macsandz Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 It's been weeks in LF now and I'm sure it won't affect his hitting... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyDo Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 I get that people are annoyed that Viciedo moved from 3B to RF to LF, but the alternative was to keep him at a position he's bad at, and in the minor leagues. Switched him to RF so he could get a callup and because Pierre can't play RF with his arm. I'm not 100% sure why he's in LF now, but switching corner outfield spots really should not be anything more than shrug-worthy. It's not like switching to CF or between IF spots. I understand that there are some differences in the way the ball comes off the bats of righties vs. lefties, but we have never balked at players switching corner spots before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 QUOTE (ScottyDo @ Mar 16, 2012 -> 08:27 AM) I get that people are annoyed that Viciedo moved from 3B to RF to LF, but the alternative was to keep him at a position he's bad at, and in the minor leagues. Switched him to RF so he could get a callup and because Pierre can't play RF with his arm. I'm not 100% sure why he's in LF now, but switching corner outfield spots really should not be anything more than shrug-worthy. It's not like switching to CF or between IF spots. I understand that there are some differences in the way the ball comes off the bats of righties vs. lefties, but we have never balked at players switching corner spots before. I agree that corner OF spots are more interchangeable than people acknowledge, from a player's adjustment perspective as opposed to an ideal skills perspective. The ball is always going to hook toward the line when pushed, etc. The only time I think it's a bigger deal is when the park has significant differences from one side to the other, like Fenway, but we aren't dealing with that at the Cell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 I see Kenny Wuilliams Jr is hitting 1.000. Viciedo is like .174. Maybe we have the wrong hero set for RF? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPN366 Posted March 17, 2012 Share Posted March 17, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Mar 16, 2012 -> 02:11 PM) I see Kenny Wuilliams Jr is hitting 1.000. Viciedo is like .174. Maybe we have the wrong hero set for RF? KW Jr. will break camp next year. He needs a little more seasoning in AAA. I wish I could be sarcastic, but I actually think it will happen. I hope I'm wrong. Edited March 17, 2012 by JPN366 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 How's Viciedo hitting this spring? Is he taking any walks? Pounding the ball? Fill those of us in who dont follow spring training closely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 QUOTE (greg775 @ Mar 18, 2012 -> 01:51 AM) How's Viciedo hitting this spring? Is he taking any walks? Pounding the ball? Fill those of us in who dont follow spring training closely. You can find stats from "Official, A-games" (not b games or practice games) at ESPN's page. Viciedo's hitting .154 on the spring, right there with Pierzynski and Konerko. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 I know he had a prodigious homer in one of the intrasquad games, but he's really, really struggling now. 4/28, lots of K's and LOB. But we have no choice but to go with him and roll the dice. He was signed to be a franchise cornerstone/building block. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Springfield Soxfan Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Mar 18, 2012 -> 07:13 PM) I know he had a prodigious homer in one of the intrasquad games, but he's really, really struggling now. 4/28, lots of K's and LOB. But we have no choice but to go with him and roll the dice. He was signed to be a franchise cornerstone/building block. Agreed, his spring stats really do not matter, he is on the team and either the starting LF or RF. Just work on his confidence right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Mar 18, 2012 -> 08:13 PM) I know he had a prodigious homer in one of the intrasquad games, but he's really, really struggling now. 4/28, lots of K's and LOB. But we have no choice but to go with him and roll the dice. He was signed to be a franchise cornerstone/building block. He'll be struggling till about May/June. (just like Alexei, and just like he has the past two seasons in the minors) It's the Cuban way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macsandz Posted March 19, 2012 Author Share Posted March 19, 2012 QUOTE (ScottyDo @ Mar 16, 2012 -> 08:27 AM) I get that people are annoyed that Viciedo moved from 3B to RF to LF, but the alternative was to keep him at a position he's bad at, and in the minor leagues. Switched him to RF so he could get a callup and because Pierre can't play RF with his arm. I'm not 100% sure why he's in LF now, but switching corner outfield spots really should not be anything more than shrug-worthy. It's not like switching to CF or between IF spots. I understand that there are some differences in the way the ball comes