... it's about time

[jenksycat]

I'm sick of reading the blame going to Ozzie for those two players' pathetic performances. For me it grows as old as Ozzie praise to you.

I will shed no tears nor will I be mad if Ozzie goes to Florida. I just comment when I think he's getting an unfair rap.

 

I find it amazing people think he should have benched Rios and Dunn months ago.

 

I honestly don't see what you're missing. Not a single person here defends Dunn, Rios, or KW. The thing is, time travel doesn't yet exist to my knowledge, so as of April 1, 2011, for the 2011 season, Ozzie has been in charge of putting the best team on the field.

 

Still with me there?

 

On July 27th, a perfectly capable replacement for Rios was called up. We were 3.5 back. KW stated players will not play based on salary (whether you believe that or not means NOTHING). From that point on, there was absolutely no excuse for Ozzie to play Rios. None.

 

Still there?

 

Your blind love of Ozzie is partly due to his "firey, crazy, speak the truth" personality, correct? So if he was told, publicly, that he is not to play people based on salary, then I guess by your logic he was then told privately that he is to keep playing them "or else"...why wouldn't he say something?

 

 

So if you still back Ozzie, then you also have to believe in one of these 3 scenarios:

 

A) Ozzie cannot read and/or write any longer, and has simply been making spelling errors since late July on the lineup cards.

 

B) Immediately after announcing playing time does not relate to salary, Ozzie was told that was just for show and he damn well better keep playing sub-.200 hitters in the middle of division race or he's in big, big trouble.

 

C) Ozzie and his "loose cannon, gotta love him attitude" has been playing Dunn and Rios to spite KW for making those moves to the detriment of the team and sabotaged the season

 

Those are the only possibilities, so which one is it?

 

And just to cover all bases, if you're in the stupid "De Aza/Vicedo vs Rios/Dunn wouldn't have mattered anyway" camp....wouldn't you have at least wanted to f***ing find out for yourself? If you don't think replacing the 2 literal worst players in baseball with ANYONE else wouldn't have made a difference when we were 3.5 back, I'd like .5 lb's of whatever you're smoking.

 

 

 

 

 

[greg775]

I honestly don't see what you're missing. Not a single person here defends Dunn, Rios, or KW. The thing is, time travel doesn't yet exist to my knowledge, so as of April 1, 2011, for the 2011 season, Ozzie has been in charge of putting the best team on the field.

 

Still with me there?

 

On July 27th, a perfectly capable replacement for Rios was called up. We were 3.5 back. KW stated players will not play based on salary (whether you believe that or not means NOTHING). From that point on, there was absolutely no excuse for Ozzie to play Rios. None.

 

Still there?

 

Your blind love of Ozzie is partly due to his "firey, crazy, speak the truth" personality, correct? So if he was told, publicly, that he is not to play people based on salary, then I guess by your logic he was then told privately that he is to keep playing them "or else"...why wouldn't he say something?

 

 

So if you still back Ozzie, then you also have to believe in one of these 3 scenarios:

 

A) Ozzie cannot read and/or write any longer, and has simply been making spelling errors since late July on the lineup cards.

 

B) Immediately after announcing playing time does not relate to salary, Ozzie was told that was just for show and he damn well better keep playing sub-.200 hitters in the middle of division race or he's in big, big trouble.

 

C) Ozzie and his "loose cannon, gotta love him attitude" has been playing Dunn and Rios to spite KW for making those moves to the detriment of the team and sabotaged the season

 

Those are the only possibilities, so which one is it?

 

And just to cover all bases, if you're in the stupid "De Aza/Vicedo vs Rios/Dunn wouldn't have mattered anyway" camp....wouldn't you have at least wanted to f***ing find out for yourself? If you don't think replacing the 2 literal worst players in baseball with ANYONE else wouldn't have made a difference when we were 3.5 back, I'd like .5 lb's of whatever you're smoking.

 

I definitely can respect your guys' opinion on Ozzie not playing the best players. I agree DeAza/Tank are much better options than Rios/Dunn. I'd go with answer B, but not as forcefully stated as you put it. More like KW just said that, when both he, Ozzie and Jerry know you DO play the guys who make that kind of jack.

