Soxbadger Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Also they should see if they can get a care credit card from GE to pay for the medical bills. I was able to get 18 months no interest on a 5k emergency vet bill recently, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Read it, still don't see anything wrong with what I've already written. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 12:04 PM) I sorta get the joke, but it doesn't fit that well. The media will crucify this guy to no end, but there won't be a public outpouring of support from the media like there has been for Paterno. To be fair, I don't know if there is necessarily a Joe Paterno in this situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 12:17 PM) To be fair, I don't know if there is necessarily a Joe Paterno in this situation. Also true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted January 25, 2012 Author Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 12:14 PM) Read it, still don't see anything wrong with what I've already written. I think you'd have a great career as a mafia defense attorney. lol "Judge the guy tripped and fell on my client's knife, which he was only carrying for self-defense. Anybody with common sense could see that." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (scenario @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 12:25 PM) I think you'd have a great career as a mafia defense attorney. lol "Judge the guy tripped and fell on my client's knife, which he was only carrying for self-defense. Anybody with common sense could see that." Haha, I've been thinking about a new line of work. And I'm not saying that this guy is innocent here. He may well have done everything that was insinuated in this thread. All I'm saying is that there is a chance that he's innocent and that we can't believe what we've heard so far, which is all from the other side of the story. And it's not the hardest thing in the world to paint a gun-loving, secluded, avid hunter as a bad guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 I agree with Milkman,always best to wait on the facts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 12:33 PM) Haha, I've been thinking about a new line of work. And I'm not saying that this guy is innocent here. He may well have done everything that was insinuated in this thread. All I'm saying is that there is a chance that he's innocent and that we can't believe what we've heard so far, which is all from the other side of the story. And it's not the hardest thing in the world to paint a gun-loving, secluded, avid hunter as a bad guy. Are you honestly doing this on purpose? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 01:53 PM) I agree with Milkman,always best to wait on the facts. The facts? This is a guy in a random neighborhood that shot someone's dog. I don't think there is going to be a Grand Jury indictment or a front-page news story regarding the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Well Iamshack, for all I know it will turn out the guy was shooting at a coyote who was attacking the dog and he missed and hit the dog 1 time. /shrugs Nothing to suggest thats what happened, but until you get both sides you really are just merely speculating. And just so you know my bias, Im pro-animal and anti-gun. I just dont like to jump to conclusions, even if I would be inclined to believe that this guy has no defense for what he did. I could be wrong, wont be the first or last time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 03:14 PM) Well Iamshack, for all I know it will turn out the guy was shooting at a coyote who was attacking the dog and he missed and hit the dog 1 time. /shrugs Nothing to suggest thats what happened, but until you get both sides you really are just merely speculating. And just so you know my bias, Im pro-animal and anti-gun. I just dont like to jump to conclusions, even if I would be inclined to believe that this guy has no defense for what he did. I could be wrong, wont be the first or last time. Oh I understand that. The point is this is some random drunk and the discussion will just be had here amongst a few people. It's not the same as rampantly speculating about a famous personality while every media outlet is discussing the issue and it is water cooler discussion. Of course I am speculating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 02:14 PM) Well Iamshack, for all I know it will turn out the guy was shooting at a coyote who was attacking the dog and he missed and hit the dog 1 time. /shrugs Nothing to suggest thats what happened, but until you get both sides you really are just merely speculating. And just so you know my bias, Im pro-animal and anti-gun. I just dont like to jump to conclusions, even if I would be inclined to believe that this guy has no defense for what he did. I could be wrong, wont be the first or last time. This, the media and sides emotionally attached to the situation tend to pick and choose facts to report, while typically abstaining facts that defend the perpetrator. Like Milk said, I'm fairly sure he's guilty, but let's have a legitimate investigation first before concluding anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 03:19 PM) This, the media and sides emotionally attached to the situation tend to pick and choose facts to report, while typically abstaining facts that defend the perpetrator. Like Milk said, I'm fairly sure he's guilty, but let's have a legitimate investigation first before concluding anything. What on earth are you talking about? A legitimate investigation? All I can say is I am flabbergasted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iwritecode Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 12:13 PM) Also they should see if they can get a care credit card from GE to pay for the medical bills. I was able to get 18 months no interest on a 5k emergency vet bill recently, I've never heard of this before. It's a pretty good idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 12:56 PM) What do you mean the remedies arent strong enough? If they have to pay 5-10k in medical bills, why would they not want to try and recoup those bills from the person who caused the damage? As for this, I don't think someone who shoots an animal is liable for their medical bills. I believe they are only liable up to the value of how the animal is viewed as property. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (iamshack @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 02:21 PM) What on earth are you talking about? A legitimate investigation? All I can say is I am flabbergasted. As in, find out all sides of the story, find out the history behind it (look for motive, or if this guy is really just a psycho). I just don't like incriminating some guy I've never met without hearing all stories, because emotions can get in the way of truth many times. From the facts given, this guy is a mad man and guilty as hell, but you're only getting like half the story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (iamshack @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 02:28 PM) As for this, I don't think someone who shoots an animal is liable for their medical bills. I believe they are only liable up to the value of how the animal is viewed as property. That's really unfortunate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 03:33 PM) As in, find out all sides of the story, find out the history behind it (look for motive, or if this guy is really just a psycho). I just don't like incriminating some guy