You be the judge

[iamshack]

From the Texas Attorney General Website and the training I have had

 

Again, why would I risk my career, reputation, and income? I am not an attorney. If I knew a minor was dating an adult, I would report it, not play cop or attorney.

 

I ONLY LOSE IF I FAIL TO REPORT.

 

Again, if I fail to report that is the same as covering it up in the public's eyes. I only risk my job if I fail to report.

 

And in case anyone is missing the point, I am saying what I would have done as a coach and teacher. I am not suggesting that what those coaches did was correct. It was wrong.

This is in regards to child abuse, not a 16 year old and an 18 year old dating.

[iamshack]

No, you locked a 16 year old in a room and pressured her to admit that they were dating but nothing more.

I'm talking about prior to anyone taking any action...just evaluating what to do based on the "rumor."

[StrangeSox]

shack (or anyone else with law history),

 

is there a difference between "affirmative defense" and "not illegal?" Could the 18 year old still be charged with a crime?

 

 

Edited February 24, 2012 by StrangeSox

[iamshack]

shack (or anyone else with law history),

 

is there a difference between "affirmative defense" and "not illegal?" Could the 18 year old still be charged with a crime?

An affirmative defense is basically an excuse. It's not the same as making the act legal, but it can excuse culpability entirely in some cases. In other cases, it only partially does so and is a mitigating factor.

[StrangeSox]

An affirmative defense is basically an excuse. It's not the same as making the act legal, but it can excuse culpability entirely in some cases. In other cases, it only partially does so and is a mitigating factor.

this is why I'd want to clarify with administration and possibly district attorneys or the local prosecutors' office after learning about this case and the statute. Is this, assuming knowledge or good suspicion of sexual contact, something that's potentially criminal and that you should report? Or would the police say it's not a crime and you're wasting their time?

 

Not the same situation but this would lead me to believe that, no, your mandatory reporting duties are not alleviated:

http://www.bsc-cdhs.org/mr/pdf/abndn_infnt.pdf

 

But I wouldn't consider knowledge of a 16yo and an 18yo dating to be sufficient to report to police.

Edited February 24, 2012 by StrangeSox

[Texsox]

You guys want to be attorneys and cops. I want to be a teacher. You guys want to risk your careers. I don't. You guys are experts on the law in Texas when an adult dates a minor. I am not.

 

I risk nothing by reporting. I risk be accused of covering up an illegal relationship. I would say that rape, even statutory rape, would be abuse and I would report it. You guys are willing to bet your careers that you know the law. I am not that confident in my abilities as a lawyer.

[StrangeSox]

You guys want to be attorneys and cops. I want to be a teacher. You guys want to risk your careers. I don't. You guys are experts on the law in Texas when an adult dates a minor. I am not.

 

I risk nothing by reporting. I risk be accused of covering up an illegal relationship. I would say that rape, even statutory rape, would be abuse and I would report it. You guys are willing to bet your careers that you know the law. I am not that confident in my abilities as a lawyer.

 

Would you report a 16 year old and an 18 year old who are married?

 

And actually I've taken the position that I'd want to discuss this with administrators, police and prosecutors to determine if 16/18 sexual contact is a crime that should be reported.

Edited February 24, 2012 by StrangeSox

[iamshack]

You guys want to be attorneys and cops. I want to be a teacher. You guys want to risk your careers. I don't. You guys are experts on the law in Texas when an adult dates a minor. I am not.

 

I risk nothing by reporting. I risk be accused of covering up an illegal relationship. I would say that rape, even statutory rape, would be abuse and I would report it. You guys are willing to bet your careers that you know the law. I am not that confident in my abilities as a lawyer.

You also risk being a crappy teacher and role model to your students, which last I checked, is your job in the first place.

[Texsox]

You also risk being a crappy teacher and role model to your students, which last I checked, is your job in the first place.

 

Which are two more great reasons why I should report. People who aren't willing to protect kids from abuse should not be teaching. People who ignore potential illegal activities because they don't want to get involved are very poor role models.

[iamshack]

Which are two more great reasons why I should report. People who aren't willing to protect kids from abuse should not be teaching. People who ignore potential illegal activities because they don't want to get involved are very poor role models.

THIS IS NOT ABUSE.

 

Child abuse, in the context you keep using, is not what may or may not have occurred in this situation.

 

Secondly, let the kids live their lives for god sakes. Remember back when you were 16...were you really afraid of being "abused" by an 18 year old girl?

 

You are being absolutely ridiculous right now.

