Robin Ventura Named White Sox Manager

[Quin]

I just read all the Trib articles and Lamont's quotes and this is a scary hire.

Yes I believe Cowley. If he's wrong, he's putting his job on the line. What Cooper did is really sleazy.

Nobody likes a backstabber. It's WRONG. If this was the 1950s, Ozzie would beat his ass.

But nowadays he'll spend time in prison for smashing Coop a good one in the nose.

(I'm assuming the article is true; if not, my bad).

 

Scary? It's rather tame. Ozzie is scary.

 

He's a crappy journalist and his sources are always wrong. What makes them all of the sudden right? He spreads lies to get others fired or spreads their personal information. That's sleazy.

 

Cooper asked about an extension since his contract was up this year. Ozzie demanded one despite having a deal next year.

 

You apparently LOVE backstabbers. If this was the 1950's, Ozzie wouldn't be managing or allowed near Coop, but changing Ozzie's ethnicity, his ass would get kicked by Buerhle, Hawk, Stone, Paulie, Swisher, Cabrera, Lee, Tracey, Ordonez, A-Rod, Sean Penn, Joe West, KW, Garland, McCarthy, Thome, Morel, Teahen, etc. Oney's ass would get kicked, Ozney would fail in the Minors

 

Yeah, because assaulting people isn't ok.

 

You're seriously f***ing justifying assault to make Ozzie look cool.

[max power]

Martinez and Alomar both stated they weren't interviewed, Alomar even went so far as to say he wasn't contacted at all

Yeah, I know. I think its pointless to interview them when you already have your guy picked out.

 

conjecture?

Sure, such as "this was Kenny getting his yes-man". Conjecture.

 

your logic about "wasting their time", that's a ridiculous way of looking at it, and I laugh at a professional sports team that goes into the process of hiring a new mgr with the full mindset on getting a guy less qualified than others available, and thus not even bothering to interview other potential candidates

 

what a joke

Less experience = less qualified to you. Not to me. Perhaps he has other skills that far outweigh the experience. You don't know if he does, or if he doesn't. More conjecture.

[max power]

I am not purposefully singling you out. It seems as if half of the forum is basing their opinion on this hire on things they assume they know.

[WHITESOXRANDY]

Cowley on Ventura... and how Cooper became Judas.

 

 

Joe Cowley has become the most biased sports columnist in Chicago since Jay Mariotti.

[caulfield12]

A.J. Hinch similarly launched himself from the high dive when he was named to manage the Diamondbacks, and the move quickly cost Josh Byrnes his job as general manager. Hinch, like Ventura, was an intelligent former player with no managerial experience.

 

There have been a lot of different paths taken to the manager's office, and managerial experience hasn't always proven necessary.

 

Gil Hodges went directly from playing to managing, and he was one of the best managers in the last 50 years (to the chagrin of the 1969 Cubs). Eddie Stanky left the Giants after 1952 to be a player-manager for the Cardinals and went 88-66 in the first of his three-plus seasons. (He later managed the Sox for two-plus seasons, finishing above .500 in 1966-67.)

 

Jerry Coleman and Larry Dierker prepped for their managerial careers as broadcasters. Trey Hillman had managed in Japan, but before taking over the Royals was last in a big-league clubhouse when he was a locker-room attendant. Bob Brenly had coached but never managed at any level before getting a chance, and his Diamondbacks won a World Series.

 

If there ever has been a hire as out of left field as Ventura, it was a desperation move by the old Washington Senators. Ted Williams had been out of baseball eight seasons, doing little more than fishing and serving as a part-time instructor for Carl Yastrzemski and lesser Red Sox players, when the Senators hired him to manage. Four years later, he was the owner of a 273-364 record and never again wanted to try that trick.

