scenario Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Posting because I am really angry about this and think the story needs attention of a larger audience. The owner is one of my Facebook friends who raises dogs in a small town. Her dog is having medical difficulties as a result and may need expensive surgery (between $6-10,000). Anyone with suggestions on organizations that help with pets medical bills, etc., would be appreciated I'm sure. Am abbreviating the article below. The entire article can be found at the following link... http://www.journalstandard.com/news/x10699...m-gunshot-wound ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dog recovers from gunshot wound Couple seeks answers to shooting It was a typical Saturday morning on Jan. 14 for Bill and Dory Potamianos of Lena. They arose that morning to the usual licks of love from their dogs. Their 2-year-old black Labrador, Wednesday, was particularly playful that morning. Dory thinks back to that morning that started with a big smile, only to have the smile shattered within minutes. Bill took the dogs outside for the morning routine. The couple have puppies from their German short hair dog. Wednesday often acted as a puppy-sitter for Bill when he tended to the six-month-old puppies. On Saturday, the puppies were overly rambunctious. Bill had his hands full. In an instant, Bill realized Wednesday was not next to him. He called out for his dog, who was wearing an electronic vibrating collar. Bill pressed the button on the vibrator to call his dog, while also calling out the dog’s name. A shot rang out from across the field, in the direction of a neighbor’s house. As Bill took off running, he was met by a bleeding Wednesday running in his direction. Bill said he remembers seeing the neighbor, gun in hand, firing another shot into the air. Bill said he heard the second shot rip through the bush. Bill called out to Dory, who had run out of their house to see what had happened. As Bill placed the bleeding dog into his truck, Dory said all she can remember seeing is the truck racing up the driveway. As Bill raced to the Lena Veterinary Clinic, Dory was left standing in the driveway, looking for answers. Dory said she followed the blood trail left by the dog, which led up to the home of their neighbor Tim Hamilton. Shaking, Dory said she knocked on the door. Time passed before Hamilton answered the door. “I asked him, ‘Did you shoot my dog?’” Dory said. “He had a big grin on his face. He said, ‘I told you not to let your dogs come on my property.’” Hamilton has been charged with criminal damage to property, a Class A misdemeanor of property value under $300. He has a court date before a judge on Feb. 16. More at link above ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sidenote: I did a little research and found that under Illinois law shooting a pet dog is a Class 4 felony. Picture of the dog is below. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Your friend may want to also file a small claims case against the person who did it. Animals in most states are considered property, so it would simply be a damage to property lawsuit and maybe theyd be liable. Did she call her homeowners insurance? Some cover animal injuries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted January 25, 2012 Author Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Jan 24, 2012 -> 07:56 PM) Your friend may want to also file a small claims case against the person who did it. Animals in most states are considered property, so it would simply be a damage to property lawsuit and maybe theyd be liable. Did she call her homeowners insurance? Some cover animal injuries. Thanks for your note. I will pass along all suggested ideas. Much appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 No joke. Sue the life out of this scumbag. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Suing is not going to accomplish anything. The legal remedies are simply not strong enough. What would be better is making EVERY effort possible to make it clear that THIS particular man shot your dog. Most people consider their animals a part of the family and an incredibly huge number of Americans are animal owners. I would not want to be known as someone who shot a dog and then smiled about it simply because he was on my property. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Aren't animal cruelty laws around for something like this? Sorry to hear about the pooch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted January 25, 2012 Author Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) I know two other people from that town whose dogs have 'disappeared' in the last few months. I don't believe this was that scumbag's first rodeo. He's a deer hunter who hunts on his own property and doesn't want other people's dogs to scare them away. The fear factor for the dog's owners in this situation is that they just moved there a year ago and they RAISE dogs. Not very comforting to think you have a next door neighbor who will shoot them. Edited January 25, 2012 by scenario Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (scenario @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 10:17 AM) I know two other people from that town whose dogs have 'disappeared' in the last few months. I don't believe this was that scumbag's first rodeo. He's a deer hunter who hunts on his own property and doesn't want other people's dogs to scare them away. The fear factor for the dog's owners in this situation is that they just moved there a year ago and they RAISE dogs. Not very comforting to think you have a next door neighbor who will shoot them. Understood...however, the stigma of being known as a dog-killer can be pretty damaging as well. Ask Mike Vick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (scenario @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 10:17 AM) I know two other people from that town whose dogs have 'disappeared' in the last few months. I don't believe this was that scumbag's first rodeo. He's a deer hunter who hunts on his own property and doesn't want other people's dogs to scare them away. The fear factor for the dog's owners in this situation is that they just moved there a year ago and they RAISE dogs. Not very comforting to think you have a next door neighbor who will shoot them. Before crucifying that other guy, I'd like to hear his side of the story first. Obviously shooting the dog is going to be extreme no matter what and there were probably other measures to be taken, but who knows how many prior incidents took place? Edited January 25, 2012 by Milkman