Chisoxfn Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 01:41 PM) And in todays game, his length and quickness would be nothing special. Most teams have a guy with those type of dimensions (though probably better built) and quickness. Hakeem was the greatest defensive center in NBA history. Dwight will probably surpass him but Hakeem did some amazing things and he even did some pretty great things against a guy like Shaq (one of the most dominant players ever). You realize Jordan still ruled the entire league in the late 90's. At that point he was still the MVP and to top matters off the athleticism really hadn't changed. I look at the best players in the league today and compare them athletically to Jordan and I don't see a major difference. Heck, Luol Deng isn't even that athletic of a player. He's long and solid but he's not some freak athlete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenksismyhero Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 04:13 PM) Lebron is a better scoring Magic. Lebron is one of the greatest players I've ever seen. Unfortunately he doesn't have the "it" that Jordan/Kobe have. To compare him with Pippen is a slap in the face to Lebron. Lebron is one of the best passers in the game (Pippen was solid but he's no LBJ). Yeah, comparing him to a hall-of-fame, 50 best ever (while still playing), top 10 defensive player ever is a HUGE slap in the face. GMAFB. And Pippen wasn't too bad passing the ball either. Edited February 17, 2012 by Jenksismybitch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenksismyhero Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 04:13 PM) Sorry, i'll take 6'6" 215 lb Jordan. CLEARLY a superior physical specimen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 04:18 PM) Sorry, i'll take 6'6" 215 lb Jordan. CLEARLY a superior physical specimen. LOL. I know it doesn't need green, but someone's going to misinterpret this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MexSoxFan#1 Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 05:13 PM) Oh my god. I wouldn't wish a Bob Cousy video on my worst enemy. Don't do that to Mex. He was annoying as the color commentator on Celics (that's how he would pronounce Celtics) tv broadcasts. Edited February 17, 2012 by MexSoxFan#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 02:11 PM) OK come on now. We're going to the other extreme with this argument. We're closing in on "Ditka 110, Packers 3" territory. He was physically superior. Jordan in his prime was an incredible athlete. It wasn't alone what made him great, but he definitely was that. He'd still be just that in this league. There aren't many guys 6'7 who are as strong and athletic as he was playing in the NBA today. And the few that are, are pretty tremendous players. However, bball is more than just athletism, Jordan had the best midrange game in the league and an uncanny ability to finish in the paint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 02:16 PM) Yeah, comparing him to a hall-of-fame, 50 best ever (while still playing), top 10 defensive player ever is a HUGE slap in the face. GMAFB. And Pippen wasn't too bad passing the ball either. LBJ >>>>>>>> Pippen. Its not even close. Terrible argument. And like I said, this isn't a knock on Pipp. And there is a huge difference than being one of the 10 best ever and one of the top 50-70 ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenksismyhero Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 04:20 PM) He was physically superior. Jordan in his prime was an incredible athlete. It wasn't alone what made him great, but he definitely was that. He'd still be just that in this league. There aren't many guys 6'7 who are as strong and athletic as he was playing in the NBA today. And the few that are, are pretty tremendous players. However, bball is more than just athletism, Jordan had the best midrange game in the league and an uncanny ability to finish in the paint. Jordan wasn't 6'7" first off. And second , no, he wouldn't be superior to other people in today's game. He NEVER went against guys like Lebron, Wade or Howard. EVER. I'm not suggesting he'd become Steve Kerr in today's game, but this idea that he was some physical powerhouse is just not true. Hell, he wasn't that in his prime. He was always a finesse player much more than he was a physical player. And yes, his midrange game and post up game made him the greatest. I agree with you there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenksismyhero Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 04:21 PM) LBJ >>>>>>>> Pippen. Its not even close. Terrible argument. And like I said, this isn't a knock on Pipp. And there is a huge difference than being one of the 10 best ever and one of the top 50-70 ever. If Lebron doesn't win a title (and not backing into it with the help of Wade) he won't sniff the top 10 ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 