[Texsox]

Again, you do understand this is my career? This is how I earn a living. When the mom is screaming to the police and press that her daughter was being raped (statutory) by an adult, the school knew about it, and did nothing, I very well could lose my job. Now perhaps losing your job doesn't mean that much to you, but it does to me.

 

If I report and it is legal, no problem.

If I do not report and it is legal, again no problem.

If I report and it is illegal, again no problem.

If I fail to report and it is illegal, I lose.

 

Now look carefully at that list, when do I lose? Why is it ridiculous to follow the training I have received and report if I am uncertain?

 

You are saying it is not abuse, I am not a lawyer. I am trained by the state of Texas to not investigate, to not make legal judgments. I am required by law to report if I suspect abuse. Are you suggesting that statutory rape is not abuse?

[StrangeSox]

Is knowledge of an adult dating a minor but under a situation in the affirmative defense clause enough to report? I'd clarify that hypothetical myself, now being aware of the situation.

 

Honestly, what do you think the police reaction would be if you called and reported knowledge of a 16 and an 18 yo dating?

 

Would you report knowledge of a minor and an adult being married?

Edited February 24, 2012 by StrangeSox

[iamshack]

Again, you do understand this is my career? This is how I earn a living. When the mom is screaming to the police and press that her daughter was being raped (statutory) by an adult, the school knew about it, and did nothing, I very well could lose my job. Now perhaps losing your job doesn't mean that much to you, but it does to me.

 

If I report and it is legal, no problem.

If I do not report and it is legal, again no problem.

If I report and it is illegal, again no problem.

If I fail to report and it is illegal, I lose.

 

Now look carefully at that list, when do I lose? Why is it ridiculous to follow the training I have received and report if I am uncertain?

 

You are saying it is not abuse, I am not a lawyer. I am trained by the state of Texas to not investigate, to not make legal judgments. I am required by law to report if I suspect abuse. Are you suggesting that statutory rape is not abuse?

You are being ridiculously overdramatic for the sake of your argument.

 

You're citing information that is completely out of context.

 

Finally, go ahead and report it to the police. If they then went to my parents I would hate you as a teacher and think you were meddling in my affairs and masturbating to my pictures and s***.

[iamshack]

Is knowledge of an adult dating a minor but under a situation in the affirmative defense clause enough to report? I'd clarify that hypothetical myself, now being aware of the situation.

 

Honestly, what do you think the police reaction would be if you called and reported knowledge of a 16 and an 18 yo dating?

 

Would you report knowledge of a minor and an adult being married?

I'd love to see something that is actually in context here. This is high school. Real life.

 

What if they were both students at the school. There are no seniors dating sophomores or freshman? Are we reporting them all to the police?

 

Give me a break!

[Texsox]

You are being ridiculously overdramatic for the sake of your argument.

 

You're citing information that is completely out of context.

 

Finally, go ahead and report it to the police. If they then went to my parents I would hate you as a teacher and think you were meddling in my affairs and masturbating to my pictures and s***.

 

The reporting is very simple. I would ask the on-campus police office to stop by during my conference period and explain what was going on. I have fulfilled my duties.

 

Think about the 17 year old that was in the news last week for having sex with the Bengals adult cheerleader/ teacher. Yeah, the guy was probably having a great time. But if a teacher knew about the relationship and did not report it, they would be fired. This isn't about being cool, this is about being a responsible adult. The student can think what they want. If you are worried about hurting the feelings of a student you should not be responsible for them. You are more concerned about the minor child and what she wants. I am concerned about my legal obligations as a teacher.

 

And you accuse me of being ridiculous? You're the one that seems to be overly concerned about the 16 year old getting laid and wanting it to continue.

[iamshack]

The reporting is very simple. I would ask the on-campus police office to stop by during my conference period and explain what was going on. I have fulfilled my duties.

 

Think about the 17 year old that was in the news last week for having sex with the Bengals adult cheerleader/ teacher. Yeah, the guy was probably having a great time. But if a teacher knew about the relationship and did not report it, they would be fired. This isn't about being cool, this is about being a responsible adult. The student can think what they want. If you are worried about hurting the feelings of a student you should not be responsible for them. You are more concerned about the minor child and what she wants. I am concerned about my legal obligations as a teacher.

 

And you accuse me of being ridiculous? You're the one that seems to be overly concerned about the 16 year old getting laid and wanting it to continue.

Fair enough, Tex.

 

HS senior, Bengals cheerleader...same difference, really.

