Dick Allen Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (SuperSteve @ Jan 24, 2012 -> 06:10 PM) All of the Tigers fans I know are pretty excited about this move. The Huge Show (mid-Michigan's version of the Afternoon Saloon) spent a lot of time on it too. Everyone seems to have such high hopes. Looks like I'll be seeing more Tigers games this year. Can't wait to see Miggy at 3b hahaha. No question, if they remain healthy, it will be a fun team for Tiger fans to watch, at least when they are hitting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danman31 Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 24, 2012 -> 06:06 PM) I'd say that Pujols is a significantly better player right now, and a significantly better physical specimen right now, and thus, I'd still expect Pujols to age vastly better than Fielder. And to top it off, Fielder has to compete with another guy for the DH spot over the next 5 years. I'll agree to both counts, but Fielder is 5 years younger and his deal lasts one year less. Pujols can age significantly better and still be too damn old by the end of his deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 25, 2012 Author Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (SuperSteve @ Jan 24, 2012 -> 06:10 PM) All of the Tigers fans I know are pretty excited about this move. The Huge Show (mid-Michigan's version of the Afternoon Saloon) spent a lot of time on it too. Everyone seems to have such high hopes. Looks like I'll be seeing more Tigers games this year. Can't wait to see Miggy at 3b hahaha. Is that the same guy from AM 1000 years ago? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSteve Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 24, 2012 -> 09:49 PM) Is that the same guy from AM 1000 years ago? I'm not sure to be honest. It's Bill Simonson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (SuperSteve @ Jan 24, 2012 -> 10:10 PM) I'm not sure to be honest. It's Bill Simonson. Yep, same guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macsandz Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 The Prince effect in Detroit?....2 WINS. Fielder is a 5 WAR player. V-Mart was a 3 WAR Player. That's an insane investment for 2 freaking wins next season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macsandz Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jan 24, 2012 -> 05:34 PM) Yes, I think as for as RH hitters go you've got the clear #1 in Pujols, followed closely by Miggy and then I'd say Braun. Miguel has never had this type of protection behind him before. He could have his best year yet. That whole "protection" concept has been disproven over and again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtySox Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Jan 24, 2012 -> 04:40 PM) The WORST thing KW could do is try and counter the Tigers right now with anything other than improving the system with high ceiling, cost-controlled talent. I'm praying that this is Kenny's plan right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Jan 24, 2012 -> 09:32 PM) The Prince effect in Detroit?....2 WINS. Fielder is a 5 WAR player. V-Mart was a 3 WAR Player. That's an insane investment for 2 freaking wins next season. Yeah, well, they didn't sign him for one year. And Fielder's upside is that of a 6/6.5. QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Jan 24, 2012 -> 09:34 PM) That whole "protection" concept has been disproven over and again. '94 Frank Thomas disagrees. As good as he was from '91'-93, he was making a mockery of the sport in '94 once they put Julio Franco behind him instead of a washed up George Bell or a broken down Bo Jackson. But keep deluding yourself into thinking that the Tigers didn't get a whole lot better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 25, 2012 Author Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (SuperSteve @ Jan 24, 2012 -> 09:10 PM) I'm not sure to be honest. It's Bill Simonson. Ha, that's funny. His disappeared after he got his ass kicked Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSteve Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jan 24, 2012 -> 10:48 PM) Yeah, well, they didn't sign him for one year. And Fielder's upside is that of a 6/6.5. '94 Frank Thomas disagrees. As good as he was from '91'-93, he was making a mockery of the sport in '94 once they put Julio Franco behind him instead of a washed up George Bell or a broken down Bo Jackson. But keep deluding yourself into thinking that the Tigers didn't get a whole lot better. Plus VMart will be worth zero wins next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (SuperSteve @ Jan 24, 2012 -> 09:55 PM) Plus VMart will be worth zero wins next year. That is also a stellar point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpd9189 Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Maybe this move helps the Sox in the later years (even though I don't think it's close to as bad as Soriano, ARod, Pujols deals) when Prince is in decline and costing the Tigers a ton of money but in the short term, this move sucks for us. Detroit is without a doubt top dog in the AL Central now. While I hope the Sox can be competitive and keep us interested this year, if they start to fall out of it by June/July then I hope KW a page from what the new Cubs brass is doing and start trading guys for some high end prospects. I'd rather go with a rebuild then