04:23 PM) Jordan wasn't 6'7" first off. And second , no, he wouldn't be superior to other people in today's game. He NEVER went against guys like Lebron, Wade or Howard. EVER. I'm not suggesting he'd become Steve Kerr in today's game, but this idea that he was some physical powerhouse is just not true. Hell, he wasn't that in his prime. He was always a finesse player much more than he was a physical player. And yes, his midrange game and post up game made him the greatest. I agree with you there. lol. Please stop. Hakeem/Robinson >> Howard. Clyde Drexler was every bit the athlete/physical specimen that Wade is. I'll give you LeBron. But LeBron has never seen Jordan, either. When Jordan came back from baseball, he built up his upper body to the point that he looked like a mini-linebacker out there playing SG. You couldn't even attempt to push him off the block. It was futile. Edited February 17, 2012 by Jordan4life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenksismyhero Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) Ha, in looking at Jordan's wikipedia page, it says that #23 was retired in Chicago and Miami. Anyone know why Miami did that? edit: nm. the interwebs is full of knowledge: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/basketbal...heat_jordan_ap/ Edited February 17, 2012 by Jenksismybitch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 02:23 PM) Jordan wasn't 6'7" first off. And second , no, he wouldn't be superior to other people in today's game. He NEVER went against guys like Lebron, Wade or Howard. EVER. I'm not suggesting he'd become Steve Kerr in today's game, but this idea that he was some physical powerhouse is just not true. Hell, he wasn't that in his prime. He was always a finesse player much more than he was a physical player. And yes, his midrange game and post up game made him the greatest. I agree with you there. He went against guys like Hakeem. Hakeem was a dominant center. He went against Shaq in his prime. I don't get where people are making this argument that in a matter of 10 years the athletes are completely different. In a 20-30 year span sure. But Jordan played less than 14 years ago and he played with a good number of guys that were superstars in the current NBA (and guys he dominanted) so it is pretty easy to realize he'd still dominate, given that some of those guys were literally the best players in the current league (e.g. Kobe/Shaq/Duncan/etc). Excuse me...6'6. PS: J4L, great point in Clyde. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MexSoxFan#1 Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 05:23 PM) Jordan wasn't 6'7" first off. And second , no, he wouldn't be superior to other people in today's game. He NEVER went against guys like Lebron, Wade or Howard.EVER. I'm not suggesting he'd become Steve Kerr in today's game, but this idea that he was some physical powerhouse is just not true. Hell, he wasn't that in his prime. He was always a finesse player much more than he was a physical player. And yes, his midrange game and post up game made him the greatest. I agree with you there. WRONG MJ would take a s*** on Wade. Shaq>>>>>>Howard MJ would mindfvck the mentally weak LBJ MJ maybe was finesse early in career but after the beatings he took against Detroit, he bulked up, lost a little of his quickness but would dish out as much as he took, watch the Knicks/Bulls 90s playoffs, he was no pushover. Edited February 17, 2012 by MexSoxFan#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenksismyhero Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 04:29 PM) lol. Please stop. Hakeem/Robinson >> Howard. Clyde Drexler was every bit the athlete/physical specimen that Wade is. I'll give you LeBron. But LeBron has never seen Jordan, either. When Jordan came back from baseball, he built up his upper body to the point that he looked like a mini-linebacker out there playing SG. You couldn't even attempt to push him off the block. It was futile. Hakeem/Robinson >> Howard. As basketball players? Sure. Athletically? No. Clyde Drexler was every bit the athlete/physical specimen that Wade is. That's just laughable. Come on man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenksismyhero Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 I'll give you Shaq. That's an obvious mistake of mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 QUOTE (MexSoxFan#1 @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 04:31 PM) WRONG MJ would take a s*** on Wade. Shaq>>>>>>Howard MJ would mindfvck the mentally weak LBJ Shaq was definitely more talented than Dwight Howard. It's too bad he didn't keep himself in shape to be the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Also keep in mind that there was no 3-second rule in Jordan's day. Bigs could just camp out in the paint all game (especially against teams without a good scoring center) and go for blocks. I don't have my head so far up Jordan's