flavum Posted September 22, 2011 Share Posted September 22, 2011 QUOTE (pittshoganerkoff @ Sep 22, 2011 -> 02:09 PM) Come on, greg, I dislike the Yankees/BoSox love as much as the next guy, but the scheduling of a lot of divisional games is not part of some vast conspracy. It may not be part of a conspiracy, but it may be part of the equation. They probably do it to build rivalries--which I don't believe in for a minute. They may also do it for travel considerations--hours on planes for the coastal teams, and expenses. To me, the bigger problem is that they don't schedule road trips that make any sense. there should be more 3-city trips that are more regional. If I had it my way, they would get rid of divisions, go back to a balanced schedule and the top-3 teams in the league would make the playoffs. 4 and 5 would play a best-of-3 to get in. Just adding a wildcard with divisions still in play is going to be a train wreck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted September 22, 2011 Share Posted September 22, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (pittshoganerkoff @ Sep 22, 2011 -> 08:09 PM) Come on, greg, I dislike the Yankees/BoSox love as much as the next guy, but the scheduling of a lot of divisional games is not part of some vast conspracy. I think it is. Steinbrenner pushed for it so the Yankees could play the other Sox every other week. It truly sucks IMO. And as far as Milkman's rip of me ... what stats do you want for me to back up the fact we suck against teams in our division? I watch a lot of Royals games and they do perk up when they play the Sox. They throw at our batters, they steal bases, they act like badasses when they normally play like timid p*****s. We sleepwalk against divisional foes. I truly believe they want to kick Chicago's ass way more than we give a s*** about playing them in lousy towns like Cleveland and Detroit. Our players prolly hate going there to begin with and sleepwalk and get their asses kicked. Minnie and KC are nicer towns for them to drink in I'd guess. When they come to the Cell, these games should be sold as very important, but they are just dull ol divisional games. When the Bosox come to town or other teams it's a way bigger deal. We suck against the Central. My theory IMO is as good as any. Edited September 22, 2011 by greg775 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted September 22, 2011 Share Posted September 22, 2011 Greg, that's part of sports. TB rising up from obscurity as the "underdogs" (despite all their high #1 draft picks) to knock off the likes of the Yankees and Boston was/is a motivating factor. But why doesn't it work so well for Toronto and Baltimore every year? The Twins were almost wiped out of baseball by Selig. That certainly was a motivator when they were so good in 2002-2004. Now that they have a huge payroll (comparatively) and guys like Mauer making almost $30 million per year, nobody considers them the underdogs anymore. As to why the team plays so poorly at home and against divisional rivals, what's the only constant from 2008 compared to today? Guillen, Walker and KW. The roster has changed quite a bit over that time, but the results within the division haven't, nor has the 2nd half swan dive into the tiny bucket of water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted September 22, 2011 Share Posted September 22, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (greg775 @ Sep 22, 2011 -> 03:04 PM) I think it is. Steinbrenner pushed for it so the Yankees could play the other Sox every other week. It truly sucks IMO. And as far as Milkman's rip of me ... what stats do you want for me to back up the fact we suck against teams in our division? I watch a lot of Royals games and they do perk up when they play the Sox. They throw at our batters, they steal bases, they act like badasses when they normally play like timid p*****s. We sleepwalk against divisional foes. I truly believe they want to kick Chicago's ass way more than we give a s*** about playing them in lousy towns like Cleveland and Detroit. Our players prolly hate going there to begin with and sleepwalk and get their asses kicked. Minnie and KC are nicer towns for them to drink in I'd guess. When they come to the Cell, these games should be sold as very important, but they are just dull ol divisional games. When the Bosox come to town or other teams it's a way bigger deal. We suck against the Central. My theory IMO is as good as any. This is buffoonery at its finest. So because Cleveland and Detroit are miserable cities, the Sox don't take going there seriously? And that's on the schedulers?! And in this vast conspiracy to ensure that the Yankees and Red Sox play each other more often, you know who should be the most pissed off? The f***ing Yankees and Red Sox. You know why? Because they are often the two best (or top few) teams in the league, and they have to play superior competition more regularly in order to make the playoffs. You know what that does? It makes their run at the postseason more difficult. So no, your theory isn't as good as any because it's f***ing stupid. It's almost as stupid a theory that Ozzie Guillen should be retained as manager because people will say hi to him at restaurants. It's not as good as any other theory. It's just your opinion, which you're entitled to, but your opinion is completely f***ing moronic. Edited September 22, 2011 by Milkman delivers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard Zelig Posted September 22, 2011 Share Posted September 22, 2011 You must have taken Greg off ignore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted September 22, 2011 Share Posted September 22, 2011 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Sep 22, 2011 -> 09:43 PM) This is buffoonery at its finest. So because Cleveland and Detroit are miserable cities, the Sox don't take going there seriously? And that's on the schedulers?! And in this vast conspiracy to ensure that the Yankees and Red Sox play each other more often, you know who should be the most pissed off? The f***ing Yankees and Red Sox. You know why? Because they are often the two best (or top few) teams in the league, and they have to play superior competition more regularly in order to make the playoffs. You know what that does? It makes their run at the postseason more difficult. So no, your theory isn't as good as any because it's f***ing stupid. It's almost as stupid a theory that Ozzie Guillen should be retained as manager because people will say hi to him at restaurants. It's not as good as any other theory. It's just your opinion, which you're entitled to, but your opinion is completely f***ing moronic. You had some good words in the post: buffoonery, moronic and of course, f***ing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted September 22, 2011 Share Posted September 22, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Leonard Zelig @ Sep 22, 2011 -> 04:51 PM) You must have taken Greg off ignore. What's the point? You can see whatever he says through everybody else. This I did not know. So I can't ignore wite when I get ready to. Edited September 22, 2011 by Jordan4life Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard Zelig Posted September 22, 2011 Share Posted September 22, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Sep 22, 2011 -> 05:18 PM) What's the point? You can see whatever he says through everybody else. This I did not know. So I can't ignore wite when I get ready to. True, but nobody quoted that post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted September 22, 2011 Share Posted September 22, 2011 Well, it's probably just as likely that the Detroit Tigers are motivated by GM commercials starring Eminem than by playing the Chicago White Sox these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VictoryMC98 Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 If you don't win the World Series, your team isn't successful.