Quin Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 02:22 PM) I hope they can. If they move him and Floyd the payroll would be at ~92M and they could make a serious run at Cespedes. Sign him and put Viciedo on the block. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 02:21 PM) If he stayed healthy, he'd never have been traded to SD. He was going regardless. Viciedo is playing RF and KW wasn't going to pay Quentin if he was healthy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (fathom @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 02:23 PM) IMO, Viciedo is more valuable to the Sox than he is on the trade market. And wouldn't our strongest selling point to Cespedes be the strong Cuban presence currently in our starting lineup? I'm fairly certain that's our only selling point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (Kalapse @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 09:25 PM) And wouldn't our strongest selling point to Cespedes be the strong Cuban presence currently in our starting lineup? I'm fairly certain that's our only strong selling point. Agreed, but that also is probably why the Marlins are in the driver's seat for him (Cuban presence in the community) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (Kalapse @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 02:25 PM) And wouldn't our strongest selling point to Cespedes be the strong Cuban presence currently in our starting lineup? I'm fairly certain that's our only strong selling point. It depends. I'd imagine he knows the Sox Cuban players. There's always a chance he doesn't like them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted December 31, 2011 Author Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 02:24 PM) He was going regardless. Viciedo is playing RF and KW wasn't going to pay Quentin if he was healthy. If Quentin stayed healthy, he might have been able to keep putting numbers closer to 2008. KW would have paid him for 140-150+ games of that type of production. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiliIrishHammock24 Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Lol, Ozzie with a congrats and appreciation for Quentin, but then dogged him for his inability to hit sliders. Ouch! Give 'em hell, Q! @OzzieGuillen Ozzie Guillen i know u gave me 100 percent everyday on and off the field u r good man suck that we have to face u now hahah sliders away c u soon kid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 02:27 PM) It depends. I'd imagine he knows the Sox Cuban players. There's always a chance he doesn't like them. Supposedly he and Alexei played together at some point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 02:27 PM) It depends. I'd imagine he knows the Sox Cuban players. There's always a chance he doesn't like them. Well, if he doesn't like them then we don't have a shot in hell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (fathom @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 02:26 PM) Agreed, but that also is probably why the Marlins are in the driver's seat for him (Cuban presence in the community) All the points are valid, but its still probably coming down to the team that gives him the most money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 09:29 PM) All the points are valid, but its still probably coming down to the team that gives him the most money. Sounds like it's going to be the Marlins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Kalapse @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 02:29 PM) Well, if he doesn't like them then we don't have a shot in hell. People do a lot crazier things than work with people they don't like in exchange for more money than others are willing to pay. I don't know what this guy is thinking, maybe he thinks of Alexei like a brother, but I don't think having Cubans on the roster or a large Cuban community gets him signed unless you are at the top or very close to the top bid. Edited December 31, 2011 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 09:31 PM) People do a lot crazier things than work with people they don't like in exchange for more money than others are willing to pay. Yeah, do you think everyone on Ohio State's football team really likes each other? Just kidding rock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 02:31 PM) People do a lot crazier things than work with people they don't like in exchange for more money than others are willing to pay. I don't know what this guy is thinking, maybe he thinks of Alexei like a brother, but I don't think having Cubans on the roster or a large Cuban community gets him signed unless you are at the top or very close to the top bid. Well, no s***. I'm looking at factors outside of money. You have to assume the top offers will be fairly close unless someone makes a ridiculous bid then he goes there, so there's really no point in discussing any of this unless we're going to explore factors outside of money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MurcieOne Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 I don't see this team returning to the playoffs while KW is still GM. He's NOT the GM to rebuild this roster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (Kalapse @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 02:34 PM) Well, no s***. I'm looking at factors outside of money. I'm saying money is the most important, all that other stuff is way down on the list, but if he does sign with the Marlins he will point out the large Cuban community, the latin manager.......its just lip service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Honestly, I'd take a little less to work everyday with familiar faces who understand where I'm from and speak my language. And by work around, I mean in the lineup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 02:29 PM) All the points are valid, but its still probably coming down to the team that gives him the most money. Just like it did when the Marlins signed Wilson and Pujols? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (MurcieOne @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 02:36 PM) I don't see this team returning to the playoffs while KW is still GM. He's NOT the GM to rebuild this roster. If Viciedo gives you what Quentin has given you, and De Aza can play everyday, it won't hurt the Sox winning percentage in 2012. Even if he gets $7 million to $8 million for 2012 and isn't signed beyond that, its seems hard for me to believe you can't get at least one top 10 prospect from somebody. Trading Quentin I can understand, I just don't like the haul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 My dad just slammed Castro and Hernandez because "KW traded for them, so they suck" He's a little angry over Buehrle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiliIrishHammock24 Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 03:44 PM) My dad just slammed Castro and Hernandez because "KW traded for them, so they suck" He's a little angry over Buehrle. Your dad must post on MLBTR. Almost every time the Sox make a move, a hoard of Cubs fans and KW haters flood the comment section and tell everyone how awful KW is and how "xxxx" is a terrible player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 02:41 PM) Just like it did when the Marlins signed Wilson and Pujols? A little different situation. Chances are if Wilson and Pujols both had bank accounts that resembled the Cuban's current one, they are Marlins right now. Wilson was going home and Pujols wanted a no trade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 03:43 PM) If Viciedo gives you what Quentin has given you, and De Aza can play everyday, it won't hurt the Sox winning percentage in 2012. Even if he gets $7 million to $8 million for 2012 and isn't signed beyond that, its seems hard for me to believe you can't get at least one top 10 prospect from somebody. Trading Quentin I can understand, I just don't like the haul. If you look at the fangraphs world, last year he was worth about $12 million, so the surplus value if he repeated his 2011 season would be about $4 million. However, the 2 previous seasons, he was a negative value player, with his weak/injury riddle offense not offsetting his bad defense. Over the last 3 seasons, Carlos has averaged a $3.5 million player value, and he's getting paid $7-8 million. He had that 1 season, 2008, wehre he put up a $20 million value, but that was 4 seasons ago now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (oldsox @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 02:03 PM) Neither one of these guys were on the San Diego 40 man roster. We are now down to 35 on ours. Why did we expose Doyle again? Actually both are listed on the Padres 40-man. So the Sox are at 37 now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 31, 2011 -> 02:48 PM) If you look at the fangraphs world, last year he was worth about $12 million, so the surplus value if he repeated his 2011 season would be about $4 million. However, the 2 previous seasons, he was a negative value player, with his weak/injury riddle offense not offsetting his bad defense. Over the last 3 seasons, Carlos has averaged a $3.5 million player value, and he's getting paid $7-8 million. He had that 1 season, 2008, wehre he put up a $20 million value, but that was 4 seasons ago now. So he was worth $12 million last year, that's not bad, although fangraphs "worth" I have never taken too seriously. I think the only reason KW settled for this return is Viciedo. If he wasn't in the organization, KW would have held out for more or just kept Quentin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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