ass that I think he'd average 50 PPG or something. Only thing I see suffering a little is his overall shooting percentage. Besides that? Please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 04:33 PM) Hakeem/Robinson >> Howard. As basketball players? Sure. Athletically? No. Clyde Drexler was every bit the athlete/physical specimen that Wade is. That's just laughable. Come on man. LMAO. Wrong. Howard has a little more mass and that suits his style of play. Quickness and athleticism? GMAB. It's time for you to read your kids a bed time story or something. And yes, Clyde was 6'7, 220 pounds of absolute beast before injuries curtailed his career. Edit. I reread. So you're talking purely athleticism? Then it's a lot closer. Howard is definitely bigger. He can jump higher. And that's good for the dunk contest, I guess. But it doesn't mean anything in actual games. You can definitely reference YT in this case. Robinson/Hakeem had athleticism/quickness that rivaled guards. Edited February 17, 2012 by Jordan4life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 04:35 PM) Also keep in mind that there was no 3-second rule in Jordan's day. Bigs could just camp out in the paint all game (especially against teams without a good scoring center) and go for blocks. I don't have my head so far up Jordan's ass that I think he'd average 50 PPG or something. Only thing I see suffering a little is his overall shooting percentage. Besides that? Please. He'd score 40 ppg, I do truly believe that. He'd probably average 20 free throws. Those would be some long games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenksismyhero Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 04:35 PM) Also keep in mind that there was no 3-second rule in Jordan's day. Bigs could just camp out in the paint all game (especially against teams without a good scoring center) and go for blocks. I don't have my head so far up Jordan's ass that I think he'd average 50 PPG or something. Only thing I see suffering a little is his overall shooting percentage. Besides that? Please. And i'm not arguing that Jordan would suck. But the idea that he would be physically "superior" in the league is just laughable. As a whole the league is bigger and more athletic. Maybe some outliers are comparable, but in general he'd have a more difficult time in today's league. Guys could keep up with him better. Doesn't mean they'd stop him or render him ineffective, but it would make things more difficult on him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MexSoxFan#1 Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 05:38 PM) He'd score 40 ppg, I do truly believe that. He'd probably average 20 free throws. Those would be some long games. He scored 37 ppg on 50+% in the era of handchecking, no flagrants and quality bigs, he gets 40+ easily today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenksismyhero Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 04:38 PM) LMAO. Wrong. Howard has a little more mass and that suits his style of play. Quickness and athleticism? GMAB. It's time for you to read your kids a bed time story or something. And yes, Clyde was 6'7, 220 pounds of absolute beast before injuries curtailed his career. Howard has a 7.5 foot wingspan. He would jump those guys out of the gym. Come on now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 04:41 PM) And i'm not arguing that Jordan would suck. But the idea that he would be physically "superior" in the league is just laughable. As a whole the league is bigger and more athletic. Maybe some outliers are comparable, but in general he'd have a more difficult time in today's league. Guys could keep up with him better. Doesn't mean they'd stop him or render him ineffective, but it would make things more difficult on him. He wasn't the most athletic player in the game in 1998 when he was 35 and played the whole season with torn ligaments in the index finger of his shooting hand. And he still won, like, everything. MJ was the perfect combination of physical assets, skills and fundamentals. If twirpy ass Kevin Durant can do what he does...MJ? C'mon now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Feb 17, 2012 -> 04:46 PM) Howard has a 7.5 foot wingspan. He would jump those guys out of the gym. Come on now. Hey, Dwight can definitely take them in a dunk contest. No argument there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MexSoxFan#1 Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) At the risk of coming off as a MJ fan boy, how many people here really think a MJ led team going up against a LBJ led team, with teams being equal, that LBJ would win a 7 game series? MJ was a ruthless SOB, he would get in LBJ's head (not hard to do if Terry could do it) and he would humiliate him, book it. Edited February 17, 2012 by MexSoxFan#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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