southsider2k5 Posted January 26, 2012 Author Share Posted January 26, 2012 QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 04:10 PM) Reed will get more work by not closing. It's probably a good thing. There's no point in having a rookie falling asleep in the bullpen because there aren't any save situations. I do not want him closing initially because I like the idea of putting him in situations that give him the best chance to succeed first before building him into more and more pressure situations. Cooper has done that very successfully with his young pitchers to determine their limits instead of destroying their confidence right away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 26, 2012 Author Share Posted January 26, 2012 QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jan 25, 2012 -> 04:43 PM) Actually, looking at the stats, he wasn't bad at all: http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playe...&position=P K's down a touch, but still really high. Walks up a bit, but around career average. BABIP sky high, LOB% way low, ERA way higher than FIP and xFIP. To tell you the truth, by the numbers, he is showing all the signs of a horribly unlucky season with little or no decline in skills. He's a fantastic bounceback candidate. And most of the badness was because of horrible luck in April. Throw that out, and he was the Matt Thornton he has been for years now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowand's rowdies Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Matt Thornton - Career 20 Saves 25 Blown Saves. Enough said. He's NOT a closer. He's a solid 8th inning set up guy or situational lefty. Not sure it's Juan Pierre's fault he has blown 25 saves out of 45 (44% success rate)... I hope Robin is bluffing, because that's not a good start as a manager by saying you are going to throw a guy into a position where he has repetitively has failed. Just like Dunn in the field. If Robin is as smart as we think/hope he is, neither of those things will happen more than a few times or by neccessity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 26, 2012 Author Share Posted January 26, 2012 QUOTE (rowand's rowdies @ Jan 26, 2012 -> 09:42 AM) Matt Thornton - Career 20 Saves 25 Blown Saves. Enough said. He's NOT a closer. He's a solid 8th inning set up guy or situational lefty. Not sure it's Juan Pierre's fault he has blown 25 saves out of 45 (44% success rate)... I hope Robin is bluffing, because that's not a good start as a manager by saying you are going to throw a guy into a position where he has repetitively has failed. Just like Dunn in the field. If Robin is as smart as we think/hope he is, neither of those things will happen more than a few times or by neccessity. Worst usage of save state ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 QUOTE (rowand's rowdies @ Jan 26, 2012 -> 09:42 AM) Matt Thornton - Career 20 Saves 25 Blown Saves. Enough said. He's NOT a closer. He's a solid 8th inning set up guy or situational lefty. Not sure it's Juan Pierre's fault he has blown 25 saves out of 45 (44% success rate)... LOL, you may want to check how many of those blown "saves" were in the 6th-8th inning where he had zero chance to get a save anyway. He has 125 career holds, so I think he's closer to a 85% success rate. (145/170) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowand's rowdies Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Fair enough, but plenty of those 25 have been in the 9th inning. Not sure how many but I've seen him struggle in enough 9th innings to know he's not closer material. 9th inning is a different animal. I like Thornton as our 8th inning guy, I just don't think he's got closer mental makeup. He lost the job last year and is in his late 30s. Why does he deserve another shot to close. He's not our closer on our next division winning team most likely, so let's move towards that solution imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 26, 2012 Author Share Posted January 26, 2012 QUOTE (rowand's rowdies @ Jan 26, 2012 -> 10:04 AM) Fair enough, but plenty of those 25 have been in the 9th inning. Not sure how many but I've seen him struggle in enough 9th innings to know he's not closer material. 9th inning is a different animal. I like Thornton as our 8th inning guy, I just don't think he's got closer mental makeup. He lost the job last year and is in his late 30s. Why does he deserve another shot to close. He's not our closer on our next division winning team most likely, so let's move towards that solution imo. I would bet is half or less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 (edited) This, if he is successful, increases his trade value. They could get rid of him now but the return probably does not help the Sox in the short or long term except for JRs wallet. If he can close it could change that. Edited January 26, 2012 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 26, 2012 -> 10:12 AM) This, if he is successful, increases his trade value. They could get rid of him now but the return probably does not help the Sox in the short or long term except for JRs wallet. If he can close it could change that. Yes, and the same thing can also be true of Crain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 26, 2012 -> 10:12 AM) This, if he is successful, increases his trade value. They could get rid of him now but the return probably does not help the Sox in the short or long term except for JRs wallet. If he can close it could change that. QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Jan 26, 2012 -> 11:04 AM) Yes, and the same thing can also be true of Crain. This has been my stance for a while. Let's just hope that Robin will factor in KW's input and what's best for the organization into his decision-making moreso than Guillen. I think everyone here would agree that the GM and manager should have their own opinions, but at the end of day they should come to some sort of agreement on what the right course of action is. The manager's job isn't always to maximize wins, sometimes it's more important to develop young talent or play a player in hopes of increasing his trade value. I honesty think KW and Robin will be on the page in regard to these types of decisions, which should be a significant improvement from Ozzie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jan 26, 2012 -> 06:23 PM) This has been my stance for a while. Let's just hope that Robin will factor in KW's input and what's best for the organization into his decision-making moreso than Guillen. I think everyone here would agree that the GM and manager should have their own opinions, but at the end of day they should come to some sort of agreement on what the right course of action is. The manager's job isn't always to maximize wins, sometimes it's more important to develop young talent or play a player in hopes of increasing his trade value. I honesty think KW and Robin will be on the page in regard to these types of decisions, which should be a significant improvement from Ozzie. I just find it amazing that our hope is for Sox players to suceed and for us to win so we can get rid of the players Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 27, 2012 Author Share Posted January 27, 2012 http://blogs.suntimes.com/whitesox/ Thornton White Sox closer? That's news to Coop By Daryl Van Schouwen on January 27, 2012 10:15 AM | No Comments | No TrackBacks A day or so after White Sox manager Robin Ventura said that lefthander Matt Thornton was probably the leading candidate to close games, pitching coach Don Cooper expressed surprise at the first-year manager's statement. "Who said that? You're giving me news,'' Cooper told the Mully and Hanley Show on Friday morning. "It's news to me.'' After Cooper, who was en route to SoxFest at the Palmer House, listened to Ventura's comments, he said, "Well, you got more info than me.'' Righthander Jesse Crain has expressed a desire to have a shot at the job and was thought be many to be the leading candidate until Ventura cited Thornton. Thornton was given first crack last year and lost the job to Sergio Santos, who was traded during the offseason. "Like I said, Matt is certainly capable,'' Cooper said. "You have [prized rookie righthander] Addison Reed is a kid who has to work into it. You can't name him. You got Jesse Crain -- he is a guy who is more than capable. We'll figure it out. Nobody said Santos last year. I'm a believer in they'll show yo who needs to be in there at that time.'' Ventura by no means named Thornton the closer. And it may be Cooper, who has a new four-year contract, who has the final say, anyhow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 In case there was any doubt, Don Cooper all but confirmed during Saturday's opening seminar at SoxFest that Addison Reed will be in the White Sox bullpen this season. When asked about the bullpen, Cooper listed Jesse Crain, Matt Thornton, Will Ohman and Reed as guys who will be in the team's relief corps, with three open spots remaining. Cooper also mentioned he expects each of his starting pitchers to throw 200 innings -- although he didn't elaborate on any monitoring of innings for Chris Sale. Given that both Kenny Williams and Robin Ventura have mentioned Sale's innings would be closely watched, it was probably an unintentional oversight. Coop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 ChuckGarfien Chuck Garfien When Kenny Williams saw Matt Thornton for the first time today he asked with a grin, "You're still here?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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