Marty34 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 10:33 AM) It's all about what the total salary is. If we have to drop below $110 million, 2/$20 requires trading Quentin and Danks. U up for that? Absolutely. I want those guys gone if Buehrle leaves. This team isn't good enough to keep together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 11:43 AM) Absolutely. I want those guys gone if Buehrle leaves. This team isn't good enough to keep together. So, you kinda missed the point...keeping Buehrle probably requires moving them. I get that if buehrle leaves you want them gone, but if keeping Buehrle requires trading them...what then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 10:33 AM) It's all about what the total salary is. If we have to drop below $110 million, 2/$20 requires trading Quentin and Danks. U up for that? I think Quentin's done with the Sox for sure. And I don't even think they'll get a lot back for him. Sox have 11 players at $88 mil next year... Peavy 17.0 Dunn 14.0 Konerko 12.0 Rios 12.0 Floyd 7.0 Pierzynski 6.0 Thornton 5.5 Ramirez 5.0 Crain 4.5 Ohman 2.5 Viciedo 2.5 It pains me to say, but I'd let Buehrle go unless the Sox can get him back cheap. Danks being arb eligible--I think the smarter move may be to keep him and hold as a trade piece mid-season next year if they fall out of it. Floyd at 7 mil would be attractive to some teams. I don't think the Sox are going to be good the next two years anyway, so I could live with the rotation next year starting out to be: Danks, Peavy, Humber, Sale, Stewart If all goes right, Danks bounces back in his contract year; Peavy gets his regulatr offseason program going and he comes back better in his contract year; Humber is Humber and an ok starter; maybe Sale is an ace in the making and has a great season (could happen), and Stewart is a good 5th starter. All of this could happen, but everything has to go right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 That $88 is also before $6 million or so for 12 minimum salary peoples. So, add in those guys and $10 million for Mark and we're pretty much at $105 million if we were to drop Quentin and Danks and not sign anyone else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 10:44 AM) So, you kinda missed the point...keeping Buehrle probably requires moving them. I get that if buehrle leaves you want them gone, but if keeping Buehrle requires trading them...what then? I want Quentin and Danks (and others) gone regardless. I want Buehrle back (at the right price). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 11:49 AM) I want Quentin and Danks (and others) gone regardless. I want Buehrle back (at the right price). For once, I can agree with that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 10:41 AM) Allowing for a dropoff over the next 2 years. Should have said 180+ innings. I see no reason to look for a drop off. He's been incredibly consistent with the innings. But, we did say similar things about Dunn... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan-kwman Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Sep 15, 2011 -> 06:54 PM) Let's keep Ozzie, Cooper and Mark Buerhle. Regardless of how anyone wants to rate Buerhle you have to have a solid 5 or 6 man starting staff to win. Mark gives the Sox a very solid pitcher that fits in somewhere in that rotation. You win with pitching #1 I think. Agreed. Buerhle is a leader, and regardless of what people say about St. Louis him and PK are the Chicago white sox. You think the Cubs would have liked to have Maddux for his whole career.? Yes, end of conversation. Sale we'll have to step up next year and the future. Goodbye John Danks, we'll never forget the black out night. Next years Rotation Peavy Buehrle Flyod Sale Humber/Stewart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshPR Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 Who is flyod? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 (edited) I'd like to see something like this in 2012 C AJ 6m Flowers .4m 1B Konerko 12m 2B Beckham .6m* SS 3B Morel .5m* LF De Aza .5m* Lillibridge .6m* CF Rios 12m RF Viciedo 3.25m DH Dunn 14M UT Escobar .4m SP Buehrle 10m* SP Peavy 17m SP Sale 1m* SP Humber 1m* SP Stewart .5M* RP Crain 4.5M RP Ohman 2.5M RP Reed .5m Assuming a payroll of around $105m with additions at short and the pen needed. I might sign someone like Ramon Santiago for 2y/5m. That would be 20 players at about $85m. As I've said before, I'd stock up on pitching for Danks, Floyd, Thornton, Santos, Quentin, and Ramirez. With the economy the way it is, I wouldn't expect more than 75% value in return for that group, however. Edited September 17, 2011 by Marty34 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 03:29 PM) I'd like to see something like this in 2012 C AJ 6m Flowers .4m 1B Konerko 12m 2B Beckham .6m* SS 3B Morel .5m* LF De Aza .5m* Lillibridge .6m* CF Rios 12m RF Viciedo 3.25m DH Dunn 14M UT Escobar .4m SP Buehrle 10m* SP Peavy 17m SP Sale 1m* SP Humber 1m* SP Stewart .5M* RP Crain 4.5M RP Ohman 2.5M RP Reed .5m Assuming a payroll of around $105m with additions at short and the pen needed. I might sign someone like Ramon Santiago for 2y/5m. That would be 20 players at about $85m. As I've said before, I'd stock up on pitching for Danks, Floyd, Thornton, Santos, Quentin, and Ramirez. With the economy the way it is, I wouldn't expect more than 75% value in return for that group, however. I seriously doubt you'd see that much roster turnover in one off-season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 03:29 PM) I'd like to see something like this in 2012 C AJ 6m Flowers .4m 1B Konerko 12m 2B Beckham .6m* SS 3B Morel .5m* LF De Aza .5m* Lillibridge .6m* CF Rios 