Greg Hibbard Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 It's clear that even on Sept 2 that the top nine picks were already locked down by Houston, Baltimore, KC, Minnesota, Seattle, San Diego, Pittsburgh, Oakland and Washington. It wasn't going to be possible for the White Sox to win less games than those teams at that point in the season. Is the difference between the #10 overall pick (our lowest conceivable win total at that point) and the #18 overall pick (our highest conceivable finish is 13th best record) really that significant? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danman31 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Usually no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Greg Hibbard @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 11:03 AM) It's clear that even on Sept 2 that the top nine picks were already locked down by Houston, Baltimore, KC, Minnesota, Seattle, San Diego, Pittsburgh, Oakland and Washington. It wasn't going to be possible for the White Sox to win less games than those teams at that point in the season. Is the difference between the #10 overall pick (our lowest conceivable win total at that point) and the #18 overall pick (our highest conceivable finish is 13th best record) really that significant? No, because Sox will draft the cheapest, safest, easiest signable pick in round 1. Edited September 12, 2011 by Soxfest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Hibbard Posted September 12, 2011 Author Share Posted September 12, 2011 QUOTE (Soxfest @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 11:22 AM) No, because Sox wil draft the cheapest safest pick in round 1. Then why do people want the White Sox to pursue this strategy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 QUOTE (Soxfest @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 05:22 PM) No, because Sox will draft the cheapest, safest, easiest signable pick in round 1. Not true, of late, it seems the first round pick is where the Sox try to get the best overall talent and then work out a unique contract. After the first round...no, it doesn't matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Is there much of a difference between batting Dunn or Rios cleanup? No, not really, but there's still a slightly better chance with one. With the future outlook of this team being quite grim, you have to take every little advantage you can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harfman77 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 11:27 AM) Not true, of late, it seems the first round pick is where the Sox try to get the best overall talent and then work out a unique contract. After the first round...no, it doesn't matter. It depends when we pick, that was the case with Sale when he was promised that he would be on the ML roster by the end of the year. With Poreda, Mitchell and Walker, they didn't have a lot of leverage and were all seen as reaches. Beckham is a case where we picked what was one the better talents on the board and got a contract worked out. The draft pick strategy only really makes a difference if the organization adapts their view to building a farm system and developing minor league talent, which probably wont be the case as long as JR is calling the shots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danman31 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 11:37 AM) It depends when we pick, that was the case with Sale when he was promised that he would be on the ML roster by the end of the year. With Poreda, Mitchell and Walker, they didn't have a lot of leverage and were all seen as reaches. Beckham is a case where we picked what was one the better talents on the board and got a contract worked out. The draft pick strategy only really makes a difference if the organization adapts their view to building a farm system and developing minor league talent, which probably wont be the case as long as JR is calling the shots. Mitchell wasn't considered a reach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Hibbard Posted September 12, 2011 Author Share Posted September 12, 2011 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 11:33 AM) Is there much of a difference between batting Dunn or Rios cleanup? No, not really, but there's still a slightly better chance with one. With the future outlook of this team being quite grim, you have to take every little advantage you can. This is assuming that playing to win the last month of the season has no value going forward. I think it has value in terms of evaluating talent, addressing some issues that have come up this season. For example, playing Rios and Dunn as much as possible might win you more games if they come out of their respective slumps which would cost you draft positioning, but it might also set the Sox up for them to have improved 2012 seasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattZakrowski Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 The picks in the first 15 are protected, so the Sox wouldn't lose them if they signed a type-A free agent, not that I see the Sox doing that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 11:27 AM) Not true, of late, it seems the first round pick is where the Sox try to get the best overall talent and then work out a unique contract. After the first round...no, it doesn't matter. I disagree the year the Tigers took Porcello the Sox could of drafted him and did not want to pay what he wanted is one example. Walker to me was a major reach. Edited September 12, 2011 by Soxfest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harfman77 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 QUOTE (danman31 @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 11:39 AM) Mitchell wasn't considered a reach. He was according to every report that I read. He had a lot of trouble identifying pitches which he was down on a lot of draft boards. A lot of the reports felt this was because he had not committed to baseball full-time and there was and opportunity that he could make a big jump if his pitch recognition improved. His one really developed tool was his speed. He was seen as a guy with gap power, great speed, and average defense due to poor routes/reads on balls (which was also attributed to him splitting time with football). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 QUOTE (Soxfest @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 04:46 PM) I disagree the year the Tigers took Porcello the Sox could of drafted him and did not want to pay what he wanted is one example. Walker to me was a major reach. There's been a major change in philosophy since that draft though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harfman77 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 11:49 AM) There's been a major change in philosophy since that draft though. We still dont draft high school players in the first round. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 11:49 AM) There's been a major change in philosophy since that draft though. I hope it gets better because quite frankly it can't get much worse. Sox are going to have to spend in round 1 and get best player available regardless of cost. If they want to improve the farm system, we all know after round 1 they did not spend anything the last 2 years. I do not like the major change in philosophy in that regard! Edited September 12, 2011 by Soxfest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 QUOTE (danman31 @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 11:39 AM) Mitchell wasn't considered a reach. I don't remember Poreda being considered a reach either. Walker wasn't for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 QUOTE (Soxfest @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 11:46 AM) I disagree the year the Tigers took Porcello the Sox could of drafted him and did not want to pay what he wanted is one example. Walker to me was a major reach. Rick Porcello also wouldn't be in our rotation right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 12:05 PM) Rick Porcello also wouldn't be in our rotation right now. Yes he would. Edited September 12, 2011 by Soxfest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 QUOTE (Soxfest @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 12:07 PM) Yes he would. His numbers would have him in the pen or AAA with the pitching that we have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 12:10 PM) His numbers would have him in the pen or AAA with the pitching that we have. This great pitching you say is how many games back and a .500 team not so great Porcello would be the 4th starter easy on the Sox. IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 QUOTE (Soxfest @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 12:15 PM) This great pitching you say is how many games back and a .500 team not so great Porcello would be the 4th starter easy on the Sox. IMO. You really aren't trying to say that the starting pitching is the reason we are out of the race are you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Hibbard Posted September 12, 2011 Author Share Posted September 12, 2011 QUOTE (Soxfest @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 12:15 PM) This great pitching you say is how many games back and a .500 team not so great Porcello would be the 4th starter easy on the Sox. IMO. This team is a .500 team and how many games back because of the hitting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 (edited) Until the Sox are willing to piss off Bud Selig, or slotting is agreed to, they will be average at best in the draft. Boston routinely finishes with a better record and look at their prospects the past 5 or 6 years. Edited September 12, 2011 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 12:18 PM) You really aren't trying to say that the starting pitching is the reason we are out of the race are you? Hitting has been a major problem, but so is starting pitching last 2 months when needing big wins they have not got the job done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 QUOTE (Soxfest @ Sep 12, 2011 -> 12:30 PM) Hitting has been a major problem, but so is starting pitching last 2 months when needing big wins they have not got the job done. You can pick out an individual bad game or two, but the starting pitching has been very good all year long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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