[Quin]

I honestly don't see what you're missing. Not a single person here defends Dunn, Rios, or KW. The thing is, time travel doesn't yet exist to my knowledge, so as of April 1, 2011, for the 2011 season, Ozzie has been in charge of putting the best team on the field.

 

Still with me there?

 

On July 27th, a perfectly capable replacement for Rios was called up. We were 3.5 back. KW stated players will not play based on salary (whether you believe that or not means NOTHING). From that point on, there was absolutely no excuse for Ozzie to play Rios. None.

 

Still there?

 

Your blind love of Ozzie is partly due to his "firey, crazy, speak the truth" personality, correct? So if he was told, publicly, that he is not to play people based on salary, then I guess by your logic he was then told privately that he is to keep playing them "or else"...why wouldn't he say something?

 

 

So if you still back Ozzie, then you also have to believe in one of these 3 scenarios:

 

A) Ozzie cannot read and/or write any longer, and has simply been making spelling errors since late July on the lineup cards.

 

B) Immediately after announcing playing time does not relate to salary, Ozzie was told that was just for show and he damn well better keep playing sub-.200 hitters in the middle of division race or he's in big, big trouble.

 

C) Ozzie and his "loose cannon, gotta love him attitude" has been playing Dunn and Rios to spite KW for making those moves to the detriment of the team and sabotaged the season

 

Those are the only possibilities, so which one is it?

 

And just to cover all bases, if you're in the stupid "De Aza/Vicedo vs Rios/Dunn wouldn't have mattered anyway" camp....wouldn't you have at least wanted to f***ing find out for yourself? If you don't think replacing the 2 literal worst players in baseball with ANYONE else wouldn't have made a difference when we were 3.5 back, I'd like .5 lb's of whatever you're smoking.

 

 

[Jordan4life_2007]

I definitely can respect your guys' opinion on Ozzie not playing the best players. I agree DeAza/Tank are much better options than Rios/Dunn. I'd go with answer B, but not as forcefully stated as you put it. More like KW just said that, when both he, Ozzie and Jerry know you DO play the guys who make that kind of jack.

 

You still don't get it and probably never will. By your logic, a manager is just supposed to run the highest paid players out there day after day, week after week, month after month and just sit back and watch. Who cares if it's blatantly obvious that said player(s) is sabotaging the season and severely hindering the primary objective - GET TO THE PLAYOFFS! Did Bruce Bochy say to himself, "You know what. Barry Zito is the highest paid player on the team. Sure, he f***ing sucks. But god damnit. I'm gonna make him my game 3 starter because he makes a ton of coin." Of course not. Because Bruce's job is to WIN BASEBALL GAMES. Not play guys that suck over and over and over again because of their salary.

Edited September 14, 2011 by Jordan4life

[TheBigHurt]

I'm sick of reading the blame going to Ozzie for those two players' pathetic performances. For me it grows as old as Ozzie praise to you.

I will shed no tears nor will I be mad if Ozzie goes to Florida. I just comment when I think he's getting an unfair rap.

 

I find it amazing people think he should have benched Rios and Dunn months ago.

 

Is it really that amazing? HOW MANY "months" do you mean? It's an important question because Dunn and Rios have never taken off during this ENTIRE SEASON which is now almost over. How long do they have to suck ROYALLY before it would make sense to you to bench them for guys like Viciedo/De Aza? Or just to bench them PERIOD?

[jenksycat]

You still don't get it and probably never will. By your logic, a manager is just supposed to run the highest paid players out there day after day, week after week, month after month and just sit back and watch. Who cares if it's blatantly obvious that said player(s) is sabotaging the season and severely hindering the primary objective - GET TO THE PLAYOFFS! Did Bruce Bochy say to himself, "You know what. Barry Zito is the highest paid player on the team. Sure, he f***ing sucks. But god damnit. I'm gonna make him by game 3 starter because he makes a ton of coin." Of course not. Because Bruce's job is to WIN BASEBALL GAMES. Not play guys that suck over and over and over again because of their salary.

 

Apparently the Sox operate some bizarro franchise.

 

Rowand and Tejada DFA'd from the same team on the same day, Andruw Jones bought out, Chone Figgins benched, Manny Ramirez given away 2x, Rios given away, Gary Mathews JR benched, Zito benched, and on and on and on....except for the White Sox, who base their playing time on salary and salary only I guess.