watch a mediocre at best team the next few years really do nothing in the American League. There's just too many teams better then us right now. If we can maybe get some prospects to build up the farm system again, we could be real players again in a couple of years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 25, 2012 Author Share Posted January 25, 2012 jaysonst Jayson Stark Did some checking on Prince's HRs. RF in Comerica is 339 feet. Shortest Prince HR to RF in any park last year was 363. #somuchforparkfactor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 08:31 AM) jaysonst Jayson Stark Did some checking on Prince's HRs. RF in Comerica is 339 feet. Shortest Prince HR to RF in any park last year was 363. #somuchforparkfactor Park factor analysis has become borderline ridiculous. It started with Coors back in the late 90's. Which was justified. And I certainly understand Petco. I think it applies some to average players/pichers. But the elite will be elite anywhere. Otherwise they're not elite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macsandz Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Yeah, well, they didn't sign him for one year. And Fielder's upside is that of a 6/6.5. Fielder's "upside" is 6/6.5? "Upside" is another bogus concept. Baseball is a game of production not potential. '94 Frank Thomas disagrees. As good as he was from '91'-93, he was making a mockery of the sport in '94 once they put Julio Franco behind him instead of a washed up George Bell or a broken down Bo Jackson. But keep deluding yourself into thinking that the Tigers didn't get a whole lot better. [ The Tigers did get better. Better than yesterday. 2 wins better than 2 weeks ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 No doubt about it. Prince's 6.4 WAR in '09 was a fluke and will never be matched again despite the fact he's 27. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 24, 2012 -> 09:52 PM) Ha, that's funny. His disappeared after he got his ass kicked Those were good times. What an asshat. The Tigers need to get Garza now...not to steal the thunder but they need to be "all in". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 25, 2012 Author Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Harry Chappas @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 09:17 AM) Those were good times. What an asshat. The Tigers need to get Garza now...not to steal the thunder but they need to be "all in". Its too bad they are in our division, because that would be a great team to send Gavin to otherwise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpd9189 Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 10:21 AM) Its too bad they are in our division, because that would be a great team to send Gavin to otherwise. If the Sox could land a couple of DET's top prospect(s), I'd do it in a heartbeat. I'd personally drive Gavin to the Motor City. Gavin's a nice pitcher but Roy Halladay he is not. I'm not sure I see Gavin part of this team's long term future. That 18 win season seems like a LONG time ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 09:31 AM) jaysonst Jayson Stark Did some checking on Prince's HRs. RF in Comerica is 339 feet. Shortest Prince HR to RF in any park last year was 363. #somuchforparkfactor If you check earlier in this thread, there's a calculation at hittrackeronline of which parks different HR balls would leave. He'd probably lose about 5 playing a full season at Comerica from what he hit last year. Of course, he could just get himself into a spot where he hits them farther. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Ok, I'm going to try this one. Can't hurt right? This is totally going to bust for the Tigers, spending this much money on an NL-only hitter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macsandz Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 08:55 AM) No doubt about it. Prince's 6.4 WAR in '09 was a fluke and will never be matched again despite the fact he's 27. He's been anywhere from a 6.0 WAR or a 4.0 WAR in his career. That averages out to 5.0 WAR per year. He has no speed, plays below average defense and plays 1B. He's also changing leagues. These are all hits to WAR value. 5.0 WAR for next year is generous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 12:41 PM) He's been anywhere from a 6.0 WAR or a 4.0 WAR in his career. That averages out to 5.0 WAR per year. He has no speed, plays below average defense and plays 1B. He's also changing leagues. These are all hits to WAR value. 5.0 WAR for next year is generous. 4.5 WAR is a good estimate IMO. The Tigers will regret this contract in 3-4 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jan 24, 2012 -> 09:48 PM) Yeah, well, they didn't sign him for one year. And Fielder's upside is that of a 6/6.5. '94 Frank Thomas disagrees. As good as he was from '91'-93, he was making a mockery of the sport in '94 once they put Julio Franco behind him instead of a washed up George Bell or a broken down Bo Jackson. But keep deluding yourself into thinking that the Tigers didn't get a whole lot better. If Julio Franco was "protection" for Frank Thomas, how come Frank had the highest walk rate of his career in 94, and how did Frank's numbers improve when Albert Belle was signed to hit behind him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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