MLB history after he signed it. Exactly, even if we overpaid by a million or two per year, that's really not that much and pretty much expected to attract top FAs to the White Sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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