2012-2013 NCAA Basketball thread

[LittleHurt05]

Its not the compliance dept. Its how tightly knitted the group of boosters is within the community. UK fans are the entire city, its going to be very hard to crack that nut. The SEC in general is very good at hiding things and never ever letting them out.

 

It's like that in any town where the college sports are more important than anything else. Which suprised me that a town like Columbus had a slip up with their football team.

[LittleHurt05]

How many big name coaches have left a trail of NCAA sanctions in their wake?

 

The Shark is one.

[cabiness42]

ESPN has updated their post-signing day preseason Top 25, and the Top 3 are all within 100 miles of my house.

[clyons]

The Shark is one.

 

Not sure if Bruce Pearl counts as a "big name coach," but I'd say Kelvin Sampson does.

 

Edit: Jim Harrick, too.

Edited April 12, 2012 by PlaySumFnJurny

[LittleHurt05]

ESPN has updated their post-signing day preseason Top 25, and the Top 3 are all within 100 miles of my house.

 

Are you sure that's something you should be bragging about?

[cabiness42]

Are you sure that's something you should be bragging about?

 

Not really bragging, because I already don't like living down here, and in a normal year they spend too much time talking about college basketball during baseball season on local sports radio, and now it will be even worse!

[ChiSox_Sonix]

My question would be how different is it than a player de-committing from a school at the last minute?

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/highschool-p...-185529935.html

 

It's not

[Soxbadger]

The new Rivals rankings have Dekker at 13, 2nd highest Big 10 recruit behind Robinson III. Kind of amazing that Wisconsin got him.

[RockRaines]

It's like that in any town where the college sports are more important than anything else. Which suprised me that a town like Columbus had a slip up with their football team.

All it took was a federal investigation into a drug dealer who just happened to buy up all the players merchandise. Once the NCAA got that in, it was all over. They only uncovered a bit of what was happening but luckily when they brought in the new regime, alot of the bulls*** was cut off. Maybe some will come back, but alot of the key players arent allowed near the kids anymore.

 

The new Rivals rankings have Dekker at 13, 2nd highest Big 10 recruit behind Robinson III. Kind of amazing that Wisconsin got him.

Welcome to yesterday bro, I gave them some props. He looks REAL good. Now you just need a PG.

[Rex Hudler]

Rex,

 

Crean has a terrible reputation in Wisconsin for over-signing. My guess is that on the recruitment trail someone told his family about his love of oversigning and they didnt want to feel their sons commitment caused another player to lose his spot.

 

http://oversigning.com/testing/index.php/2...more-1419\

 

http://kentsterling.com/2010/08/24/indiana...rivals-5-stars/

 

 

 

I dont know if that will play well in the Indiana High Schools. At Marquette he basically would get 1 recruit from Wisconsin a year, at Indiana he seemingly is going to get multiple in state. You have to believe the Creaning of players is going to eventually ruin some relationships.

 

I'm not a big fan of it in theory, but it is is managed I can live with it. I trust he will manage his roster in a fair way. I think this year we're here because it was widely believed (even before the season started) that Watford would not stay for his 4th year. If he starts having players leave early for the NBA he'll need it. If players aren't playing enough and unhappy, they'll leave. It would not shock me for Creek to be unable to return and be healthy and take a medical hardship. I'm just speculating.

 

We'll see how he manages things the next few years, but I do agree that it could become a problem if we are oversigned every year at this point.

[Rex Hudler]

My question would be how different is it than a player de-committing from a school at the last minute?

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/highschool-p...-185529935.html

 

I tend to agree. It sounds harsh, but if they don't feel the kid is good enough to play, he won't be happy sitting the bench. Who knows exactly how they presented it to him. But if they feel he's not going to play, I think the kid would rather (maybe he doesn't realize it yet) know now than invest a year or two and have to sit out a year while transferring. Note the article stated they are asking the kid to release the school from its obligation. If he says no, he can go and work his ass off and prove he belongs. I can't see a coach not playing a kind that is good enough out of spite. Especially one that does everything asked, works his tail off and is a team player. Perhaps they could have asked him to switch to preferred wak on status for a year with an opportunity to earn the scholly in year 2? Maybe they did?

[Rex Hudler]

It's not

 

Actually it is different because the NLI had been signed. A last minute de-commit happens before signing day. This kid has already signed. That said I don't think it is automatically a terrible thing. See my previous post.

[Heads22]

I'll take ISU just outside the Top 25.

[RockRaines]

I'll take ISU just outside the Top 25.

I saw you had some good recruits coming in.

[He_Gawn]

I'm not a big fan of it in theory, but it is is managed I can live with it. I trust he will manage his roster in a fair way. I think this year we're here because it was widely believed (even before the season started) that Watford would not stay for his 4th year. If he starts having players leave early for the NBA he'll need it. If players aren't playing enough and unhappy, they'll leave. It would not shock me for Creek to be unable to return and be healthy and take a medical hardship. I'm just speculating.