off the bats of righties vs. lefties, but we have never balked at players switching corner spots before. He's in LF now to accomodate Rios' inability to play CF. Once again the Sox forcefeed a young prospect an unnatural position to accomodate an overpaid underachieving veteran. Viciedo has looked AWFUL in LF. Just brutal and it's obviously affecting his hitting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Mar 19, 2012 -> 08:56 AM) He's in LF now to accomodate Rios' inability to play CF. Once again the Sox forcefeed a young prospect an unnatural position to accomodate an overpaid underachieving veteran. Viciedo has looked AWFUL in LF. Just brutal and it's obviously affecting his hitting. Here's a newsflash. Viciedo has been an AWFUL fielder no matter where he has been, and it has never affected his hitting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macsandz Posted March 19, 2012 Author Share Posted March 19, 2012 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Mar 19, 2012 -> 09:01 AM) Here's a newsflash. Viciedo has been an AWFUL fielder no matter where he has been, and it has never affected his hitting. There's bad and then there's awful. The guy booted three ground balls to him in one game last week. He came to camp expecting to play RF. They dropped this move to LF on him. It's not like he had an offseason to prepare. That's gonna affect his head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Mar 19, 2012 -> 02:31 PM) There's bad and then there's awful. The guy booted three ground balls to him in one game last week. He came to camp expecting to play RF. They dropped this move to LF on him. It's not like he had an offseason to prepare. That's gonna affect his head. He was awful at 3B when he had years of practice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 (edited) It is kind of amusing that KW's and Bell's solution to the 3B problem was to sign/acquire/trade for two of the worst 3B in modern-day baseball history in Teahen and Viciedo. Throw in Wilson Betemit, and you have a true Axis of Evil Defense. Even more ironic that after watching Crede and Uribe all those years and the positive effect it had on our pitching staff, they still decided to go in that direction. Edited March 20, 2012 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatScott82 Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Mar 19, 2012 -> 07:27 PM) It is kind of amusing that KW's and Bell's solution to the 3B problem was to sign/acquire/trade for two of the worst 3B in modern-day baseball history in Teahen and Viciedo. Throw in Wilson Betemit, and you have a true Axis of Evil Defense. Even more ironic that after watching Crede and Uribe all those years and the positive effect it had on our pitching staff, they still decided to go in that direction. I think they did a good job of replacing Uribe's defense with Ramirez. I think the jury is still out on Morel, but he has shown glimpses of Credeness at the hot corner. As far as Viciedo goes, I just believe he is a potential DH who plays the field as of right now. I hope he can be decent out in LF, similar to Carlos Lee, at least he was adequite. We will definitley need Viciedo's bat if they want any prayer of competing in 2012. Now lets just hope he doesn't boot many baseballs during the regular season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyDo Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Mar 19, 2012 -> 09:56 AM) He's in LF now to accomodate Rios' inability to play CF. Once again the Sox forcefeed a young prospect an unnatural position to accomodate an overpaid underachieving veteran. Viciedo has looked AWFUL in LF. Just brutal and it's obviously affecting his hitting. I follow your premise up until the point of this gigantic leap of logic. First off, baseball is not to be judged in ~25 AB bursts. Any random smattering of at-bats could be terrible and may indicate nothing about how that player is feeling in general. Second, even if Viciedo is, in the bigger picture of things, hitting poorly, there could be a billion-and-one reasons for it. A (small) change in position is one of the factors that changed coincident with Viciedo's poor ST start, but another thing that changed was the calendar year. Maybe he's feeling the pressure of having a starting spot be his to lose. Maybe he did something stupid with his swing in the offseason. Maybe he's swinging at tons of pitches to try and get his timing down. Who knows? There's no way to isolate the variable you're claiming was causal. Finally, it's freaking spring training. It can't be stressed enough how little spring training results matter. Last year's AL Champion is behind the White Sox in the Cactus league, and until this week, the Phillies and Yankees were close to the bottom of the Grapefruit league. None of this matters, which is the whole point: it's just an opportunity to warm up before things matter, and that could mean different things for different players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 Why the hell did they move him to left? I thought he was doing well in right and had a good arm? If we didn't have