[StrangeSox]

The reporting is very simple. I would ask the on-campus police office to stop by during my conference period and explain what was going on. I have fulfilled my duties.

 

Think about the 17 year old that was in the news last week for having sex with the Bengals adult cheerleader/ teacher. Yeah, the guy was probably having a great time. But if a teacher knew about the relationship and did not report it, they would be fired. This isn't about being cool, this is about being a responsible adult. The student can think what they want. If you are worried about hurting the feelings of a student you should not be responsible for them. You are more concerned about the minor child and what she wants. I am concerned about my legal obligations as a teacher.

 

And you accuse me of being ridiculous? You're the one that seems to be overly concerned about the 16 year old getting laid and wanting it to continue.

The Bengals cheerleader lacked an affirmative defense, so the situation is different.

 

But I don't really have a problem with your first step.

Edited February 25, 2012 by StrangeSox

[iamshack]

The Bengals cheerleader lacked an affirmative defense, so the situation is different.

 

But I don't really have a problem with your first step.

My problem with the first step is that this is a perfectly normal situation for boys and girls of that age to be involved in. Once again, what if they are attending that school? What if a senior is dating a sophomore? Are you going to stop the campus police and honestly report to them that these kids are dating, and THEY COULD EVEN BE HAVING SEX!!!

 

 

[Texsox]

My problem with the first step is that this is a perfectly normal situation for boys and girls of that age to be involved in. Once again, what if they are attending that school? What if a senior is dating a sophomore? Are you going to stop the campus police and honestly report to them that these kids are dating, and THEY COULD EVEN BE HAVING SEX!!!

 

Yep, it's tough to be an adult. Kids might not like you. They may think you are mean. You can't look at the situation and think lucky kid. You have to be responsible. And this was an adult who was not attending the school. A defense of well I already reported three others so I thought I didn't have to report anymore won't fly. Plus in the real world I would not often be privy to who people are dating unless it was in the same school.

 

Plus once the campus cop tells me that a 16 year old can date any adult, I wouldn't have to report anymore. If he tells me it is illegal, then I would continue to report all I knew about.

[StrangeSox]

This seems appropriate for this thread:

 

Teen Sues School For Announcing She Was Pregnant At Assembly

 

When Shantelle Hicks was kicked out of school for getting pregnant, she thought that was about as humiliating as things could be.

She was wrong.

After being forced to let Hicks return to school or face a lawsuit from the American Civil Liberties Union, Wingate Elementary School in McKinley, New Mexico, let Hicks back in. Then, they held an all-school assembly where they made Hicks tell all of the students that she was pregnant.

“It was so embarrassing to have all the other kids staring at me as I walked into the gymnasium,” said Hicks in a statement. “I didn’t want the whole school to know I was pregnant because it’s not their business, and it wasn’t right for my teachers to single me out.”

Hicks is suing the school for violating Title IX, which prohibits sex and pregnancy discrimination in education. The school is saying that the move was justified, as otherwise she would be setting a bad example for other students. But Hicks’ lawyers argue that the public outing was punishment for her refusing their offer of a transfer to an “alternative school.”

Are we really still trying to send pregnant teens to “special schools” so they don’t influence other students? Next, will we send them off to “live with cousins” and then pretend nothing ever happened when they return?

Sign the petition below and tell Wingate Elementary that bullying a pregnant teen is wrong.

[Jenksismyhero]

Lol, this country is so f***ed up

[Texsox]

Lol, this country is so f***ed up

She's in elementary school and having a baby!?

[CrimsonWeltall]

She's in elementary school and having a baby!?

 

Looked it up. She's 15 and in 8th grade. The school is Preschool-8th grade.

[StrangeSox]

It's not a normal school but a school for special needs or something along those lines.

[Texsox]

http://www.themonitor.com/articles/elsa-59...-suspended.html

 

ELSA – Edcouch-Elsa school officials recently fired one baseball coach and suspended another over allegations that they willfully ignored two students engaged in sexual activity on a bus ride last month.

 

The Monitor has not reviewed the video. But the district’s attorney said it was clear an 18-year-old female student trainer and 17-year-old baseball player engaged in sexual behavior while lying down in the seat directly behind Franco.

 

The two students involved in the incident have been placed at an alternative education campus, Acevedo said. He added that the district contacted the state’s Child Protective Services division and the Elsa Police Department about the case since the male student is a minor.

 

An 18-year-old and a 17-year-old having sex and what did the school district do? Called the police.

 

But they like the coach who was fired. So he has that going for him.