RZZZA Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 (edited) Besides the 5000 yards passing and 40 touchdowns he threw last year? At age 24. Health is the only reason to argue against him. The Lions were the #1 team in the NFL when it comes to passing attempts, and he has Calvin Johnson on his team. So that explains the big stats. Stafford ain't that good. He's not any better than Jay Cutler. Lions offense = f*** it, toss it to Calvin Edited July 9, 2012 by RZZZA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 QUOTE (RZZZA @ Jul 9, 2012 -> 03:52 PM) The Lions were the #1 team in the NFL when it comes to passing attempts, and he has Calvin Johnson on his team. So that explains the big stats. Stafford ain't that good. He's not any better than Jay Cutler. Lions offense = f*** it, toss it to Calvin He was, you know, 5th in the NFL in QBR last year. That's kinda a statistic that takes into account the number of attempts/completions. 41 touchdowns against 16 INTs is ridiculous. He threw 25 touchdowns to non-Megatron players. I love Jay Cutler, but come on, his career high for TDs in a season is 27, and that came with 26 picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RZZZA Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 He threw 4 picks against us in one game alone. *shrug* Our offense is different than theirs, we tend to run our TD's in, you know? We're a running team. They toss the ball around more than Drew Brees down in New Orleans, of course the passing stats will be gaudy. Jaws had Stafford at 14 and Jay Cutler at 8, I'm happy with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Does greg have offspring? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RZZZA Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 (edited) We'll see what Jay can do with this offense, talk to me about this again in a year or two when this offense gets a chance to get situated I firmly believe those stats are a result of megatron and have less to do with Stafford. He's not that talented And there's a lot of flaws in QBR Big Flaws in ESPN's Total QBR Exposed After Tim Tebow Rates Above Aaron Rodgers http://bleacherreport.com/articles/889199-...e-aaron-rodgers QBR: ESPN's Deeply Flawed Made-For-TV Stat http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Artic...or-TV_Stat.html Edited July 9, 2012 by RZZZA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 QUOTE (RZZZA @ Jul 9, 2012 -> 04:37 PM) We'll see what Jay can do with this offense, talk to me about this again in a year or two when this offense gets a chance to get situated I firmly believe those stats are a result of megatron and have less to do with Stafford. He's not that talented And there's a lot of flaws in QBR Big Flaws in ESPN's Total QBR Exposed After Tim Tebow Rates Above Aaron Rodgers http://bleacherreport.com/articles/889199-...e-aaron-rodgers QBR: ESPN's Deeply Flawed Made-For-TV Stat http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Artic...or-TV_Stat.html So are you going to say Jays much better stats a year from now are only because of Marshall(assuming the better situated offense makes Jays stats better)? Of course Stafford has a great wide reciever to throw it to, that doesnt make him a lesser quarterback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (RZZZA @ Jul 9, 2012 -> 04:37 PM) We'll see what Jay can do with this offense, talk to me about this again in a year or two when this offense gets a chance to get situated I firmly believe those stats are a result of megatron and have less to do with Stafford. He's not that talented And there's a lot of flaws in QBR Big Flaws in ESPN's Total QBR Exposed After Tim Tebow Rates Above Aaron Rodgers http://bleacherreport.com/articles/889199-...e-aaron-rodgers QBR: ESPN's Deeply Flawed Made-For-TV Stat http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Artic...or-TV_Stat.html I was actually talking about Quarter Back Rating, not ESPN's bulls***. I didn't know they used the term QBR, I was just abbreviating. Next time I will say QB Rating. Oh, and Stafford was 5th in the NFL last year in QB Rating. http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?arc...e&Submit=Go Edited July 9, 2012 by Steve9347 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RZZZA Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 I don't know, maybe you're right and Stafford deserves to be higher. But stats in the NFL are so misleading, QB's don't perform in a vacuum. Their performance is so heavily dependent on external factors. Having the best WR in football on that team, catching passes and drawing defensive attention, helps every other person on that offense including the other WR's and Stafford himself. I don't think the talent gap between Jay and Stafford is so wide and I hope Jay will prove that this year or next year. No more excuses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Get Steve Youbg out of the HOF. He had Jerry Rice!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RZZZA Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Yeah, f*** Steve Young. Jay Cutler > Steve Young Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (RZZZA @ Jul 9, 2012 -> 05:00 PM) I don't know, maybe you're right and Stafford deserves to be higher. But stats in the NFL are so misleading, QB's don't perform in a vacuum. Their performance is so heavily dependent on external factors. Having the best WR in football on that team, catching passes and drawing defensive attention, helps every other person on that offense including the other WR's and Stafford himself. I don't think the talent gap between Jay and Stafford is so wide and I hope Jay will prove that this year or next year. No more excuses. I understand what you're saying. I have a friend who is a huge Tom Brady fan, and he and I would always debate Peyton VS Tom. I still believe Peyton Manning is the greatest QB of all time because he can pretty much pick apart any defense with anybody lined up around him so long as they know the playbook and that he was basically another offensive coordinator out there. Meanwhile, I believed that Tom Brady was more of a system QB whose offenses simply frustrated defenses with the constant short passes followed by a couple bombs down the field. I then used the Matt Cassel to