delivers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 11:16 AM) Before crucifying that other guy, I'd like to hear his side of the story first. Obviously shooting the dog is going to be extreme no matter what and there were probably other measures to be taken, but who knows how many prior incidents took place? What exactly do you mean by "prior incidents"? The dog being on his property? And secondly, does he really need to smile sadistically when the owner of the dog asks if he shot her dog? I think that is evidence enough that the guy is a pretty disturbed asshole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 11:16 AM) Before crucifying that other guy, I'd like to hear his side of the story first. Obviously shooting the dog is going to be extreme no matter what and there were probably other measures to be taken, but who knows how many prior incidents took place? Really though, the only thing I could see justifying this is if this guy was attacked by her dog prior and told her to keep the dogs off the property or else. Other than that, merely having a dog enter your property isnt a good enough reason(IMO) to just pull out your rifle and start shooting. It doesnt sound like there was a prior attack here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (iamshack @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 11:25 AM) What exactly do you mean by "prior incidents"? The dog being on his property? And secondly, does he really need to smile sadistically when the owner of the dog asks if he shot her dog? I think that is evidence enough that the guy is a pretty disturbed asshole. Well, the smiling part can easily be a fabrication or something the frazzled owner misremembered. Prior incidents could be that the guy has been losing money/food because the dogs are always running through his property. Perhaps he's gone to the owners repeatedly to ask them to keep their dogs caged up so that they don't continue to hurt his business/avid hobby. Maybe the owners shrugged it off and said they can't do anything about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 11:28 AM) Really though, the only thing I could see justifying this is if this guy was attacked by her dog prior and told her to keep the dogs off the property or else. Other than that, merely having a dog enter your property isnt a good enough reason(IMO) to just pull out your rifle and start shooting. It doesnt sound like there was a prior attack here I'm not going to get into the moral aspect of this. He almost certainly shouldn't have shot someone's pet. But maybe this guy is very protective of his property and requested several times that the dogs be kept away, and the owners thought "f*** 'em, what's he gonna do?" That old guy who won't give your frisbee back isn't always just a mean jerk for no reason. Sometimes they've been pushed and pushed for so long that finally they do something stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DukeNukeEm Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 If this guy wants to keep a low profile he was probably better off just shooting people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 11:28 AM) Well, the smiling part can easily be a fabrication or something the frazzled owner misremembered. Prior incidents could be that the guy has been losing money/food because the dogs are always running through his property. Perhaps he's gone to the owners repeatedly to ask them to keep their dogs caged up so that they don't continue to hurt his business/avid hobby. Maybe the owners shrugged it off and said they can't do anything about it. Did you read the rest of the article? The dogs have collars on which vibrate when they leave their owner's yard. They do not understand why the dog left their yard. The reason the guy knew something was amiss in the first place is because the dog was not there. It almost seems as though the dog was lured onto the other guy's property by something (gee whiz, what could it have been??). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (iamshack @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 11:36 AM) Did you read the rest of the article? The dogs have collars on which vibrate when they leave their owner's yard. They do not understand why the dog left their yard. The reason the guy knew something was amiss in the first place is because the dog was not there. It almost seems as though the dog was lured onto the other guy's property by something (gee whiz, what could it have been??). I did not. The part that was pasted here said that he had to push a button to activate the collar. But again, I'm not going to immediately believe the first article I read about animal abuse. It's a pretty hot-button issue right now and the media tends to run with these things and neglect to feature every side of these stories. Edited January 25, 2012 by Milkman delivers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted January 25, 2012 Author Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 11:16 AM) Before crucifying that other guy, I'd like to hear his side of the story first. Obviously shooting the dog is going to be extreme no matter what and there were probably other measures to be taken, but who knows how many prior incidents took place? The dog's owners moved in next door March 2011, less than one year ago. They had exactly one conversation with this guy prior to the shooting... Thanksgiving... when he walked out his door with a beer in his hand and yelled at them to keep their dogs off his property. Think about the events here... A guy goes outside with his dogs. One wanders away for a few moments. He notices it missing and he hears a shot. He goes running towards it... sees the dog running towards him bleeding... during which he hears another shot which hits the brush near him. Timeline... when did the shooter have time to go get his rifle, etc? It had to be sitting somewhere relatively close and loaded. First shot... He walked 4 steps out his front door and shot the dog from 50 feet away. There was no doubt he was shooting at somebody's pet Labrador Retriever. Second shot... There was blood all the way down his drive. No doubt the dog was hit. Why the second shot? And did the shooter even think that possibly he could be endangering the owner who was calling and running towards the dog? Guy goes back into his house and then comes smiling to the front door when the owner shows up to ask what happened. Bottom Line: He not only inflicted cruelty on a companion animal (which is a Class 4 felony in Illinois)... he endangered the owner with the second shot. And he came to the door smiling about