Obamanation Re-election MegaThread

[Quin]

All I can say about this is my friend who came over when she 6 months old has more right to stay here than most legal residents.

[kapkomet]

All I can say about this is my friend who came over when she 6 months old has more right to stay here than most legal residents.

 

 

CONGRESS shall pass the laws, not the president. He had this in his back pocket for 2 years and they all knew he would EO this. That's why the Democrats in Congress all grew massive hoo hoos on the vote and looked the other way.

[Quin]

CONGRESS shall pass the laws, not the president. He had this in his back pocket for 2 years and they all knew he would EO this. That's why the Democrats in Congress all grew massive hoo hoos on the vote and looked the other way.

 

That is in no way a response to what I said.

 

My friend is more American than half the people who want her deported because she was born in Mexico and spent a whopping six months there. I guess the twenty and half years here don't mean s***. Hell, she's been trying to get naturalized for the past seven years, but the process has been tied up. That's what I call efficiency!

 

Hell, she knows more about American history, the Constitution, etc. than most people who were blessed to be born in the country they've lived almost their entire lives in.

 

[Balta1701]

CONGRESS shall pass the laws, not the president. He had this in his back pocket for 2 years and they all knew he would EO this. That's why the Democrats in Congress all grew massive hoo hoos on the vote and looked the other way.

The vote in the Senate was 56-43 in favor in 2010.

[Balta1701]

That is in no way a response to what I said.

 

My friend is more American than half the people who want her deported because she was born in Mexico and spent a whopping six months there. I guess the twenty and half years here don't mean s***. Hell, she's been trying to get naturalized for the past seven years, but the process has been tied up. That's what I call efficiency!

 

Hell, she knows more about American history, the Constitution, etc. than most people who were blessed to be born in the country they've lived almost their entire lives in.

You're not listening to Kap's important point. If your friend knows the laws this well, then she should know she doesn't belong here. Of course, she doesn't belong in Mexico either. So she needs to help establish a colony in international waters for the other half million or so people like her, and wait until Congress passes the DREAM Act. It's the only patriotic thing she can do.

[Quin]

You're not listening to Kap's important point. If your friend knows the laws this well, then she should know she doesn't belong here. Of course, she doesn't belong in Mexico either. So she needs to help establish a colony in international waters for the other half million or so people like her, and wait until Congress passes the DREAM Act. It's the only patriotic thing she can do.

 

I probably didn't get the important point because what the hell is a hoo-hoo?

 

She's not the only one I know either, I know at least five other "illegals" who probably don't remember being in Mexico. I don't remember being six months old, so I'm going to assume they don't either. Where the hell should jettison them too? Speaking of which, let's not forget that a lot of our ancestors just came to the US and if the same measures were in place today, it would have been illegal for them.

[kapkomet]

So the solution is just accept everyone/everything that wants to come here?

 

There is a legal way to do it.

 

The DEMOCRATIC led House of Representatives voted down your precious bill, Balta. Your own "party" wussied out. Why? Because they knew King Obama would wave his magic EO wand and make it "law" anyway.

 

[Soxbadger]

The problem is that the legal way to do it has become so unnecessarily convoluted that it prevents most people from legal immigration.

 

You see people forget that back in the late 19th and early 20th century, all you had to do was get off a boat, and you were allowed to legally immigrate here. You didnt have to get on a waiting list, hope your number was pulled etc.

 

Im not the child of an immigrant, I am 3rd generation. But if it wasnt for the American immigration policies of those eras, its likely that I would not exist, as a good part of my family would have been killed in World War II. People forget that during the 1930s the US created laws that were anti-capitalism and isolationism/protectonism ruled the day.

 

If the law itself is unjust, then those who break the law are not criminals. If it is against the law for a black man to drink water from a white water fountain, we do not consider the man who breaks that law a criminal or deserving of punishment, we consider that individual a freedom fighter.

 

Just like immigrants today, who fight for the freedom to immigrate to the best country in the world. We do not have the right to deny other people the ability to come to the US for a better life. Every human deserves the chance to live in the US if they want to.

 

And to answer the question, yes we accept everyone who wants to come here who is not a criminal or does not have a disease.

 

It is just as simple as that, the only reason most of us are here, is because those who came before, were generous enough to give our families a chance. Its just hypocrisy.

[Quin]

The problem is that the legal way to do it has become so unnecessarily convoluted that it prevents most people from legal immigration.

 

You see people forget that back in the late 19th and early 20th century, all you had to do was get off a boat, and you were allowed to legally immigrate here. You didnt have to get on a waiting list, hope your number was pulled etc.

 

Im not the child of an immigrant, I am 3rd generation. But if it wasnt for the American immigration policies of those eras, its likely that I would not exist, as a good part of my family would have been killed in World War II. People forget that during the 1930s the US created laws that were anti-capitalism and isolationism/protectonism ruled the day.

 

If the law itself is unjust, then those who break the law are not criminals. If it is against the law for a black man to drink water from a white water fountain, we do not consider the man who breaks that law a criminal or deserving of punishment, we consider that individual a freedom fighter.