 

Ridiculous of course, but only if you don't have an irrational love for a manager who doesn't have a single thing going for him that you can defend anymore.

[greg775]

I read the last few responses and enjoyed reading them. I'll resist typing in more stuff cause I'm sure you don't want to hear my rebuttals on this topic any more tonight.

[Jordan4life_2007]

Apparently the Sox operate some bizarro franchise.

 

Rowand and Tejada DFA'd from the same team on the same day, Andruw Jones bought out, Chone Figgins benched, Manny Ramirez given away 2x, Rios given away, Gary Mathews JR benched, Zito benched, and on and on and on....except for the White Sox, who base their playing time on salary and salary only I guess.

 

Ridiculous of course, but only if you don't have an irrational love for a manager who doesn't have a single thing going for him that you can defend anymore.

 

I truly believe Ozzie rather lose 'his' way than win another way. I wouldn't trade '05 for anything. But it's truly hurt us in the long-run. Ozzie thinks he's god's gift to the game of baseball and beyond reprieve because of that one season.

[Jordan4life_2007]

I read the last few responses and enjoyed reading them. I'll resist typing in more stuff cause I'm sure you don't want to hear my rebuttals on this topic any more tonight.

 

Why hold back now? So I ask you - why did Bruce Bochy not play Barry Zito and Aaron Rowand down the stretch and in the postseason last year despite being the two highest paid players on the team?

[jenksycat]

I read the last few responses and enjoyed reading them. I'll resist typing in more stuff cause I'm sure you don't want to hear my rebuttals on this topic any more tonight.

 

That's the very reason you do get replies...because you don't back up a single thing you say with anything other than "i love ozzie, this is kw's fault", without ever addressing what a f***ing miserable manager Ozzie has been this year.

[greg775]

Apparently the Sox operate some bizarro franchise.

 

Rowand and Tejada DFA'd from the same team on the same day, Andruw Jones bought out, Chone Figgins benched, Manny Ramirez given away 2x, Rios given away, Gary Mathews JR benched, Zito benched, and on and on and on....except for the White Sox, who base their playing time on salary and salary only I guess.

 

Ridiculous of course, but only if you don't have an irrational love for a manager who doesn't have a single thing going for him that you can defend anymore.

 

 

Why hold back now? So I ask you - why did Bruce Bochy not play Barry Zito and Aaron Rowand down the stretch and in the postseason last year despite being the two highest paid players on the team?

 

Well you guys seem to want my responses so ...

It isn't Ozzie's decision to DFA guys. If KW wanted to DFA Rios and Dunn that would have been fine with me. But he couldn't do that. They make too much money. So guess what? Oz plays them.

I'm not familiar with Zito. Educate me.

I thought he remained a starter through all of his s***tiness.He pitched 192 and 199 innings the past 2 years before this year.

Not pitching him in the postseason is different. You can mess with your postseason rotations and only go with four guys, etc.

 

I will agree it's possible Ozzie continued to play Rios/Dunn to embarrass KW who brought them here. I said both Oz and KW can't complain if they get fired cause they both hate each other and pull s*** like that IMO.

[jenksycat]

Well you guys seem to want my responses so ...

It isn't Ozzie's decision to DFA guys. If KW wanted to DFA Rios and Dunn that would have been fine with me. But he couldn't do that. They make too much money. So guess what? Oz plays them.

I'm not familiar with Zito. Educate me.

I thought he remained a starter through all of his s***tiness.He pitched 192 and 199 innings the past 2 years before this year.

Not pitching him in the postseason is different. You can mess with your postseason rotations and only go with four guys, etc.

 

I will agree it's possible Ozzie continued to play Rios/Dunn to embarrass KW who brought them here. I said both Oz and KW can't complain if they get fired cause they both hate each other and pull s*** like that IMO.

 

But he doesn't have to f***ing play them. That was the entire point of the previous 3 posts. I don't get why that's confusing.

 

Your point was they make too much money to be benched, numerous examples were provided of highly paid players being benched/cut/etc, proving that not to be the case.

 

And now you're contradicting yourself; if you think Ozzie kept playing them to embarrass KW, then he should have been fired weeks ago and never get another job in baseball because that's a f***ing disgrace to the fans and the game.

 

[caulfield12]

Apparently the Sox operate some bizarro franchise.

