Kyyle23 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 08:01 AM) I could actually see them trading Bradford. You get Luck then, and a s***load of other picks and/or players. yeah, but they will never get back that money they paid him upfront(50 mil in guarantees), and then they will be turning around and paying Luck a similar chunk of money. I think St Louis could do it, but it would be a really tough decision to make. Plus, you look at Bradfords season this year, and you wonder what the return would be for an often injured, extremely inconsistent QB that hasnt really done anything yet at the NFL level Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 31, 2011 Author Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 08:06 AM) yeah, but they will never get back that money they paid him upfront(50 mil in guarantees), and then they will be turning around and paying Luck a similar chunk of money. I think St Louis could do it, but it would be a really tough decision to make. Plus, you look at Bradfords season this year, and you wonder what the return would be for an often injured, extremely inconsistent QB that hasnt really done anything yet at the NFL level What does the money look like for the #1 pick now? I just can't see anyone turning this kid down. He is a once in a generation type by all indications. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 09:07 AM) What does the money look like for the #1 pick now? I just can't see anyone turning this kid down. He is a once in a generation type by all indications. 4 year deal, $22 million guaranteed for Cam Newton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 08:04 AM) Rogers was a mid-20's pick who a lot of people thought had serious mechanical issues coming out of college. Having Rogers start right away was an invitation to turning him into Alex Smith. Having Luck sit for 3 years is a complete waste...he ought to be starting by day 1 in the league. LOL, ok. So you say. Indy has a tough decision to make, and they have to trust Peyton will be honest with them. Once you f*** with the neck, it doesnt get better for you, It only becomes a manageable situation. Peytons profession could make that situation ten times worse in one hit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 31, 2011 Author Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 08:10 AM) LOL, ok. So you say. Indy has a tough decision to make, and they have to trust Peyton will be honest with them. Once you f*** with the neck, it doesnt get better for you, It only becomes a manageable situation. Peytons profession could make that situation ten times worse in one hit I think the Colts have an easier pick than the Rams do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 08:10 AM) I think the Colts have an easier pick than the Rams do. I think they take him for sure. I know my father is no professional athlete, but the neck surgery he had 9 years ago reduced him to a shell of his former self. He cant feel his fingers, gets shooting pains down his arms, cant sleep well. its bad news. Say Miami and Indy end the season 0-fer, how is the pick decided? It cant be SOS if both of them lost every game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 09:10 AM) LOL, ok. So you say. Records of this were not hard to find. Questions about Rodgers involve his throwing mechanics, ability to consistently deliver the long ball, and even his coaching. California coach Jeff Tedford has groomed a significant number of excellent college passers who have not always translated to the pros. Kyle Boller, his most recent draftee, has struggled early in his Baltimore Ravens career. "There's been a big knock on me as a Tedford product," Rodgers said, "and a lot of those guys have been in situations where we were not around a good supporting cast. I'm going to have the opportunity, when my time comes, be it next year, two years, whatever, to have a good supporting cast in place." Link As we've stated earlier, Aaron Rodgers has given his college coach, Cal football head coach Jeff Tedford, a lot of credit for his development as an elite NFL quarterback. Rodgers has stated he's gotten the "best of the best" from Tedford's tutelage, and he wouldn't be the quarterback he is without his time as a Golden Bear. One thing emphasized his is perfect throwing motion. We've already managed to debunk how Tedford did not instruct his pupil to hold the ball higher than normal; the motion was already present before Rodgers arrived at Cal, and Tedford decided not to mess with it. But what about the throwing motion? Well, the big thing about Rodgers is how quick he can get the ball out of his hands, but also how well he can adjust and find receivers when he's on the run (managing to throw the ball on regular routes, but also finding them when the play breaks down). Combine that with his added arm strength, and he's become a very solid NFL quarterback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 31, 2011 Author Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 08:13 AM) I think they take him for sure. I know my father is no professional athlete, but the neck surgery he had 9 years ago reduced him to a shell of his former self. He cant feel his fingers, gets shooting pains down his arms, cant sleep well. its bad news. Say Miami and Indy end the season 0-fer, how is the pick decided? It cant be SOS if