 

 

From Phil Rogers' article....no mention of Connie Mack, Torre or Ted Turner

 

 

[SoxAce]

Ha. I thought my co-workers were kidding about this the whole time. Just found out now. Really weird to see, but Robin was a favorite of mine growing up so I think it's awesome. Now, from a baseball perspective I don't know, but I'll reserve judgment. I hope we find a way to deal these expensive fools and rebuild fully (hell even 1-2 gone would be nice) but definitely won't hold my breath.

Edited October 7, 2011 by SoxAce

[caulfield12]

http://www.google.com.hk/#hl=zh-CN&new...249&bih=473

 

 

Larry Dierker

 

435-348 (.556)

 

5 years of out 6 finishing in first place, one fourth place finish

 

 

That would have been the best argument for hiring Don Cooper as the manager.

Jerry Coleman was a complete disaster with the 1980 Padres and is always going to be known more as a broadcaster.

 

And, of course, those Astros teams that Dierker managed had a ton of talent (funny how that usually has more to do with a manager's success---see the Trey Hillman disaster in KC, and reading back on how positive/optimistic Joe Posnanski was when the hire was announced, interesting to say the least).

 

KW has left Robin's cabinet, being optimistic, at best...a glass half full.

 

 

So, to summarize, Hodges, Stanky, Larry Dierker, Torre (eventually), Connie Mack and Bob Brenly all succeeded with zero prior managerial experience.

 

Edited October 7, 2011 by caulfield12

[witesoxfan]

I don't see any in between with this move at the very least.

[caulfield12]

I don't see any in between with this move at the very least.

 

 

Do you mean about Ventura failing/succeeding as a manager (ala Quade on the Northside) or the organization going full rebuilding or going for it yet again in 2012 with a modified "reload"?

 

It seems only about 10-15% of the posters here are expecting anything above $100-105 million for payroll, and that was counting on the idea of Mark Buehrle probably coming back in those projections...at least that if any budget "stretching" was going to be done for 2012, it would be done to keep Mark in the fold.

 

 

[Texsox]

We've sat here for years watching Oz make some awful decisions. We are only guessing how Robin will manage, and clearly mostly here have decided he's going to be terrible. But terrible how? Making the same decisions as Oz? I don't believe he will. Of course I am guessing like everyone else. However, I believe his personality will be one of playing it safe. Following the traditional (stats friendly) route. I believe Robin is a follow the book not write the book kind of person. That could be a welcome breath of fresh air on the south side.

[fathom]

People are really upset that this might signal we're not going "all in" the next few years? Consider me relieved and hopeful that the organization will take a step back and see that there's a need to rebuild. I know I've received some ribbing due to praising the Tigers so much, but there's no reason that they aren't the class of the AL Central the next 2-3 years. I'd rather the Sox hope for Dunn and Rios to rebound instead of trying to cover their mistakes by bringing in other high-priced guys.

[SoxAce]

After thinking it over some (and doing some research on Robin..) I love this move. Ridiculously underrated as a leader.

[Texsox]

People are really upset that this might signal we're not going "all in" the next few years? Consider me relieved and hopeful that the organization will take a step back and see that there's a need to rebuild. I know I've received some ribbing due to praising the Tigers so much, but there's no reason that they aren't the class of the AL Central the next 2-3 years. I'd rather the Sox hope for Dunn and Rios to rebound instead of trying to cover their mistakes by bringing in other high-priced guys.

I believe their only hope is Dunn and Rios rebounding. They can't shed those salaries, they may be able to shed the players, but only if they pick up a ridiculous amount of salary. And I think this move shows that is the direction. If Robin manages "by the book" at a minimum it will mean those guys will be sitting a lot more than Oz sat them. That would be an addition. The "rebuilding" may simply be a couple painful years of basically the same 25 while their contracts fade away.

[Dick Allen]

I just read all the Trib articles and Lamont's quotes and this is a scary hire.

Yes I believe Cowley. If he's wrong, he's putting his job on the line. What Cooper did is really sleazy.