12m RF Viciedo 3.25m DH Dunn 14M UT Escobar .4m SP Buehrle 10m* SP Peavy 17m SP Sale 1m* SP Humber 1m* SP Stewart .5M* RP Crain 4.5M RP Ohman 2.5M RP Reed .5m Assuming a payroll of around $105m with additions at short and the pen needed. I might sign someone like Ramon Santiago for 2y/5m. That would be 20 players at about $85m. As I've said before, I'd stock up on pitching for Danks, Floyd, Thornton, Santos, Quentin, and Ramirez. With the economy the way it is, I wouldn't expect more than 75% value in return for that group, however. You do realize that you're getting rid of one of the best SS in the AL by trading Ramirez right? He's cheap for how much he actually does give you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (chw42 @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 04:53 PM) You do realize that you're getting rid of one of the best SS in the AL by trading Ramirez right? He's cheap for how much he actually does give you. He also might be in demand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 04:17 PM) I seriously doubt you'd see that much roster turnover in one off-season. Right. I just see this offseason as the time to cur bait on these guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (chw42 @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 04:53 PM) You do realize that you're getting rid of one of the best SS in the AL by trading Ramirez right? He's cheap for how much he actually does give you. Why he's so adamant on trading Sergio is more surprising. Any trades the White Sox make at this point should be for young, cost/team-controlled talent. That's exactly what Sergio is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 05:05 PM) Right. I just see this offseason as the time to cur bait on these guys. Have you seen the shortstop position, especially in the AL? It's pretty damn thin. Ramirez, assuming his production remains the same, combined with his defense, is still a bargain at $6 million per the next two years. I still have no idea why you want to trade Sergio. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 05:05 PM) Why he's so adamant on trading Sergio is more surprising. Any trades the White Sox make at this point should be for young, cost/team-controlled talent. That's exactly what Sergio is. Same reason for wanting to trade Ramirez more or less, he may be in demand. He's also only a 60 inning pitcher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 05:11 PM) Have you seen the shortstop position, especially in the AL? It's pretty damn thin. Ramirez, assuming his production remains the same, combined with his defense, is still a bargain at $6 million per the next two years. I still have no idea why you want to trade Sergio. Worry about SS later. That pitching staff is a ticking time bomb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 05:15 PM) Worry about SS later. That pitching staff is a ticking time bomb. I've got no problems dumping Ramirez as long as the return is what you should get for a premier SS. I think the guy has too many mental lapses and they seem to be more frequent as the seasons go by, but SS is such an important position, regular filler won't do. That said, KW or a new GM will have to be blown away to deal him, and righfully so even with all his warts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 05:13 PM) Same reason for wanting to trade Ramirez more or less, he may be in demand. He's also only a 60 inning pitcher. What would the return be for said 60 inning pitcher? Teams aren't emptying out their systems for relievers. You're devaluing him and at the same time saying we could get a nice return. Which is it? Edited September 17, 2011 by Jordan4life Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 06:27 PM) I've got no problems dumping Ramirez as long as the return is what you should get for a premier SS. I think the guy has too many mental lapses and they seem to be more frequent as the seasons go by, but SS is such an important position, regular filler won't do. That said, KW or a new GM will have to be blown away to deal him, and righfully so even with all his warts. It all depends on what we need to do next year. If the payroll has to drop to $100 million or lower...then you might just have to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 (edited) All these players have have issues, contracts or otherwise, that will limit their trade value and I think the return most here won't be happy with. If they wait longer though the return gets less. Edited September 17, 2011 by Marty34 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 05:02 PM) He also might be in demand. I mean sure, but what do you expect to get back for him? We have nobody in our system that can fill his role immediately and play as well. So unless you can get a good SS back + pitching prospects, trading him would be a bad idea. Edited September 17, 2011 by chw42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (chw42 @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 06:07 PM) I mean sure, but what do you expect to get back for him? We have nobody in our system that can fill his role immediately and play as well. So unless you can get a good SS back + pitching prospects, trading him would be a bad idea. Something along the lines of a decent pitching prospect or two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 QUOTE (chw42 @ Sep 17, 2011 -> 06:07 PM) I mean sure, but what do you expect to get back for him? We have nobody in our system that can fill his role immediately and play as well. So unless you can get a good SS back + pitching prospects, trading him would be a bad idea. Send him to the O's for Manny Machado! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.