both of them lost every game Coin flip is the ultimate tie breaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 08:14 AM) Records of this were not hard to find. Link Im not arguing the fact that he had questionable mechanics balta. You say it was risking him becoming an Alex Smith, the situations arent even close to compareable. Smith had a different OC every season, and was surrounded in absolute s*** talent and coaching for the first 6 years of his career. Aaron Rodgers has had the same coaching staff from his second year on, with a ready made playoff team surrounding him as well. They arent even close to the same situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 09:18 AM) Im not arguing the fact that he had questionable mechanics balta. You say it was risking him becoming an Alex Smith, the situations arent even close to compareable. Smith had a different OC every season, and was surrounded in absolute s*** talent and coaching for the first 6 years of his career. Aaron Rodgers has had the same coaching staff from his second year on, with a ready made playoff team surrounding him as well. They arent even close to the same situation. Do you think that if Aaron Rogers had somehow stepped in and been given the starting job right away that he'd have had this level of success? I suppose its possible, but I would say that both physically, technically, and psychologically, the 3 years on the bench were incredibly important for him. I don't see Luck needing anything like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 08:20 AM) Do you think that if Aaron Rogers had somehow stepped in and been given the starting job right away that he'd have had this level of success? I suppose its possible, but I would say that both physically, technically, and psychologically, the 3 years on the bench were incredibly important for him. I don't see Luck needing anything like that. Read my post again if you think I said that. And whether Luck needs that or not is totally irrelevant. Luck is an incredible asset for a team like Indy, and having him as a backup option to Manning who could go down at any time and be done forever, that is an awesome thing to have. Something that the Chargers had for a short period of time with brees and rivers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 09:21 AM) Read my post again if you think I said that. Then you're agreeing with my original statement that having Aaron Rogers start right away was an invitation for him to become a mediocre quarterback? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 08:22 AM) Then you're agreeing with my original statement that having Aaron Rogers start right away was an invitation for him to become a mediocre quarterback? Not at all. I think he would have started out at the very minimum as a competent if not very good QB. As he played more and matured, he would have become what we see now, if not sooner than he did before. Nice try at twisting my words though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 09:21 AM) Read my post again if you think I said that. And whether Luck needs that or not is totally irrelevant. Luck is an incredible asset for a team like Indy, and having him as a backup option to Manning who could go down at any time and be done forever, that is an awesome thing to have. Something that the Chargers had for a short period of time with brees and rivers QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 09:25 AM) Not at all. I think he would have started out at the very minimum as a competent if not very good QB. As he played more and matured, he would have become what we see now, if not sooner than he did before. Nice try at twisting my words though The post where you said "Read my post again if you think I said that" was in regards to me asking if you thought Rogers would have attained this same level of success if he was given the starting job right away. In your first post here, you cast doubt on yourself having said that, in the 2nd post, you argue that is exactly the case. Anyway...I think Rogers would have stepped in right away and produced multiple years of struggling, of the sort that cost offensive coordinators their job regularly. And yes, I think that's the path to being Alex-Smithed. I'll leave it at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 30, 2011 -> 05:57 PM) Hell, he's close enough that I don't care. Well, that's convenient. He made a pass yesterday (an out route) that made Henry Burriss look like Johnny Unitas. The dude just can't throw the football and makes poor decisions. His own team is probably already ready to give up on him... I bet we see Orton on Sunday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 08:28 AM) The post where you said "Read my post again if you think I said that" was in regards to me asking if you thought Rogers would have attained this same level of success if he was given the starting job right away. In your first post here, you cast doubt on yourself having said that, in the 2nd post, you argue that is exactly the case. Anyway...I think Rogers would have stepped in right away and produced multiple years of struggling, of the sort that cost offensive coordinators their job regularly. And yes, I think that's the path to being Alex-Smithed. I'll leave it at that. Balta, this is exactly what I said in my first post: QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 