Nobody likes a backstabber. It's WRONG. If this was the 1950s, Ozzie would beat his ass.

But nowadays he'll spend time in prison for smashing Coop a good one in the nose.

(I'm assuming the article is true; if not, my bad).

You read the Lamont quotes, but dismissed all the quotes about the lack of experience not being a big issue? Its baseball. If it were that complicated this message board should be shut down, because none of us would have the credentials to voice an opinion. Remember, your boy Ozzie didn't have the experience Lamont says you need. He waved at people in the stands and waved them in from 3rd base, and now all he does is win championships. Cowley is wrong. Look at his past articles. Didnt he say the Sox would hire Daryl Boston as a puppet? Then didn't he brag about the Sun Times being the first to break the news that Dave Martinez is their choice even though he was never interviewed? He doesn't know. They won't fire him for being wrong. If they did, Marriotti would have lasted a week and Cowley would have been gone a long time ago.

 

 

[Springfield Soxfan]

After thinking it over some (and doing some research on Robin..) I love this move. Ridiculously underrated as a leader.

Amen, could not have said it any better. Sweet Swinging Robin, have high hopes for him.

[Balta1701]

People are really upset that this might signal we're not going "all in" the next few years? Consider me relieved and hopeful that the organization will take a step back and see that there's a need to rebuild. I know I've received some ribbing due to praising the Tigers so much, but there's no reason that they aren't the class of the AL Central the next 2-3 years. I'd rather the Sox hope for Dunn and Rios to rebound instead of trying to cover their mistakes by bringing in other high-priced guys.

My biggest problem here is the word "Hope".

 

IMO, if you want Dunn and Rios to rebound...you need to surround them with guys who can get through to them. We saw a motivated offseason Rios in 2010 and he came out and was a monster to start that year. We saw an unmotivated Rios in 2011. We saw a completely broken emotional and probably physical Dunn in 2011.

 

I can't see how half of the same staff with a guy less experienced and not obviously more interested than Ozzie is the guy who breaks through those walls.

[Balta1701]

[Balta1701]

"No, I've never coached before. But I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night."

[BigSqwert]

[southsider2k5]

I already see it on my Facebook page. Statuses popping up about how awesome a signing it is. At best at this point, it's almost a lateral move. Nobody has a f***ing clue how this guy is at managing, but since everyone remembers him as a good player, they're excited.

 

You need to prune your friend list. Bad.

[southsider2k5]

What I want to know, in this time of modern technology, "sources" everywhere with access to anything... HOW DID EVERYONE MISS THIS?!?!

 

EVERYONE, EVERYONE!!!! had Martinez as the top Candidate. Ventura was never even mentioned once.

 

This is called no Guillen in the organization to leak stuff anymore. What a surprise all of Joe Cowley's "sources" didn't get him this scoop.

[Balta1701]

This is called no Guillen in the organization to leak stuff anymore. What a surprise all of Joe Cowley's "sources" didn't get him this scoop.

Hell, even for the 3 months that both Guillen and Ventura were in the same org, no one knew.

[southsider2k5]

They absolutely have to hire an experienced bench coach at this point.

 

This is the most important part. Right now I am pissed beyond all belief. I have been this mad with the organization twice. Once with the Brandon Mccarthy deal, and once when they let Robin walk away by offering a joke of a contract. Maybe he will turn out OK, but if you really want Ventura to manage, make him the bench coach for a few years next to someone with at least some coaching experience. Or let him manage in the minors. Don't make him the manager from day one. This is just awful.

[southsider2k5]

Wouldn't that be ironic if Ventura lives on a boat in Lake Michigan during his tenure as White Sox manager. He made more money in his pro career than Ozzie and was a significantly better player.

 

Neither one of those things is really saying too much.

[southsider2k5]

Love it hard. I think people complaining don't know s*** about Robin.

 

Nobody out there was a bigger fan of Robin than I was.