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 QUOTE (VictoryMC98 @ Sep 22, 2011 -> 06:02 PM) If you don't win the World Series, your team isn't successful.. So Ozzie and KW have both failed at this for the past 6 years...therefore, they should both be gone? Yes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VictoryMC98 Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 (edited) So Ozzie and KW have both failed at this for the past 6 years...therefore, they should both be gone? Yes? Have I not stated this since I have been here.. Both should be gone.. KW leading the way, with Ozzie staying, only long enough for the NEW GM to ship him off to FLA. But, if one has to stay.. Ozzie is the one. Kenny should be shown the door, on Sept 28th as soon as the final out is recorded. JR walks up, and states.. Pack your bags.. 11 years is OVAH! Edited September 23, 2011 by VictoryMC98 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
max power Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 this thread is based on the idea that things are either black or white. Id say more often than not they are grey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VictoryMC98 Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 this thread is based on the idea that things are either black or white. Id say more often than not they are grey. How so? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 QUOTE (VictoryMC98 @ Sep 22, 2011 -> 07:29 PM) How so? There is clearly successful (trophy presentation in October) and clearly unsuccessful, 100 loss season. Then some stuff in between that changes based on any number of factors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 QUOTE (Leonard Zelig @ Sep 22, 2011 -> 04:51 PM) You must have taken Greg off ignore. I've actually been clicking to un-ignore him the last few weeks to see how hard he's taking the eventual Ozzie firing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 QUOTE (greg775 @ Sep 22, 2011 -> 05:16 PM) You had some good words in the post: buffoonery, moronic and of course, f***ing. Yep, and all in reference to your post or theory, not you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 QUOTE (VictoryMC98 @ Sep 22, 2011 -> 06:22 PM) Have I not stated this since I have been here.. Both should be gone.. KW leading the way, with Ozzie staying, only long enough for the NEW GM to ship him off to FLA. But, if one has to stay.. Ozzie is the one. Kenny should be shown the door, on Sept 28th as soon as the final out is recorded. JR walks up, and states.. Pack your bags.. 11 years is OVAH! I'm not sure how much to blame Kenny. If you look at how much financial resources are devoted to the draft, Kenny is handcuffed. Reinsdorf may be the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Sep 23, 2011 -> 01:08 AM) I've actually been clicking to un-ignore him the last few weeks to see how hard he's taking the eventual Ozzie firing. I still say I'm taking it well. I've pointed out a million times I love the guy and want him to stay but I think even Ozzie knows deep down it wouldn't be unfair (in baseball terms) to can him for this year's effort. He could have gotten the axe in mid May. This team's start with this huge payroll was unacceptable. In my mind, this year is summarized by... -- The awful start record-wise. -- The refusal to bring up Dayan. -- The refusal to make any trades or acquisitions of note (again) at the all star break or right before the break. And the biggie ... -- The inability to move runners and all the men left on base. Bases loaded one out; second and third nobody out; first and third one out ... most of the time it was ZERO or one run at most. (The way Phil and Zach have been going it would have been interesting to see if we blew the division the last two weeks of the season had we actually competed and been in the race; with Jake out as well, our rotation has been crummy). Edited September 23, 2011 by greg775 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 Can't argue there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VictoryMC98 Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 I'm not sure how much to blame Kenny. If you look at how much financial resources are devoted to the draft, Kenny is handcuffed. Reinsdorf may be the problem. Stop blowing money on the Rios and Dunn's of the world... and you have money to invest in your minor leaguers.. Either pay them $2million now, or $14 million later to correct the mistakes of your drafting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard Zelig Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 QUOTE (VictoryMC98 @ Sep 22, 2011 -> 07:02 PM) If you don't win the World Series, your team isn't successful.. Do you really think that in 2008, when Tampa Bay finished above 4th place for the first time in franchise history, made the playoffs for the first time in franchise history, won their division for the first time in franchise history, won a playoff series for the first time in franchise history, and won the AL pennant for the first time in franchise history, the team was a failure? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 QUOTE (VictoryMC98 @ Sep 22, 2011 -> 07:02 PM) If you don't win the World Series, your team isn't successful.. only in New York Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtySox Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (VictoryMC98 @ Sep 22, 2011 -> 10:39 PM) Stop blowing money on the Rios and Dunn's of the world... and you have money to invest in your minor leaguers.. Either pay them $2million now, or $14 million later to correct the mistakes of your drafting. It isn't that simple with the owner's aversion to draft spending, and refusal to go significantly over-slot. I'm not a big Kenny fan, but he would definitely be spending much more on the draft if he was allowed to. Jerry is far too hands on in this regard. Edited September 23, 2011 by DirtySox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 Bigger market and payroll teams don't need to rely on the draft. If Dunn played a 75% of his normal output, this season is vastly different. The chances of getting those stats out of Dunn versus someone you draft is usually far better. If you are a team looking for a pitcher to get you 12 wins in 2013 would you rather count on your 2010 draft or getting MB in free agency? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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