07:59 AM) Rodgers sat for 3, and I think we all can see that he probably could have come in sooner and played competently, if not very well. That is not referring to his career, that is referring to his first season starting, and my second above quote shows that I was referring to his first year. That is not an Alex Smith career indictment right there. He very well may have struggled out of the gate, but personally I think Rodgers would have figured his s*** out a hell of a lot quicker than Alex Smith has done, particularly because Green Bay surrounded him with players that will help him achieve the success he currently is enjoying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 09:34 AM) Well, that's convenient. He made a pass yesterday (an out route) that made Henry Burriss look like Johnny Unitas. The dude just can't throw the football and makes poor decisions. His own team is probably already ready to give up on him... I bet we see Orton on Sunday. Wouldn't surprise me to see Orton again soon either...which is why Denver should have moved either him or Tebow. One of the two. They're doing a spectacular job of making sure Tebow is set up to fail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (Brian @ Oct 30, 2011 -> 09:01 PM) Wonder how the media would treat Romo if he was the QB in Jacksonville his whole career or a smaller market. I think it's about time for Dallas to look for new options. Romo clearly doesn't have what it takes. I mean, my goodness, how many elite receivers do you need? Jay Cutler would obliterate the world with Miles Austin, Dez Bryant, and Jason Witten (of course, he'd get dealt for a 3rd rounder because of Martz, but oh well). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cabiness42 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 I think they take him for sure. I know my father is no professional athlete, but the neck surgery he had 9 years ago reduced him to a shell of his former self. He cant feel his fingers, gets shooting pains down his arms, cant sleep well. its bad news. Say Miami and Indy end the season 0-fer, how is the pick decided? It cant be SOS if both of them lost every game Yes, you can still use SOS as a tiebreaker. If you went 0-16 against a weaker schedule, then technically you were worse than the team that went 0-16 against a tougher schedule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 08:35 AM) Wouldn't surprise me to see Orton again soon either...which is why Denver should have moved either him or Tebow. One of the two. They're doing a spectacular job of making sure Tebow is set up to fail. Elway & Fox want nothing to do with Tebow. I think they are just showing the fanbase how bad he is, so they don't get upset when they move him in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoSox05 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 08:34 AM) Balta, this is exactly what I said in my first post: That is not referring to his career, that is referring to his first season starting, and my second above quote shows that I was referring to his first year. That is not an Alex Smith career indictment right there. He very well may have struggled out of the gate, but personally I think Rodgers would have figured his s*** out a hell of a lot quicker than Alex Smith has done, particularly because Green Bay surrounded him with players that will help him achieve the success he currently is enjoying. Rodgers would have struggled had he started day one, but I think only for a year. His first year in the NFL during training camp and preseason he looked a little lost. The next year he looked ten times better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 09:52 AM) Elway & Fox want nothing to do with Tebow. I think they are just showing the fanbase how bad he is, so they don't get upset when they move him in the future. Then they shouldn't have benched Orton for him in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 09:00 AM) Then they shouldn't have benched Orton for him in the first place. benching him when they did was the right move. not trading him to miami when they had the chance was the wrong move. if they let orton continue to suck like he was, the groundswell support for tebow would have just grown to epic proportions, they had to let the fans see tebow in all of his glory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 09:00 AM) Then they shouldn't have benched Orton for him in the first place. What? If they didn't bench Orton, then Tebow would be on the bench and the fans would be clamoring for him to start. This way, the fans get their Tebow, and Elway can show everyone why he wants nothing to do with the kid, while trying to find a QB he likes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 31, 2011 Author Share Posted October 31, 2011 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Oct 31, 2011 -> 08:25 AM) Not at all. I think he would have started out at the very minimum as a competent if not very good QB. As he played more and matured, he would have become what we see now, if not sooner than he did before. Nice try at twisting my words though Plenty of QBs have stepped in on day one as a rookie and been just fine. There is this one guy in Indianapolis who comes to mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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