DirtySox Posted October 1, 2011 Share Posted October 1, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 1, 2011 -> 03:54 PM) The issue is that yeah, Sale should have more than that in him and he's already made the big leagues, so he's gotten the first step or two accomplished. Starting from that point, only winding up with a reliever would be a disappointment. Starting from the draft itself, winding up with a dominating reliever is a solid result. Well put. I only have issue if he isn't given the opportunity to maximize his value as a starting pitcher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 1, 2011 Share Posted October 1, 2011 QUOTE (DirtySox @ Oct 1, 2011 -> 05:37 PM) Well put. I only have issue if he isn't given the opportunity to maximize his value as a starting pitcher. I think it's really obvious, especially with Sergio now signed...that he'll be given the chance next year. The question now is whether or not having a year in the bullpen will have done real damage to him. If he starts for the majority of next year he's 100% guaranteed to be #1 on the "Verducci Effect" list the following spring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danman31 Posted October 2, 2011 Share Posted October 2, 2011 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Oct 1, 2011 -> 03:23 PM) But another example in the past would be someone like Josh Fogg, who was a reliever at Florida and with the Sox...eventually evolving into a pretty high quality starter, enough to start a World Series game. Umm what? Josh Fogg as a pretty high quality starter? He was a well below average SP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted October 2, 2011 Share Posted October 2, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (danman31 @ Oct 1, 2011 -> 09:09 PM) Umm what? Josh Fogg as a pretty high quality starter? He was a well below average SP. I was going to say something about that. Fogg was (I had to check if he was even in the league anymore, and he's not) the definition of serviceable, at best. Edited October 2, 2011 by Milkman delivers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted October 2, 2011 Share Posted October 2, 2011 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Oct 1, 2011 -> 03:23 PM) But another example in the past would be someone like Josh Fogg, who was a reliever at Florida and with the Sox...eventually evolving into a pretty high quality starter, enough to start a World Series game. Really? In that World Series game, he didn't make it out of the 3rd inning and gave up 6 runs. His best ERA as a full-time starter was 4.35, and that was in the NL..Can you please define pretty high quality starter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted October 2, 2011 Share Posted October 2, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Oct 1, 2011 -> 02:29 PM) That'd be a fail in my book. They can't all by Bryan Bullington. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted October 2, 2011 Share Posted October 2, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 1, 2011 -> 03:54 PM) The issue is that yeah, Sale should have more than that in him and he's already made the big leagues, so he's gotten the first step or two accomplished. Starting from that point, only winding up with a reliever would be a disappointment. Starting from the draft itself, winding up with a dominating reliever is a solid result. This is a very fair assessment imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 2, 2011 Share Posted October 2, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Oct 1, 2011 -> 02:09 PM) You can find nasty left-handed (or right-handed) relievers well after the first round if you're competent. If it is really that easy, why are teams always looking for nasty left handed relievers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted October 2, 2011 Share Posted October 2, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 2, 2011 -> 09:36 AM) If it is really that easy, why are teams always looking for nasty left handed relievers? I don't know. Why don't you ask this year's playoff teams? And of the teams that do have them, how many went at #13? That's the whole crux of my argument. I don't know. Our recent draft history is so futile that anything that could be considered a "win" will suffice to some. I guess if Gordon Beckham could at least become a really good utility guy that some would be like, "Hey, that's better than nothing. Most draft picks bust anyway." Meanwhile, we're featuring a rotation of Axelrod, Petricka, Humber, Stewart and I guess Floyd in 2013? Maybe another Chris Getz clone at 2B? Yeah, that's a worst-case scenario. But I can't assume FA signings. Edited October 2, 2011 by Jordan4life Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted October 2, 2011 Share Posted October 2, 2011 Look at the 10 or so picks after Sale. Are you disappointed the Sox didn't take any of those instead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted October 2, 2011 Share Posted October 2, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Marty34 @ Oct 2, 2011 -> 06:06 PM) Look at the 10 or so picks