 

Rowand and Tejada DFA'd from the same team on the same day, Andruw Jones bought out, Chone Figgins benched, Manny Ramirez given away 2x, Rios given away, Gary Mathews JR benched, Zito benched, and on and on and on....except for the White Sox, who base their playing time on salary and salary only I guess.

 

Ridiculous of course, but only if you don't have an irrational love for a manager who doesn't have a single thing going for him that you can defend anymore.

 

 

In all fairness, waiving/releasing either Dunn or Rios at this point would mean eating 2-3X what ANY franchise in MLB has ever done with an individual player....which was Russ Ortiz' deal.

 

But yeah, the Dodgers essentially bought out their entire outfield of Pierre, A. Jones and finally Ramirez.

[jenksycat]

In all fairness, waiving/releasing either Dunn or Rios at this point would mean eating 2-3X what ANY franchise in MLB has ever done with an individual player....which was Russ Ortiz' deal.

 

But yeah, the Dodgers essentially bought out their entire outfield of Pierre, A. Jones and finally Ramirez.

 

I'm not saying DFA them, just pointing out that teams don't actually do what he's saying in regards to the highest salary plays.

 

I'll agree that the highest salary has the job to lose...but the job is not guaranteed. When you have 1 player with the worst season in MLB history and another player not a whole bunch ahead of him going into August, it's safe to bench them at that point.

[Iwritecode]

I definitely can respect your guys' opinion on Ozzie not playing the best players. I agree DeAza/Tank are much better options than Rios/Dunn. I'd go with answer B, but not as forcefully stated as you put it. More like KW just said that, when both he, Ozzie and Jerry know you DO play the guys who make that kind of jack.

 

This has to be an act right? You can't seriously believe this. You're just doing this to get the responses right?

 

Right?

[Milkman delivers]

This has to be an act right? You can't seriously believe this. You're just doing this to get the responses right?

 

Right?

 

He's like the woman who's husband beats the absolute s*** out of regularly, but she will make up any excuse to let him off the hook.

[greg775]

This has to be an act right? You can't seriously believe this. You're just doing this to get the responses right?

 

Right?

 

If you think the new manager is going to sit Rios and Dunn, bless you.

They will play every day.

[Balta1701]

If you think the new manager is going to sit Rios and Dunn, bless you.

They will play every day.

At least to start the year, yeah.

[BigSqwert]

If you think the new manager is going to sit Rios and Dunn, bless you.

They will play every day.

 

Whoever the manager is next year i will guarantee that Rios and Dunn are starters in April. If they continue to have dismal seasons after a couple months, I'd expect the manager to get creative in using those guys less....something Ozzie failed to do until it was way too late this year.

Edited September 14, 2011 by BigSqwert

[greg775]

Whoever the manager is next year i will guarantee that Rios and Dunn are starters in April. If they continue to have dismal seasons after a couple months, I'd expect the manager to get creative in using those guys less....something Ozzie failed to do until it was way too late this year.

 

Or the general manager could do something "creative" and uh, release them.

But the GM gets so little blame for these two compared to Oz (yawn).

[Marty34]

But he doesn't have to f***ing play them. That was the entire point of the previous 3 posts. I don't get why that's confusing.

 

When your highest paid players don't perform you are not winning anything. And by the way, they haven't been playing for regularly for a while now.

 

[BigSqwert]

Or the general manager could do something "creative" and uh, release them.

But the GM gets so little blame for these two compared to Oz (yawn).

 

We had guys on the bench who were hustling and putting up better numbers yet Ozzie not only continued to play Rios and Dunn everyday, he batted them high in the lineup.

[Marty34]

Whoever the manager is next year i will guarantee that Rios and Dunn are starters in April. If they continue to have dismal seasons after a couple months, I'd expect the manager to get creative in using those guys less....something Ozzie failed to do until it was way too late this year.

 

And it still won't make a difference.

[BigSqwert]

And it still won't make a difference.

 

I don't know where your time machine is but I would love to have seen the results of an extra month or 2 of De Aza/Viciedo over Dunn/Rios.

Edited September 14, 2011 by BigSqwert

[Balta1701]

When your highest paid players don't perform you are not winning anything. And by the way, they haven't been playing for regularly for a while now.

Rios plays every day.

 

Didn't the Giants just win the World Series with Zito and Rowand taking in about $29 million and giving them virtually nothing?