 

We'll see how he manages things the next few years, but I do agree that it could become a problem if we are oversigned every year at this point.

 

 

Along with that, if he was really kicking these kids to the curb, at least one would have spoken up by now, right? Kid gets sent to prep school, is that any different?

[ChiSox_Sonix]

Actually it is different because the NLI had been signed. A last minute de-commit happens before signing day. This kid has already signed. That said I don't think it is automatically a terrible thing. See my previous post.

 

I didn't read into the details. So yes, in this case it isn't exactly the same thing, I was more talking in general since it seems kids decommit quite regularly nowadays

[Soxbadger]

I just am not a fan of over signing, I dislike it in football and basketball. I think that once a player signs a LOI the school should honor it for 4 years, I also think that once a player signs they should have to honor it for 4 years unless both parties agree.

 

As for why kids havent spoken up? Most newspapers dont write articles about bench players who transfer to another school. You dont see a lot about it anywhere, even though its considered a widespread practice.

 

For me, I just would never want a coach who wants to over-sign every year, I personally wish it was against the rules.

[He_Gawn]

I just am not a fan of over signing, I dislike it in football and basketball. I think that once a player signs a LOI the school should honor it for 4 years, I also think that once a player signs they should have to honor it for 4 years unless both parties agree.

 

As for why kids havent spoken up? Most newspapers dont write articles about bench players who transfer to another school. You dont see a lot about it anywhere, even though its considered a widespread practice.

 

For me, I just would never want a coach who wants to over-sign every year, I personally wish it was against the rules.

 

If someone spoke out about Tom Crean "pushing" them out, it would be all over the news, don't kid yourself. College sports is a business more than anything these days. It takes two, the coach and the player. You don't know both sides.

 

Do you think it's worse than what Bo Ryan is going to do to this kid? Just came out today...

 

Class, Mr. Ryan

 

[Soxbadger]

So I guess Jarrod Uthoff has surprisingly asked for a transfer from Wisconsin after redshirting this year. I believe Uthoff was Iowa basketball player of the year. Sounds like the Wisconsin staff is not that pleased and likely will restrict him from transferring to any Big 10 school, Iowa State or Marquette.

[Soxbadger]

Are you seriously comparing Bo Ryan, who wants a player to honor his commitment, to Crean, who pushes kids out of the program?

 

Uthoff has a spot on the Wisconsin roster, he took a scholarship from other players for a full season. He now wants to move on, Bo Ryan is agreeing to allow him to move on to certain schools. If Uthoff wanted to go to Iowa or Iowa State, he could have made that decision.

 

You are acting like Ryan isnt allowing him out of the scholarship, you have no idea what the restrictions are.

 

I guarantee that if Zeller wanted to transfer to OSU, Crean would say no.

[He_Gawn]

Are you seriously comparing Bo Ryan, who wants a player to honor his commitment, to Crean, who pushes kids out of the program?

 

Uthoff has a spot on the Wisconsin roster, he took a scholarship from other players for a full season. He now wants to move on, Bo Ryan is agreeing to allow him to move on to certain schools. If Uthoff wanted to go to Iowa or Iowa State, he could have made that decision.

 

You are acting like Ryan isnt allowing him out of the scholarship, you have no idea what the restrictions are.

 

I guarantee that if Zeller wanted to transfer to OSU, Crean would say no.

 

Well, you're insinuating that Crean is in fact "pushing" these kids out. If this happens every year, where's your evidence? Maybe the kids don't like the staff, miss home, or MAYBE they want to get more playing time?

 

If Zeller wanted to go to OSU, he wouldn't have a scholarship, as it's against B1G rules. Bo is restricting the s*** out of this kids options according to his AAU coach. He won't even be allowed to his home state in ISU.

 

As far as I know, Crean isn't putting ridiculous restrictions on the kids who transfer from his programs. Those kids have actually commended him for helping them find a new home.

 

 

[Soxbadger]

Sorry I cant find any articles from Tom Crean's Marquette days, but I did post an article about Indiana, which you seemingly choose to ignore.

 

http://oversigning.com/testing/index.php/2...lock/#more-1419

 

College basketball's version of Nick Saban is none other than Indiana's own Tom Crean. Yesterday, Indiana University issued a press release patting themselves on the back for allowing Bawa Muniru to "go to a program where he can play and continue his education". Anyone who looks at the situation carefully knows the reality, Muniru was asked to leave Indiana's program to make room for new recruits.

 

This isn't the first time Crean has done this either. In fact, when Bawa originally signed with IU he would have been the 14th scholarship player (one over the limit) had Crean not run off Malik Story.

 

Now onto your unproven facts:

 

Bo is restricting the s*** out of this kids options according to his AAU coach. He won't even be allowed to his home state in ISU.

 

Prove it, no one knows what the restrictions are right now. And many people are assuming the ISU restriction is because Hoiberg actively recruited Uthoff to transfer.

