Balta1701 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (maggsmaggs @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 04:16 PM) This tweet from Brad Biggs, very nicely surmises the clusterf*** that now is the Bears offensive line. So, Olin Kreutz led a group that allowed the most sacks in the league and I'm supposed to be mad that he's gone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 31, 2011 Author Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 03:18 PM) So, Olin Kreutz led a group that allowed the most sacks in the league and I'm supposed to be mad that he's gone? That logic doesn't make any sense. Just because they are the worst doesn't mean they could be worse still. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 04:30 PM) That logic doesn't make any sense. Just because they are the worst doesn't mean they could be worse still. But it does mean that it's hard for any move to even be a lateral move, and easy for it to be an upgrade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maggsmaggs Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 03:31 PM) But it does mean that it's hard for any move to even be a lateral move, and easy for it to be an upgrade. But this lateral move also comes at the expense of all the intangibles that Kreutz brings. While those things aren't as important as on-the-field production, the intangibles still have their place. Add to the fact that now you have pissed off some of the key players of the Bears, including the coach, it creates a rift between the front office and team. The latter part is what bugs me the most because it is REALLY easy to upgrade from 2010, but we haven't. Chris Harris has joined the Bears' front office bashing: ChrisHarrisNFL Chris Harris Olin Kreutz departure won't sit well in the locker room for a few days #realtalk ChrisHarrisNFL Chris Harris All I can say is wow when it comes to Olin Kreutz ............REALLY?!?!??!?! Edited July 31, 2011 by maggsmaggs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (maggsmaggs @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 04:38 PM) But this lateral move also comes at the expense of all the intangibles that Kreutz brings. While those things aren't as important as on-the-field production, the intangibles still have their place. Add to the fact that now you have pissed off some of the key players of the Bears, including the coach, it creates a rift between the front office and team. The latter part is what bugs me the most because it is REALLY easy to upgrade from 2010, but we haven't. That's what I'm saying too though...intangibles really don't do that much if a guy simply doesn't have it any more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 If the Bears had the top offensive line last year maybe Id be more worried about his leadership or intangibles. I guess Id rather hope Carimi becomes the leader as hes actually played with great offensive lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 04:47 PM) If the Bears had the top offensive line last year maybe Id be more worried about his leadership or intangibles. I guess Id rather hope Carimi becomes the leader as hes actually played with great offensive lines. Heck, even a "tolerable" offensive line you can be more worried about intangibles. It's like the White Sox benched Dunn permanently and people were worried about the intangibles he brought to the lineup. He's been bad, the lineup's been bad, you can't get me mad about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maggsmaggs Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 03:45 PM) That's what I'm saying too though...intangibles really don't do that much if a guy simply doesn't have it any more. But if two players are quite similar in ability, intangibles should be the deciding factor. I mean, if this was Shaun O'Hara, I would have no issues with the move because he is clearly better. I just don't see the upgrade in the Spencer move. Edited July 31, 2011 by maggsmaggs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 The Bears players will have to move on. Hell most heard the same rumblings when Mike Brown was not brought back and was the leader (according to Bear players/coaches) of that defense. Difference is, they had Urlacher who stepped in. I don't see that on the offensive side of the ball unless Cutler grows a pair (ala Drew Brees). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (maggsmaggs @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 04:51 PM) But if two players are quite similar in ability, intangibles should be the deciding factor. I mean, if this was Shaun O'Hara, I would have no issues with the move because he is clearly better. I just don't see the upgrade in the Spencer move. A 29 year old versus a 34 year old is one other thing that could easily be called the "Deciding factor". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHarris1 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 I obviously understand the disappointment over losing Kreutz but IMO the players need to shut the f*** up. Be a professional and move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesoxbrian Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 It's ridiculous that Kreutz wasn't brought back for only $500k more but it's also ridiculous that he didn't just take $4m. It's time to move on though, and the players have to as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (whitesoxbrian @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 05:49 PM) It's ridiculous that Kreutz wasn't brought back for only $500k more but it's also ridiculous that he didn't just take $4m. It's time to move on though, and the players have to as well. Kreutz was going down hill, I just need the Bears to do something with that O-Line. If we head into 2011 with Gabe Carimi as the only addition on the O-Line, while slightly downgrading at center, I will be a pretty unhappy camper. Cutler deserves protection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesoxbrian Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 05:57 PM) Kreutz was going down hill, I just need the Bears to do something with that O-Line. If we head into 2011 with Gabe Carimi as the only addition on