Jordan4life_2007 Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 04:20 PM) I don't know Alonso that well, but he's a 1b right? I would really hate to deal for a guy that we have to move to RF because he's blocked by Konerko, only to find out that Alonso is blocked in RF by Viciedo. In other words, he better be able to give me numbers that make it reasonable for me to send the Captain packing. True. That's the only roadblock. He appears to be a 1B only. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thehugeunit Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 04:21 PM) Whoa. I like Gardner. But let's not get it twisted. A BIG bulk of his value comes from playing an outstanding LF. He's not better than any of the guys you named. I'm just throwing out the names of the guys who he has better WARs than. Is he better than Kemp? no. but I'd want more than Danks for him also you need to consider he's got a lot more years left of control. Besides Gardner will never be traded unless Girardi is fired. Edited November 21, 2011 by TheHugeUnit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 04:20 PM) I don't know Alonso that well, but he's a 1b right? I would really hate to deal for a guy that we have to move to RF because he's blocked by Konerko, only to find out that Alonso is blocked in RF by Viciedo. In other words, he better be able to give me numbers that make it reasonable for me to send the Captain packing. Put Alonzo in LF and deal Viciedo for pitching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 05:48 PM) Put Alonzo in LF and deal Viciedo for pitching. Why on Earth would you deal Viciedo for young pitching and keep Konerko on the roster? If you're dealing away Santos to get Alonso, you're getting Alonso with 2013 and beyond in mind. However, Konerko will be 37 that year and will be in the final year of his contract. Thus, this pitching you've obtained and this LF you've obtained will suddenly have a manufactured 1b hole starting that season. If you're trading away your current closer to get a young 1b, and your 1b position is blocked by a 35 year old under contract for 2 years for $25 million, "trading away your young RF and moving the 1b to the OF" shouldn't even enter your mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 I'm beginning to think that Marty simply doesn't like Viciedo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 04:51 PM) Why on Earth would you deal Viciedo for young pitching and keep Konerko on the roster? If you're dealing away Santos to get Alonso, you're getting Alonso with 2013 and beyond in mind. However, Konerko will be 37 that year and will be in the final year of his contract. Thus, this pitching you've obtained and this LF you've obtained will suddenly have a manufactured 1b hole starting that season. If you're trading away your current closer to get a young 1b, and your 1b position is blocked by a 35 year old under contract for 2 years for $25 million, "trading away your young RF and moving the 1b to the OF" shouldn't even enter your mind. You trade Viciedo because he is most likely to bring back the best possible pitching haul of any Sox and Alonzo gives you a young middle of the order hitter to replace Viciedo. Alonzo plays LF until he replaces Konerko at 1B. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 06:14 PM) You trade Viciedo because he is most likely to bring back the best possible pitching haul of any Sox and Alonzo gives you a young middle of the order hitter to replace Viciedo. Alonzo plays LF until he replaces Konerko at 1B. Personally, I think that trading Konerko plus freeing up $12 million would be a much more solid pitching haul than trading Viciedo. And I hate the idea of moving guys around who already are iffy on defense. Put the guy at 1b and stop trying to convince fools on message boards to trade him. Doing so already made someone dislike Viciedo for some unfathomable reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 05:16 PM) Personally, I think that trading Konerko plus freeing up $12 million would be a much more solid pitching haul than trading Viciedo. If they can do that then by all means they should. I don't think that's the case though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 06:25 PM) If they can do that then by all means they should. I don't think that's the case though. Konerko is the 1 big salary guy on this club who ought to be moveable with a decent return. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fantl916 Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Floyd, Santos to Reds for Yonder, Grandal, A ball type Konerko to Brewers for Wily Peralta, Gamel Everybody wins? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 05:25 PM) Konerko is the 1 big salary guy on this club who ought to be moveable with a decent return. Not better than Viciedo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 06:35 PM) Not better than Viciedo. But that still means we need a RF and a 1b 2 years down the line (and a closer since that's where we're starting all this). Really makes a mess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 The only reason why the Sox would have any interest in a 1b is if the Sox could move their current, expensive 1b. That's the only reason. Especially if the other option is somehow "Move this 1b to the OF and hope he sticks there despite not being a great defender to start". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 05:42 PM) But that still means we need a RF and a 1b 2 years down the line (and a closer since that's where we're starting all this). Really makes a mess. LF Alonzo, CF De Aza, RF Rios. Closer Reed. Two years Alonzo moves to 1B. Easier to fill a LF hole than a SP hole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 06:58 PM) LF Alonzo, CF De Aza, RF Rios. Closer Reed. Two years Alonzo moves to 1B. Easier to fill a LF hole than a SP hole. LF De Aza, CF Rios, RF Viciedo, 1b Alonso, $13 million immediately available for various purposes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 06:04 PM) LF De Aza, CF Rios, RF Viciedo, 1b Alonso, $13 million immediately available for various purposes. What do you do about the pitching? Edited November 22, 2011 by Marty34 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 07:08 PM) What do you do about the pitching? $13 million freed up immediately, 3 guys who must be in rotation are Peavy, Sale, and Humber. If the Sox don't care about winning in 2012 (which is what trading for a young 1b would say), then Axelrod and Stewart can get shots...or...we've basically traded Danks, Floyd, and Konerko. At least a couple pitchers ought to come back in those steps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 04:57 PM) I'm beginning to think that Marty simply doesn't like Viciedo. Santos, Viciedo, and Ramirez. I think he is anti-latino. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 07:12 PM) Santos, Viciedo, and Ramirez. I think he is anti-latino. Except Alonso is also Cuban-born. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 06:12 PM) Santos, Viciedo, and Ramirez. I think he is anti-latino. I love the latino. If anything I am pro-latino. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyone Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 06:08 PM) What do you do about the pitching? You draft it the next three years when you're drafting in the top ten each year. Heck, with all the people you want to dump the Sox will e drafting in the top five for however many years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macsandz Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 I will say that Alonzo can barrel it up. He's a guy that will just hit wherever he plays. And Reed is the future closer for this team. Not Santos, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan-kwman Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 QUOTE (kjshoe04 @ Nov 17, 2011 -> 01:32 AM) Not sure I'll ever truly understand the love Brett Gardner gets from some people. I was just thinking, I bet the sox will end up making a trade like that. Gardner strikes me as a guy Kenny would like. Like he loved Junior, Chone Figgins, Tori Hunter, etc. If we lose Buehrle, we will trade Thorton prospects, Danks for prospects, & Floyd for prospects. Or maybe the opposite. Best thing about Kenny, you never know what he's going to do. Also the worse thing!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2nd_city_saint787 Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 05:20 PM) I don't know Alonso that well, but he's a 1b right? I would really hate to deal for a guy that we have to move to RF because he's blocked by Konerko, only to find out that Alonso is blocked in RF by Viciedo. In other words, he better be able to give me numbers that make it reasonable for me to send the Captain packing. Alonso has played in over a 100 games in LF in the minors QUOTE (Marty34 @ Nov 21, 2011 -> 05:48 PM) Put Alonzo in LF and deal Viciedo for pitching. why get younger on offense only to trade away youth as well...and why in this whole discussion hasnt CQs name popped up, hes the one you trade for pitching. I keep hearing atlanta as a trade partner for Q but why?? they have prado, heyward and bourn...unless prado can play short or jones is retiring i dont see the match, if that is the case and theyre moving prado back to the inf then a Q(plus something they like in the minors if needed) for Beachy or Delgado would be perfect. I hear the Nats have some cash to throw around and could use a John Danks, they could also use an OFer with harper maybe not getting the call just yet and bernadina not being that good do you think theyd take Rios with Danks for Peacock Detwiler or milone?? love the idea of trading danks/floyd and rios together, if KW can pull of somethin like that and get a good young major leaguer out of it thatd be job well done by kenny.......make that happen, make the santos for Alonso deal happen , trade Q for the best young SP you can get OF of Alonso/De aza/Viciedo Sale Floyd Peavy Humber Young SP from Q or Danks trade Once PK retires and Dunns contracts up the sox will be working with some pretty good money as this team sans those 2 is dirt cheap and hella young Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtySox Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 QUOTE (2nd_city_saint787 @ Nov 22, 2011 -> 12:53 AM) Alonso has played in over a 100 games in LF in the minors. Yonder is absolutely abhorrent in LF. It's one of the primary reasons he's being shopped. He's a 1B or DH in the grand scheme of things, and he's currently blocked by Votto. I still remember Alonso's first MLB showing in left. It was against the Cubs, and he turned a Tony Campana single/double into an inside the park HR. You can view it here. Despite his defensive shortcomings, I'm a big fan of his. He can and will hit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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