 

But Im sure that Crean would be okay with Zeller transferring to UNC if it turned out Roy Williams kept telling Zeller hed be an immediate starter.

 

Your argument has no merit, you are entirely speculating what the transfer restriction is. Uthoff has not even commented. The only person who has, is Uthoff's AAU coach and here is his comment, and I quote:

 

"He didn't get specific with me, but from what he said, I got the impression that (not attending) Big Ten schools are probably one of the conditions," Johnson said. "I even got the impression Big 12 schools and maybe Marquette, like a lot of schools up in the area. It sounds like they don't want him to go to another high-major program in the area. That's the impression I got. He didn't get specific. That's kind of how it came off, like they're really restricting him and he's trying to appeal that.

 

HE DIDNT GET SPECIFIC WITH ME.

 

I GOT THE IMPRESSION

 

EVEN GOT THE IMPRESSION

 

 

 

So the fact is, the AAU coach was not specifically told 1 restriction. So keep on your little rant about how Bo Ryan is such a bad guy. Its hilarious and nonsensical. You dont even know the facts, the person who is quoted doesnt know the facts. Badger fans are speculating ISU is on the list, but none of them know for sure. There is a lot of speculation, including that there may have been tampering and that is why Bo isnt letting him go to certain schools. But Im not just going to throw allegations around like that, they are complete heresay and I have no basis to believe they are true.

 

That being said, over signing is completely different than restricting transfers. Wisconsin doesnt over sign, they have held this scholarship for Uthoff for years, he now wants to renege on his word, and Wisconsin is letting him go. Wisconsin has every right to decline his transfer and force him to stay 4 more years. Instead Wisconsin is trying to work a deal with him that does not end up hurting the school.

 

Yes Crean has helped players move, players that he has no room for. I cant recall one instance where Crean "helped" a top recruit go to another big time program, maybe you can refresh my memory. Uthoff is someone the Badgers were building around, he doesnt want to be there, that is fine, but the Badgers have every right to condition his release. He already agreed to 4 years with Wisconsin.

 

Entirely different then when you have 12 scholarships, give out 13 and ask a player who is already on scholarship to move on.

 

In fact its the exact opposite scenario, Wisconsin wants the player to stay and the player wants to leave.

[He_Gawn]

So really, you have no facts either. Just an article that Tom Crean had a kid transfer, that's what I thought. You're also bats*** crazy if you think Crean "ran off" Malik Story. The kid was homesick like none other, almost didn't come back after Xmas break. He was one of the leading scorers at Nebraska. Yea, Crean couldn't have used him while he was getting 10 wins a season for a few years. Good call. Think about what your quoting next time, and don't link me to some random dudes blog that's probably an Illinois or Wisconsin fan. Maybe you should post the comments from Bawa, or better yet the comments saying Crean did all he could to find him another home?

 

We will probably never know the restrictions placed upon Uthoff, unless the appeal is made public. We do however have an AAU coach basically giving a summary of what Uthoff told him and his worries about transferring. I mean, he may have to go the Juco route for a year for crying out loud.

[Soxbadger]

No, I found a story that confirmed what Marquette fans have been telling me for years. The website is called "oversigning.com" and the websites goal is to show oversigning in all sports, football, basketball, etc. It is not run by an Illinois fan or Wisconsin fan, so if you dont agree with that website, its fine, but that website calls out a lot of coaches for the practice.

 

Maybe everyone else who has told me about Crean is wrong, I dont really know, and I quite frankly dont really care. A comment was made that a player may not have committed to Indiana due to Crean's practice of over signing, and Tom Crean admits that he wants to over sign every class.

 

If you over-sign every class, eventually you are going to have to many scholarships. Now maybe every kid has left out of the kindness of their heart, but based on the information I have been told by Marquette fans, I doubt that is the case. I dont have any real information on Crean at Indiana, which is why I quoted someone else's comments.

 

/shrugs

 

I mean, he may have to go the Juco route for a year for crying out loud.

 

That is just a fabrication. He may go JUCO because if he transfers into D-1 hed have to sit a year, correct? So by red shirting last year and sitting this year, hell have gone 2 years without playing a single competitive game. Furthermore, if he goes JUCO he can then transfer from the JUCO to a school of his choice.

 

So no, he doesnt have to go JUCO. There are plenty of schools he can go to, Big East, SEC, ACC, Pac 10, MVC, etc, etc. Even if its true Bo has restricted both Big 10 and Big 12, that still leaves about a hundred other D-1 options.

[He_Gawn]

So here we are still waiting for the ex-players comments on how Crean pushed their worthless asses out.... If this has happened at such a ridiculous clip, and he's the one who does it most, someone must have spoken up by now and put a stop to this, no?

 

"everyone who has told me about Crean" ..... Oh, you probably live in Wisconsin. I'm sure there's no bias up there about Crean. No, none at all.

Edited April 13, 2012 by He_Gawn