it??? Edited January 25, 2012 by scenario Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (scenario @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 11:48 AM) The dog's owners moved in next door March 2011, less than one year ago. They had exactly one conversation with this guy prior to the shooting... Thanksgiving... when he walked out his door with a beer in his hand and yelled at them to keep their dogs off his property. Think about the events here... A guy goes outside with his dogs. One wanders away for a few moments. He notices it missing and he hears a shot. He goes running towards it... sees the dog running towards him bleeding... during which he hears another shot which hits the brush near him. Timeline... when did the shooter have time to go get his rifle, etc? It had to be sitting somewhere relatively close and loaded. First shot... He walked 4 steps out his front door and shot the dog from 50 feet away. Second shot... There was blood all the way down his drive. No doubt the dog was hit. Why the second shot? And did the shooter even think that possibly he could be endangering the owner who was calling and running towards the dog? Guy goes back into his house and then comes smiling to the front door when the owner shows up to ask what happened. Bottom Line: He not only inflicted cruelty on a companion animal (which is a Class 4 felony in Illinois)... he endangered the owner with the second shot. And he came to the door smiling about it??? I'd be willing to bet he lured the dog onto his property and shot him in a drunken stupor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (scenario @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 11:48 AM) The dog's owners moved in next door March 2011, less than one year ago. They had exactly one conversation with this guy prior to the shooting... Thanksgiving... when he walked out his door with a beer in his hand and yelled at them to keep their dogs off his property. Think about the events here... A guy goes outside with his dogs. One wanders away for a few moments. He notices it missing and he hears a shot. He goes running towards it... sees the dog running towards him bleeding... during which he hears another shot which hits the brush near him. Timeline... when did the shooter have time to go get his rifle, etc? It had to be sitting somewhere relatively close and loaded. First shot... He walked 4 steps out his front door and shot the dog from 50 feet away. Second shot... There was blood all the way down his drive. No doubt the dog was hit. Why the second shot? And did the shooter even think that possibly he could be endangering the owner who was calling and running towards the dog? Guy goes back into his house and then comes smiling to the front door when the owner shows up to ask what happened. Bottom Line: He not only inflicted cruelty on a companion animal (which is a Class 4 felony in Illinois)... he endangered the owner with the second shot. And he came to the door smiling about it??? OK, I'm going to repeat this because I think it's very important. The smiling thing could incredibly easily be a fabrication. I'm not calling your friend a liar, but she had to be in a state of panic when she confronted him. I'm not going to take that as evidence, but unfortunately it's going to be a key point in the court of public opinion as it's already been brought up a few times in this thread. This guy hunts on his own property. I'm guessing it wouldn't be uncommon for him to have a loaded rifle around, as unsafe as that obviously is. Does it state anywhere that the owner was in sight when he fired the second shot? The part posted here seems to say that the neighbor simply heard the shot in the bushes. So while he may well have known that the owner was within range, he may have just as easily not known with tree/bush coverage. I'm no lawyer, but this guy can probably get off with a slap on the wrist, or even less. Heck, he can maybe even say that he thought the dog was a coyote. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (iamshack @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 09:34 AM) Suing is not going to accomplish anything. The legal remedies are simply not strong enough. What do you mean the remedies arent strong enough? If they have to pay 5-10k in medical bills, why would they not want to try and recoup those bills from the person who caused the damage? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (iamshack @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 11:50 AM) I'd be willing to bet he lured the dog onto his property and shot him in a drunken stupor. See, you're already running wild with this. And you wonder why the media would run with a story like this and sensationalize it? Second page of this thread and the guy is already luring innocent puppies onto his property to drunkenly strangle them with piano wire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 11:46 AM) I did not. The part that was pasted here said that he had to push a button to activate the collar. But again, I'm not going to immediately believe the first article I read about animal abuse. It's a pretty hot-button issue right now and the media tends to run with these things and neglect to feature every side of these stories. Damn dude, did you enroll at Penn State or something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted January 25, 2012 Author Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 11:57 AM) See, you're already running wild with this. And you wonder why the media would run with a story like this and sensationalize it? I'm not going to immediately believe the first article I read about animal abuse. Says the guy who didn't even read the article... lol Edited January 25, 2012 by scenario Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 12:01 PM) Damn dude, did you enroll at Penn State or something? I sorta get the joke, but it doesn't fit that well. The media will crucify this guy to no end, but there won't be a public outpouring of support from the media like there has been for Paterno. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (scenario @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 12:03 PM) Says the guy who didn't even read the article... lol I figured if the content from the article were important enough, you might have bothered to post it all here. I suppose I gave you too much credit. Sorry, I will read it all and get back. But I'm going to go in expecting it to be sensationalized, which I'm more than certain it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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