after Sale. Are you disappointed the Sox didn't take any of those instead? Irrelevant. I'm looking long-term here. We desperately need an infusion of talent. Whether it be SP or position player. The relievers are for the 5th round. Edited October 2, 2011 by Jordan4life Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted October 2, 2011 Share Posted October 2, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Oct 2, 2011 -> 06:17 PM) Irrelevant. I'm looking long-term here. We desperately need an infusion of talent. Whether it be SP or position player. The relievers are for the 5th round. You said the Sale pick will be a failure if he doesn't make a successful transition to a starter. I see a whole lot of mediocre-to-bad taken in the 10 picks after him to the point where if at worse he is a nasty LH reliever I think he'll surpass those taken in the 10 picks after. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted October 2, 2011 Share Posted October 2, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Oct 2, 2011 -> 06:45 PM) You said the Sale pick will be a failure if he doesn't make a successful transition to a starter. I see a whole lot of mediocre-to-bad taken in the 10 picks after him to the point where if at worse he is a nasty LH reliever I think he'll surpass those taken in the 10 picks after. You don't see anything. The '10 draft is barely two years old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard Zelig Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Oct 2, 2011 -> 06:53 PM) You don't see anything. The '10 draft is barely two years old. Yet you were able to label Keenyn Walker a bust? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 Well he's set for life. The club pays for all his meals and stuff while on the road. If he buys a modest house in the suburbs and keeps his expenses to $100,000 a year, he's got 80 years covered. He could retire after that, unless he's all about the money or some crazy s*** like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerbaho-WG Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Oct 1, 2011 -> 02:09 PM) You can find nasty left-handed (or right-handed) relievers well after the first round if you're competent. Bulls*** and you know it. By this logic teams are either full of quality relievers or are incompetent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Oct 2, 2011 -> 04:58 PM) I don't know. Why don't you ask this year's playoff teams? And of the teams that do have them, how many went at #13? That's the whole crux of my argument. I don't know. Our recent draft history is so futile that anything that could be considered a "win" will suffice to some. I guess if Gordon Beckham could at least become a really good utility guy that some would be like, "Hey, that's better than nothing. Most draft picks bust anyway." Meanwhile, we're featuring a rotation of Axelrod, Petricka, Humber, Stewart and I guess Floyd in 2013? Maybe another Chris Getz clone at 2B? Yeah, that's a worst-case scenario. But I can't assume FA signings. If they are easy to find, every team should be loaded with lefties they found after the first round. Why are teams always looking to trade for them then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Oct 2, 2011 -> 06:17 PM) Irrelevant. I'm looking long-term here. We desperately need an infusion of talent. Whether it be SP or position player. The relievers are for the 5th round. Chris Sale is a big time talent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBlackSox8 Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 Sale has learned at the Major Leauge level for 1.5+ years. I say that's better than learning in the minors....of course the downfall is he's been in the bullpen, but I believe it's better for him and the team him learning in the bullpen at the MLB level, than slowly progressing in the minors. Now going forward, you strecth his arm back to being a starter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VictoryMC98 Posted October 5, 2011 Share Posted October 5, 2011 I like this signing.. with how bad this team is.. They made a smart move here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILMOU Posted October 5, 2011 Share Posted October 5, 2011 QUOTE (VictoryMC98 @ Oct 4, 2011 -> 07:52 PM) I like this signing.. with how bad this team is.. They made a smart move here. This is a rare one that most all of us can agree upon. Bargain price for quality, late-inning relief. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILMOU Posted October 5, 2011 Share Posted October 5, 2011 I expect a rotation of Sale, Floyd, Buehrle, an unknown pitcher that we get in trade this offseason who turns out to be pretty good, and one of Humber, Stewart or Axelrod as the #5. And I expect it to be a good, cost effective rotation, headed by a dominant Slim Unit, who should really be hitting his stride by then. Man, J4L sure is negative this time of year. He has to know we'll be better than what he envisions. Get that man some Oxy to wash down with a 40 or 2, cheer him up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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