 

Just like immigrants today, who fight for the freedom to immigrate to the best country in the world. We do not have the right to deny other people the ability to come to the US for a better life. Every human deserves the chance to live in the US if they want to.

 

And to answer the question, yes we accept everyone who wants to come here who is not a criminal or does not have a disease.

 

It is just as simple as that, the only reason most of us are here, is because those who came before, were generous enough to give our families a chance. Its just hypocrisy.

 

Like

[Balta1701]

So the solution is just accept everyone/everything that wants to come here?

 

There is a legal way to do it.

The DEMOCRATIC led House of Representatives voted down your precious bill, Balta. Your own "party" wussied out. Why? Because they knew King Obama would wave his magic EO wand and make it "law" anyway.

This is of course either an example of not Googling or deliberately lying.

The House of Representatives approved a bill that would grant thousands of young, illegal immigrants the chance to become American citizens Wednesday night.

 

Called the DREAM Act, the proposal would permit young people brought illegally into the U.S. by their parents the opportunity for citizenship. However, that's contingent on them completing two years of college or military service.

 

The vote was 216 to 198.

[kapkomet]

The problem is that the legal way to do it has become so unnecessarily convoluted that it prevents most people from legal immigration.

 

You see people forget that back in the late 19th and early 20th century, all you had to do was get off a boat, and you were allowed to legally immigrate here. You didnt have to get on a waiting list, hope your number was pulled etc.

 

Im not the child of an immigrant, I am 3rd generation. But if it wasnt for the American immigration policies of those eras, its likely that I would not exist, as a good part of my family would have been killed in World War II. People forget that during the 1930s the US created laws that were anti-capitalism and isolationism/protectonism ruled the day.

 

If the law itself is unjust, then those who break the law are not criminals. If it is against the law for a black man to drink water from a white water fountain, we do not consider the man who breaks that law a criminal or deserving of punishment, we consider that individual a freedom fighter.

 

Just like immigrants today, who fight for the freedom to immigrate to the best country in the world. We do not have the right to deny other people the ability to come to the US for a better life. Every human deserves the chance to live in the US if they want to.

 

And to answer the question, yes we accept everyone who wants to come here who is not a criminal or does not have a disease.

 

It is just as simple as that, the only reason most of us are here, is because those who came before, were generous enough to give our families a chance. Its just hypocrisy.

 

 

This is of course either an example of not Googling or deliberately lying.

 

Again, there's a legal way to do it.

 

I know people who are illegal, and despite whatever I think of them personally, they shouldn't be here.

 

19th century is different. We didn't have this entitlement society that we do now... and a lot of it is because people like you make choices to grow our government to take care of "us". Not that it matters - and they still had a process to follow, but nevermind that fact.

 

And you purposely put the senate vote down - I had forgotten but guess what, they had the 60 votes. But they wussed out and didn't pass the law. IT IS NOT LAW... oh wait, King Obama gets to write laws now too, and that's okay to you. UNJUST LAWS ARE LAW. Change it if you don't like it. Oh wait, it wasn't the political expedient thing to do at the time... so they got used as a political toy.

 

Then again, ILLEGAL hispanics just became gays. Political toys. Glad to know you all never care about the people you jump so much to help as nothing more then political pawns.

[Quin]

Again, there's a legal way to do it.

 

I know people who are illegal, and despite whatever I think of them personally, they shouldn't be here.

 

19th century is different. We didn't have this entitlement society that we do now... and a lot of it is because people like you make choices to grow our government to take care of "us". Not that it matters - and they still had a process to follow, but nevermind that fact.

 

And you purposely put the senate vote down - I had forgotten but guess what, they had the 60 votes. But they wussed out and didn't pass the law. IT IS NOT LAW... oh wait, King Obama gets to write laws now too, and that's okay to you. UNJUST LAWS ARE LAW. Change it if you don't like it. Oh wait, it wasn't the political expedient thing to do at the time... so they got used as a political toy.

 

Then again, ILLEGAL hispanics just became gays. Political toys. Glad to know you all never care about the people you jump so much to help as nothing more then political pawns.

 

Well I for one do, so I hope you're just referring to Balta because I'd die for my friends that are illegals and my friends that are gays, just like the rest of my friends.

[kapkomet]

Well I for one do, so I hope you're just referring to Balta because I'd die for my friends that are illegals and my friends that are gays, just like the rest of my friends.

 

 

You would have to understand my larger point that all these people are being used for political pawns. And it's sick.

[Balta1701]

You would have to understand my larger point that all these people are being used for political pawns. And it's sick.

And you're happy to use them as political pawns too.

[Quin]

You would have to understand my larger point that all these people are being used for political pawns. And it's sick.

 

You would have to understand my larger point that there people who have grown up here and some of them are the embodiment of the American Dream.

 

And don't act like the conservatives don't use them as pawns.

[Balta1701]

You would have to understand my larger point that there people who have grown up here and some of them are the embodiment of the American Dream.

 

And don't act like the conservatives don't use them as pawns.