Curtis Painter comparison. He then asks if I think Tom Brady would suck like Matt Cassel did in KC with any other team. We do this for an hour and then realize we are in the middle of a hand of poker and we're both hammered. Oops. In the end, I still think I'm right, he still thinks he's right, and neither of us are wrong. When I think of the best QBs in the NFL, I try to think of them based purely on talent alone. I think Ben Roethlisberger is better than Drew Brees, but Brees is a far better fit for the system he is in and thus is more effective. Before his arm went all limp this past year, I loved Philip Rivers as a QB, but I don't know how well he'd fare in more of a West Coast offense as opposed to the generally vertical offense the Chargers run. At the end of the day, it's really hard to rate the QBs because there are way, way, way, waaaay too many independent factors to have this be anything more than conjecture and debate. Jaws has Ryan Fitzpatrick behind Mark Sanchez, but gun to their head, which QB do you think Mike McCarthy or Bill Belichick are going to pick? I'm going to guess Fitzpatrick. Gun to their head, who do you think Tom Coughlin or Norv Turner are going to pick? I'm going to guess Sanchez. Because that's who fits the system. --- After that philosophical digression, Jay Cutler and Matthew Stafford are pretty similar QBs overall. I think if you could go back in time and flip flop those two in 2009, we'd be having the exact same debate we are now, except you'd be arguing that Cutler probably deserves to be higher, and Steve would be saying "Dude, Cutler, 5000 yards, who cares about Calvin Johnson." Both have health issues, both have cannon arms, both have bouts with inaccuracy, both can move outside the pocket. It's the same debate my friend and I have over Tom Brady and Peyton Manning. Edited July 10, 2012 by witesoxfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuskyCaucasian Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 @reporterjon Exclusive: Attempted Murder Warrant out for Antoinne Hester brother of #bears star Devin Hester. The latest at 4:30. @reporterjon Victim in Antoinne Hester case has died. Warrant out for his arrest. He's the brother of #Bears star Devin Hester. LE in touch with Devin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cabiness42 Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 Wow, that's not good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farmteam Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Jul 9, 2012 -> 04:33 PM) Does greg have offspring? So I just went in three threads in a row (NBA, NHL, NFL) that I hadn't checked since yesterday, and the first page I looked on each one had you asking some form of this question. Classic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuskyCaucasian Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 @AdamHogeCBS The Broward County Sheriff's office confirms to me that Antoinne Hester (wanted for murder in Florida) is Devin Hester's cousin. #Bears Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RZZZA Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 Almost made it through an entire offseason without any legal controversy. But we don't know if Hester and his cousin are even close. I have cousins, but I never see them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 QUOTE (RZZZA @ Jul 10, 2012 -> 01:19 PM) Almost made it through an entire offseason without any legal controversy. But we don't know if Hester and his cousin are even close. I have cousins, but I never see them. This isn't Bears' controversy, it's just some whacked out relative of one of the players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RZZZA Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 I just hope it doesn't distract Hester. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 QUOTE (RZZZA @ Jul 10, 2012 -> 03:05 PM) I just hope it doesn't distract Hester. All Hester has to worry about is returning kicks, this shouldnt distract him from that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RZZZA Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 Apparently he also has to worry about being a WR, Bears sound determined to make the Hester Package a staple of the offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 QUOTE (RZZZA @ Jul 10, 2012 -> 05:32 PM) Apparently he also has to worry about being a WR, Bears sound determined to make the Hester Package a staple of the offense. He isn't getting more reps than Marshall, Jeffery and Bennett. Hell, he may not get more reps than Devin Thomas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RZZZA Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 They've been talking up that Hester Package as if he'll be a legit WR though. Not saying more targets than Marshall or Bennett, but certainly could be more than Jefferey or Thomas. Then again it could be offseason propaganda and nothing more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 QUOTE (RZZZA @ Jul 10, 2012 -> 06:31 PM) They've been talking up that Hester Package as if he'll be a legit WR though. Not saying more targets than Marshall or Bennett, but certainly could be more than Jefferey or Thomas. Then again it could be offseason propaganda and nothing more They have been telling us since he signed his contract that he would be involved more. They have tried, its just a square peg in a round hole. The guy is a gimmick WR, Dante Hall without the prior knowledge of the position. He is an amazing kick returner, I'm happy leaving him doing that now that there are some bigtime WRs on the roster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 WRs coach more or less openly criticized the previous management of Hester, saying they always installed a "Hester package" but never, ever used it in season. Basically said there was no effort to integrate him into the offense, which made him an average receiver (what you'd expect from a guy playing the 3rd-4th receiver spot) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cabiness42 Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 The rules that moved the kickoffs up to the 35 pretty much destroyed Hester's value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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