the bum, Dunn, we could DH Viciedo the next 15 years (if his age is not a lie) and be done with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 QUOTE (greg775 @ Mar 19, 2012 -> 10:25 PM) Why the hell did they move him to left? I thought he was doing well in right and had a good arm? If we didn't have the bum, Dunn, we could DH Viciedo the next 15 years (if his age is not a lie) and be done with it. Because sticking Rios in left seemed like a waste. Rios is clearly the superior fielder and has shown that he can play the position extremely well in previous years. Viciedo will be fine in LF, it's actually easier than RF (which is why they stick all the crappy OFers in left), it'll just take time to adjust since he's only played the OF for a year thus far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 QUOTE (greg775 @ Mar 19, 2012 -> 10:25 PM) If we didn't have the bum, Dunn, we could DH Viciedo the next 15 years (if his age is not a lie) and be done with it. For the love of God you don't DH a 23 year old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Mar 19, 2012 -> 08:27 PM) It is kind of amusing that KW's and Bell's solution to the 3B problem was to sign/acquire/trade for two of the worst 3B in modern-day baseball history in Teahen and Viciedo. Throw in Wilson Betemit, and you have a true Axis of Evil Defense. Even more ironic that after watching Crede and Uribe all those years and the positive effect it had on our pitching staff, they still decided to go in that direction. The Sox didn't get Viciedo because of his glove. They got him for his bat. Period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shakes Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Mar 19, 2012 -> 01:31 PM) There's bad and then there's awful. The guy booted three ground balls to him in one game last week. He came to camp expecting to play RF. They dropped this move to LF on him. It's not like he had an offseason to prepare. That's gonna affect his head. You don't need an entire offseason to prepare to switch from RF to LF. They are the two most interchangeable positions in baseball. There are guys who switch back and forth all season long, even within a game. By all accounts LF is slightly easier to play and will cost your team less bases when mistakes are made. If he is booting ground balls in LF, my guess is it would be happening in RF. He is in LF because it gives the Sox their best defensive alignment with Rios in RF. He is young and has time to improve his defense. I don't know if it will happen, but he can improve. And good hitters will hit, no matter where you put them. He has been bounced around his entire minor league career and it hasn't affected his hitting. The list of players changing positions and still being good hitters is endless. If a defensive switch from RF to LF in spring training is screwing with his head that bad, he is in trouble. I personally think we should give him more than two weeks of spring training at bats before crucifying him and the entire organization for their gall of moving him from a one corner OF spot to the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macsandz Posted March 20, 2012 Author Share Posted March 20, 2012 QUOTE (shakes @ Mar 20, 2012 -> 10:05 AM) You don't need an entire offseason to prepare to switch from RF to LF. They are the two most interchangeable positions in baseball. There are guys who switch back and forth all season long, even within a game. By all accounts LF is slightly easier to play and will cost your team less bases when mistakes are made. If he is booting ground balls in LF, my guess is it would be happening in RF. He is in LF because it gives the Sox their best defensive alignment with Rios in RF. He is young and has time to improve his defense. I don't know if it will happen, but he can improve. And good hitters will hit, no matter where you put them. He has been bounced around his entire minor league career and it hasn't affected his hitting. The list of players changing positions and still being good hitters is endless. If a defensive switch from RF to LF in spring training is screwing with his head that bad, he is in trouble. I personally think we should give him more than two weeks of spring training at bats before crucifying him and the entire organization for their gall of moving him from a one corner OF spot to the other. If Viciedo is hitting .210 in May, you still think it will have nothing at all to do with playing LF? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyDo Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Mar 20, 2012 -> 03:55 PM) If Viciedo is hitting .210 in May, you still think it will have nothing at all to do with playing LF? Absolutely. If Viciedo is hitting poorly for ~3 months, it likely has nothing to do with a simple positional change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Mar 20, 2012 -> 11:02 AM) For the love of God you don't DH a 23 year old. If he's as bad defensively as people in his thread are saying, why the hell not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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