It's a pretty big stretch to say that "getting used as a political pawn" is worse than "being deported to a country you don't know".

[kapkomet]

If you all think B.H.O. gives a f*** about gays and DREAM babies, you're more delusional then ever.

[mr_genius]

All I can say about this is my friend who came over when she 6 months old has more right to stay here than most legal residents.

 

no, actually, she doesn't

Edited June 17, 2012 by mr_genius

[Quin]

no, actually, she doesn't

 

Then how about at age 18 all children are given a test assessing their knowledge of the Constitution, American History, Presidents, etc.? That'll work.

[mr_genius]

Then how about at age 18 all children are given a test assessing their knowledge of the Constitution, American History, Presidents, etc.? That'll work.

 

well, that is obviously a pointless exercise and i think you know it. a policy of giving a simple history exam, which results in citizenship for anyone and everyone, has no value. i would also like to see how you remove everyone that fails the test. actually, i'm sure mexico would be happy to take all the US citizens that fail the history test. just make sure mexico has their entitlements ready; free food, free health care, free rent, free education, and so forth. they will be expecting it.

Edited June 17, 2012 by mr_genius

[Balta1701]

As long as we never acknowledge that these are people and we might want to take into account treating them like people. Then we can be mad about whatever we want, whether it's the politics or Medicare spending.

[EvilMonkey]

And no one has yet responded to my point, why should someone of hispanic decent be all for makign millions of illegal hispanics legal, JUST BECAUSE THEY ARE ALSO HISPANIC? Since Balta completelyt missed my point about criminals and assholes, let's try again. I don't freak out every time a white guy gets busted for something because I happen to be white as well. IF he broke the law, or was an asshole, so be it. So why do some hispanics need to defend other hispanics just because they are also hispanic? If the first hispanic was a criminal or broke the law, oh well.

 

As for your individual cases of people you know who were rbought here when they were young, what would you have done? Every decade or so just reward those whose parents were able to avoid deportation with citizenship? Way to rig the game for even more law breaking.

[Balta1701]

And no one has yet responded to my point, why should someone of hispanic decent be all for makign millions of illegal hispanics legal, JUST BECAUSE THEY ARE ALSO HISPANIC? Since Balta completelyt missed my point about criminals and assholes, let's try again. I don't freak out every time a white guy gets busted for something because I happen to be white as well. IF he broke the law, or was an asshole, so be it. So why do some hispanics need to defend other hispanics just because they are also hispanic? If the first hispanic was a criminal or broke the law, oh well.

 

As for your individual cases of people you know who were rbought here when they were young, what would you have done? Every decade or so just reward those whose parents were able to avoid deportation with citizenship? Way to rig the game for even more law breaking.

What would you have done? Where are you deporting them to when they legitimately aren't from that country? Are you arresting 2 year olds?

 

This is exactly waht I mean that nothing will ever get fixed when you refuse to acknowledge we have a massive problem with millions of people, and just pretend "oh they're lawbreakers they must be punished".

[EvilMonkey]

What would you have done? Where are you deporting them to when they legitimately aren't from that country? Are you arresting 2 year olds?

 

This is exactly waht I mean that nothing will ever get fixed when you refuse to acknowledge we have a massive problem with millions of people, and just pretend "oh they're lawbreakers they must be punished".

Perhaps if schools were allowed to check thngs like this, they would not have BEEN here long enough to get thru high school and we don''t have this situation. Hell, I know that here in Illinois the schools can't even verify income or employment status when someone applys for free lunch.I acknowledge that they are people and it isn't a pleasant situation. But neither is incenting millions more people to break the law and reap the benefits if they can hold out JUST long enough to where it is politically suicide to deport their kids. And please answer the first question, why should hispanics who follwed the law care anythgin about those that didn't?

[Balta1701]

Perhaps if schools were allowed to check thngs like this, they would not have BEEN here long enough to get thru high school and we don''t have this situation. Hell, I know that here in Illinois the schools can't even verify income or employment status when someone applys for free lunch.I acknowledge that they are people and it isn't a pleasant situation. But neither is incenting millions more people to break the law and reap the benefits if they can hold out JUST long enough to where it is politically suicide to deport their kids. And please answer the first question, why should hispanics who follwed the law care anythgin about those that didn't?

Let me give a counterexample...why is it so important that we "look forward" or whatever, rather than going back and prosecuting the entire financial industry?

 

There are 50 million or so latinos living in this country and somewhere between 10-20 million illegal immigrants (obviously not all of them come from latin america, but good enough to first order). That means if you know 10 families with latino heritage, one of your neighbors is probably illegal. Or at the very least, was illegal at some point. Or your kid's friend is. Or you have a cousin who got deported. Or 5% of your kids school class, and your kid comes home asking if he or she is going to be deported.

 

And on top of that, you pile on laws like Arizona and Alabama, racial profiling laws, or whatever the Proposition in California 2 decades ago was, where the state lumps everyone with non-white heritage in together and targets them for added searches and police harassment (and that's exactly what those laws are designed to do), and now you've put a target on the back of the whole community.