the O-Line, while slightly downgrading at center, I will be a pretty unhappy camper. Cutler deserves protection. If anything, Spencer was as good as Kreutz is, and I'd be willing to bet he was better. There were 2 or 3 times per game where I'd watch a toss to Forte for a gain of nothing and say "why is Kreutz just standing there and why the f*** did he not hit anyone?" I agree though that they need to add another OL. Sean Locklear, Brian Waters, Trei Essex, Max Starks, Derrick Dockery, Kyle DeVan, and Ryan Harris are all still out there. There's still time because they won't be able to practice until Thursday anyways. I'd prefer it gets done soon though, because I'd like to get them the playbook asap. Edited July 31, 2011 by whitesoxbrian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 05:57 PM) Cutler deserves protection. Kristin Cavallari disagrees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 QUOTE (whitesoxbrian @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 07:01 PM) If anything, Spencer was as good as Kreutz is, and I'd be willing to bet he was better. There were 2 or 3 times per game where I'd watch a toss to Forte for a gain of nothing and say "why is Kreutz just standing there and why the f*** did he not hit anyone?" I agree though that they need to add another OL. Sean Locklear, Brian Waters, Trei Essex, Max Starks, Derrick Dockery, Kyle DeVan, and Ryan Harris are all still out there. There's still time because they won't be able to practice until Thursday anyways. I'd prefer it gets done soon though, because I'd like to get them the playbook asap. I haven't seen contract details yet, but it's probably also a good guess that spencer will make half as much as Kreutz, or something like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 I'll copy and paste my Facebook status: So I guess ever since it became clear Olin Kreutz wasn't being brought back, it's been a nonstop hyperventilation-fest by Bears fans. You could be forgiven for having this lead you to assume he was still the same player from 5 years ago. Breathe, everyone... the fact that a player is an icon and you have an emotional attachment doesn't change the fact that his best days are behind him. Everyone is replaceable unless you're a superstar and even those guys do fade after a while. But if you're just going to miss watching him yell at opposing defenders... stop it! The guy's main job is to block... he wasn't that good at it anymore. The truth sucks sometimes. He was the "anchor" of an offensive line that gave up 56 sacks and didn't run block for half a season. If we see Spencer not getting pushed into the backfield on running plays or unable to push a guy 1 yard on 1st and goal from the 1, people will forget about Kreutz's intangibles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 Olin Kreutz, quite frankly, was not in a position where he could justify demanding how much money he gets. The way the Bears handled it was a polite way of saying "we want you, but not that bad." Spencer, at worst, was a lateral move. The OL isn't automatically "better" but is unlikely to make it worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 (edited) I will say this, since we're all focusing on the negative (even though lots of players remain). I f***ing love the Marion Barber signing. He's a high-motor guy who is going to make those 3rd and shorts really attainable. Edited July 31, 2011 by Steve9347 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHarris1 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 So evidently based on Angelo's press conference there will be no more OL additions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (WHarris1 @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 06:41 PM) So evidently based on Angelo's press conference there will be no more OL additions. Yikes. I like a couple of the FA rookie signings they brought in, but not for a team that is in "win now" mode. I also find it funny that the Bears signed Spencer, who the Seahawks cut to make room for Max Unger, which was originally the Bears second round pick in 2009, whom the Bears traded out of for multiple picks to get Mr. "jump out of the pool" Jarron Gilbert (who was cut from the team) and Henry Melton. (who is a fringe backup) Edited July 31, 2011 by SoxAce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 I thought Olin's play had really went downhill last 2 years I have no problem he is gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 1, 2011 Share Posted August 1, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 03:45 PM) That's what I'm saying too though...intangibles really don't do that much if a guy simply doesn't have it any more. Exactly. If his intangibles were so off the charts, why was the line so bad? IMO, Olin was a good player for several years, but his current version won't be missed as dearly as many think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maggsmaggs Posted August 1, 2011 Share Posted August 1, 2011 QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 06:29 PM) I will say this, since we're all focusing on the negative (even though lots of players remain). I f***ing love the Marion Barber signing. He's a high-motor guy who is going to make those 3rd and shorts really attainable. Well I will be positive in saying that I love the Okoye and Ghoston signings. Both are young and athletic, and could thrive with the Bears in the 4-3 scheme where they aren't counted on as starters, but rather spot duty. QUOTE (WHarris1 @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 06:41 PM) So evidently based on Angelo's press conference there will be no more OL additions. DUMB. STUPID. IDIOTIC. Regardless of the Kreutz-Spencer swap, which seems lateral, we still have Swiss-cheese-sized holes at guard and tackle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 1, 2011 Share Posted August 1, 2011 (edited) Kruetz may retire, says it wasn't about the money with the Bears. Seems to me he was hoping for a little more and wanted the Bears to enter a bidding war with themselves. Edited August 1, 2011 by Dick Allen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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