JorgeFabregas Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 (edited) Jeff and Beau seem fine. What a prick this Cowley guy is. Edited December 15, 2011 by JorgeFabregas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (ScottyDo @ Dec 15, 2011 -> 09:17 PM) You're missing the point. It's fine to be critical of the Sox organization if enough evidence points in that direction. There are plenty of articles critical of management that I have NO problem with. The reason Cowley is despised is not because he criticizes the Sox, but that his criticism is always informed by his own petty squabbles and allegiances. His opinions are invalid because he can't see through his own distortion. No, I don't think I am missing the point. I agree with what you are saying. The point is that he is a columnist, as has been pointed out here, and they have their take on things and it is jaded in many ways by their allegiances with certain people. I am not sure his opinions are completely invalid though as being right half the time is better than being wrong all the time I guess. I do think he gets a bit to personal and snotty in his columns. Edited December 15, 2011 by elrockinMT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 No, I don't think I am missing the point. I agree with what you are saying. The point is that he is a columnist, as has been pointed out here, and they have their take on things and it is jaded in many ways by their allegiances with certain people. I am not sure his opinions are completely invalid though as being right half the time is better than being wrong all the time I guess. I do think he gets a bit to personal and snotty in his columns. No, you are missing the point. Coop flat out stated that he hasn't had a discussion with Cowley in over 2 years. 2 YEARS!!! How can you report on the conversations that take place between people that you have not even interviewed??? I mean, that's not even having an opinion, that's just flat out bulls***. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heads22 Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 Cowley likes me..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 QUOTE (Heads22 @ Dec 15, 2011 -> 02:46 PM) Cowley likes me..... thats cuz you guys are brahs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyDo Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Dec 15, 2011 -> 04:26 PM) No, I don't think I am missing the point. I agree with what you are saying. The point is that he is a columnist, as has been pointed out here, and they have their take on things and it is jaded in many ways by their allegiances with certain people. I am not sure his opinions are completely invalid though as being right half the time is better than being wrong all the time I guess. I do think he gets a bit to personal and snotty in his columns. Here's where we disagree, I think. The reason you have columnists is because you value their ability to analyze a situation and come up with a solid explanation or unique perspective. But if they only ever look at half of the story, they are incapable of coming up with a solid explanation OR a unique perspective (it was only unique the first time they wrote). Here's a clumsy metaphor: Say you're an insurance adjuster and you have to do cost/benefit analyses, but you only ever look at the costs when writing your reports. In that case, I've entrusted you to come up with an answer based on all available evidence, but you never once come up with a good analysis. You're not half-right, you're always wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Dec 15, 2011 -> 03:10 PM) thats cuz you guys are brahs Its true. They both like holding boobies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 QUOTE (Andrew @ Dec 15, 2011 -> 08:44 PM) No, you are missing the point. Coop flat out stated that he hasn't had a discussion with Cowley in over 2 years. 2 YEARS!!! How can you report on the conversations that take place between people that you have not even interviewed??? I mean, that's not even having an opinion, that's just flat out bulls***. Missing the point, or the part of the story about Cooper. I thought Cowley was talking to Danks and writing on that talk and it was about Coop? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 The story is at least one pitcher on the staff last year thought Coop was looking out for himself in the last year of his contract and wasn't the 'same old Coop' until he got his extension. Like it or not, that perception is a legit story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Dec 15, 2011 -> 04:56 PM) The story is at least one pitcher on the staff last year thought Coop was looking out for himself in the last year of his contract and wasn't the 'same old Coop' until he got his extension. Like it or not, that perception is a legit story. Possibly a legitimate basis for a story, but not written or executed like a professional news article. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Marty34 @ Dec 15, 2011 -> 04:56 PM) The story is at least one pitcher on the staff last year thought Coop was looking out for himself in the last year of his contract and wasn't the 'same old Coop' until he got his extension. Like it or not, that perception is a legit story. Then why make it seem like one of those two pitchers are Peavy or Danks? Why isn't the pitcher who actually said those things on the record? Compared to the Boston Red Sox situation, this is very much a fairly insignificant story. Everyone knows that Danks is on the way out, anyway. It was clever/cute that you made quite a few people get the impression (even an English major) that it was Danks who has an axe to grind with Don Cooper and the organization, but that's not quite the case, is it? As everyone has pointed out numerous times, the anti-Cowley/KW slant/bias shines through in every opinion column. Unfortunately in life, things are much more grey. So why isn't Joe capable of writing any type of article that demonstrates he has EVER looked at both sides of an issue and weighed the evidence carefully and with thoughtful consideration? If he wants to write for CCTV/China Daily here in China or TASS in Russia, his one-sidedness and agenda would be predictable if not ignored by the masses. I suppose, in the end, as long as you are controversial or Gossip Girl, you get more "page views" than someone who merely reports the facts. Certainly, no baseball columnist should just print word for word what the club says or act as the club's PR agent in proxy, that's for Reifert or Merkin to do at mlb.com or chisox.com. Or Chris Rongey. And while Phil Rogers does have a bit of a bias AGAINST KW, and favors Ozzie more (what reporter wouldn't, Ozzie made their jobs 100X easier)....he at least is willing to praise or extol something that Williams does which he agrees with, which hasn't been much at all recently. But the ability to recognize and analzye given situations is still there, more or less. Edited December 16, 2011 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyDo Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Dec 15, 2011 -> 06:56 PM) The story is at least one pitcher on the staff last year thought Coop was looking out for himself in the last year of his contract and wasn't the 'same old Coop' until he got his extension. Like it or not, that perception is a legit story. As a stand-alone story, this premise -- lame as it is -- might stand. In the context of Cowley's career, it's an incredibly transparent move, and one that should be beneath a columnist for a large newspaper. I mean, I'm not looking for New York Times integrity out of a sports columnist for the second paper in town, but you'd think he'd have some pride in his craft, and the ability to see the larger context of the things he does. I see no evidence to that effect, though. All I see is an immature boy who craves praise and attention. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Dec 15, 2011 -> 11:56 PM) The story is at least one pitcher on the staff last year thought Coop was looking out for himself in the last year of his contract and wasn't the 'same old Coop' until he got his extension. Like it or not, that perception is a legit story. The points being made here for and aganst are legit. Just a disagreement about whether it should or shouldn't be a story. Maybe Joe thinks he is an investigative reporter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 QUOTE (ScottyDo @ Dec 15, 2011 -> 05:19 PM) As a stand-alone story, this premise -- lame as it is -- might stand. In the context of Cowley's career, it's an incredibly transparent move, and one that should be beneath a columnist for a large newspaper. I mean, I'm not looking for New York Times integrity out of a sports columnist for the second paper in town, but you'd think he'd have some pride in his craft, and the ability to see the larger context of the things he does. I see no evidence to that effect, though. All I see is an immature boy who craves praise and attention. You can ask him yourself, he's been watching this board all day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Dec 15, 2011 -> 05:07 PM) Possibly a legitimate basis for a story, but not written or executed like a professional news article. And if these stories are really important, where are the stories about players wanting rid of Ozzie because of his lack of professionalism. We all heard the comments after he left from guys like Konerko. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 Cliff's notes version of a Cowley "column" concerning the White Sox: KW and Cooper are assholes, Ozzie is God. They are all pretty much the same thing. He "interviews" Danks, then has quotes from an unnamed pitcher. Who is that pitcher? Its not Danks. Its not Floyd, Cowley tells everyone how stupid he is all the time, couldn't use him as a legitimate source. I'm guessing its not Buehrle, he doesn't seem to have a problem with Cooper and wanted to come back, and its not Peavy, he said he has no problem with Cooper. Who can it be? Santos? Doubtful. The only one it really could be IMO is Thornton, so someone should ask Thornton if those were his quotes. I believe the pitcher could be Cowley. He didn't say it was a White Sox pitcher. He probably pitches whiffle balls to his kid so he can call himself a pitcher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 The Score today made it sound like Matt Thornton is one of Cowley's sources Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtySox Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 QUOTE (fathom @ Dec 15, 2011 -> 06:45 PM) The Score today made it sound like Matt Thornton is one of Cowley's sources He is. Has been for a while. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 (edited) Which is ironic, because Thornton's career was on the ropes when he was dumped for Borchard after underachieving for so long in SEA. Cooper is almost singlehandedly responsible for Matt being set for life financially. Mentally, the guy just wasn't the right one to be the closer...and perhaps he still holds some grudges against some of the coaches?? Which is, once again, why Danks/Thornton being traded would surprise absolutely nobody in baseball. Edited December 16, 2011 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 15, 2011 -> 06:58 PM) Which is ironic, because Thornton's career was on the ropes when he was dumped for Borchard after underachieving for so long in SEA. Cooper is almost singlehandedly responsible for Matt being set for life financially. Mentally, the guy just wasn't the right one to be the closer...and perhaps he still holds some grudges against some of the coaches?? Which is, once again, why Danks/Thornton being traded would suprise absolutely nobody in baseball. That's a great point. Thornton is probably selling cars if Cooper didn't fix him. If he did pop off, and we really have no idea, everyone thought the veteran who wanted to go if the Sox went young was AJ and he said no, or Peavy, and he and Cowley don't seem to have the same story, so that's doubtful, its weak sauce. I really think its probably a made up quote, but what a classy thing to do on twitter, rip Gonzo, the beat writer who is better than Cowley ever could be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 (edited) Missing the point, or the part of the story about Cooper. I thought Cowley was talking to Danks and writing on that talk and it was about Coop? True, and Danks only said that he thought Coop and JP need to "get on the same page." Next logical step would be talk to, really, EITHER one of the two and look into that before popping off about some huge impasse between the 2 parties that ...well, quite frankly won't even talk to him. But some guy remarks on his perception of the relationship between others, and he concludes that "Bridges need to be rebuilt" without even talking to the actual people he's making this proclamation about. And when they do speak up, surprise - the both state they have no problem with the other. Typical Cowley doucheyness. Edited December 16, 2011 by Andrew Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 That's a great point. Thornton is probably selling cars if Cooper didn't fix him. If he did pop off, and we really have no idea, everyone thought the veteran who wanted to go if the Sox went young was AJ and he said no, or Peavy, and he and Cowley don't seem to have the same story, so that's doubtful, its weak sauce. I really think its probably a made up quote, but what a classy thing to do on twitter, rip Gonzo, the beat writer who is better than Cowley ever could be. Absolutely. Cowley isn't fit to sniff Mark's jock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 QUOTE (Andrew @ Dec 15, 2011 -> 09:30 PM) Absolutely. Cowley isn't fit to sniff Mark's jock. Forgot about Gonzo, yeah....that makes a lot more sense than aiming arrows at Phil Rogers. Although Rogers has been a target for Cowley as well on a number of occasions in the past. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 If Thornton is the pitcher in question, he should go slit his wrists. He's nothing if Cooper hadn't saved his career. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 If Thornton is the pitcher in question, he should go slit his wrists. He's nothing if Cooper hadn't saved his career. C'mon, Milky. There is no pitcher. Completely made up s***. Consider the source. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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