I've never met without hearing all stories, because emotions can get in the way of truth many times. From the facts given, this guy is a mad man and guilty as hell, but you're only getting like half the story. No, I get that. My point was that we won't have the opportunity to. This is a minor story that probably won't even be followed up on unless it turns out the guy has been shooting all kinds of dogs in the neighborhood. I was more hoping this thread would be used as a forum for discussion on the topic of animal cruelty in general, as well as a place to find information on how to help the dog. I could give a s*** about some random drunken hillrod and whether I do a full and proper investigation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Animals are property, if you kill an animal your liability is for the value of the property. But if you damage an animal, why would you not be able to sue for the medical damages? Ive gone through some Illinois cases and while you cant sue for companionship etc, this case I believe would allow you to sue for actual damages: http://www.nabranimallaw.org/Content.aspx?id=428#Illinois Anzalone v. Kragness (Illinois) Decided March 7, 2005 Pet owner's cat was attacked and killed by defendant's rottweiler dog while boarded at an animal hospital. The pet owner sued the veterinarian and animal hospital on several grounds, including negligence and intentional infliction of emotional distress. The trial court dismissed the intentional infliction of emotional distress claim and rejected the request for damages on the remaining counts. Plaintiff sought damages in excess of $100,000 on several grounds including loss of society and companionship. On appeal, the Illinois appellate court reversed the trial court stating it is for the jury to determine the appropriate amount of damages. The appellate court also stated that using "value to the owner" as a measure of damages is widely used in small cases. The case now moves back to the trial court for further consideration Also on a personal note, I have handled a case where comed maced a dog and they settled for the medical bills plus damage to the home. Its not the easiest thing, but you can frame a complaint that would potentially allow for recovery. Not saying youll win, just you can take a shot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 03:36 PM) Animals are property, if you kill an animal your liability is for the value of the property. But if you damage an animal, why would you not be able to sue for the medical damages? Ive gone through some Illinois cases and while you cant sue for companionship etc, this case I believe would allow you to sue for actual damages: http://www.nabranimallaw.org/Content.aspx?id=428#Illinois Anzalone v. Kragness (Illinois) Decided March 7, 2005 Pet owner's cat was attacked and killed by defendant's rottweiler dog while boarded at an animal hospital. The pet owner sued the veterinarian and animal hospital on several grounds, including negligence and intentional infliction of emotional distress. The trial court dismissed the intentional infliction of emotional distress claim and rejected the request for damages on the remaining counts. Plaintiff sought damages in excess of $100,000 on several grounds including loss of society and companionship. On appeal, the Illinois appellate court reversed the trial court stating it is for the jury to determine the appropriate amount of damages. The appellate court also stated that using "value to the owner" as a measure of damages is widely used in small cases. The case now moves back to the trial court for further consideration Also on a personal note, I have handled a case where comed maced a dog and they settled for the medical bills plus damage to the home. Its not the easiest thing, but you can frame a complaint that would potentially allow for recovery. Not saying youll win, just you can take a shot. Interesting. I can only imagine how large some of the "value to the owner" figures would be. Domesticated animals are often considered as members of the family, so imagine how much some people would claim the value was? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (iamshack @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 02:07 PM) Are you honestly doing this on purpose? Yes? I seriously don't want to take one side of a story and believe it blindly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 03:47 PM) Yes? I seriously don't want to take one side of a story and believe it blindly. It just seems like you are doing the exact opposite of what you did with the Penn State thing, just as SSK mentioned... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted January 25, 2012 Author Share Posted January 25, 2012 Good general conversation... including different points of view. Special thanks to all with ideas / suggestions regarding legal and medical. Here's an update from the owner I just received... "Spent the whole day (Tuesday) and most of the evening at UW Madison Veterinary Care Hospital. They found an infection in Wednesday's intestines from the bullet that if not operated on would find her dead soon. They kept her in ICU overnight. Right now she is in surgery. They can't give us a guarantee, but said she is young, strong and in excellent shape. They said there is no reason to doubt that she will make it. Right now her vet bills are at $6,200 and rising. But she is worth every penny. Thank you all for your support and prayers." Dory Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (scenario @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 02:51 PM) Good general conversation... including different points of view. Special thanks to all with ideas / suggestions regarding legal and medical. Here's an update from the owner I just received... "Spent the whole day (Tuesday) and most of the evening at UW Madison Veterinary Care Hospital. They found an infection in Wednesday's intestines from the bullet that if not operated on would find her dead soon. They kept her in ICU overnight. Right now she is in surgery. They can't give us a guarantee, but said she is young, strong and in excellent shape. They said there is no reason to doubt that she will make it. Right now her vet bills are at $6,200 and rising. But she is worth every penny. Thank you all for your support and prayers." Dory I wish the dog luck, I have always had a huge soft spot for dogs and it really is awful no matter the story that this happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 QUOTE (scenario @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 02:51 PM) Good general conversation... including different points of view. Special thanks to all with ideas / suggestions regarding legal and medical. Here's an update from the owner I just received... "Spent the whole day (Tuesday) and most of the evening at UW Madison Veterinary Care Hospital. They found an infection in Wednesday's intestines from the bullet that if not operated on would find her dead soon. They kept her in ICU overnight. Right now she is in surgery. They can't give us a guarantee, but said she is young, strong and in excellent shape. They said there is no reason to doubt that she will make it. Right now her vet bills are at $6,200 and rising. But she is worth every penny. Thank you all for your support and prayers." Dory Please let us know if they are taking any donations through any kind of organization or anything. Also, PM me with this MFers home address Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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