The Beckham Dilemma

[Andrew]

Although the sample size is small, I think people are starting to see Greg Walker really wasn't the problem.

 

Lilli and Walker have what to do with each other?

 

I don't think people miss Walker at all.

 

 

[Dick Allen]

Sorry for the hijack - I just can't hate on Dunn enough. You won't find a single post from me happy about getting him. NL Central s*** ass; maintained on a 5th place team... He's the Javier Vazquez of DH candidates. If he was the DH for Minnesota, or KC, or Oakland...he's probably be "great".

 

He's a saber-head's reality check, really.

There really was no evidence the guy would become historically awful. You could make a case he was due to slip. His second half of 2010 was bad. He's a big guy and the bigger the guy, it seems the earlier they start to decline. He really didn't want to be a DH. He was switching leagues, but no way you could have possibly pegged him with the total he has right now in a White Sox uniform. The Sox didn't contend last year, he was crap. Nothing is expected this year, and he's been pretty bad. He's obviously in a little better shape this year, but it may be a case of too little too late. I guess we just have to hope its one of those things and he's going to start hitting again soon, but it sure looks like deja vu. This thing is about to mushroom.

[greg775]

There really was no evidence the guy would become historically awful. You could make a case he was due to slip. His second half of 2010 was bad. He's a big guy and the bigger the guy, it seems the earlier they start to decline. He really didn't want to be a DH. He was switching leagues, but no way you could have possibly pegged him with the total he has right now in a White Sox uniform. The Sox didn't contend last year, he was crap. Nothing is expected this year, and he's been pretty bad. He's obviously in a little better shape this year, but it may be a case of too little too late. I guess we just have to hope its one of those things and he's going to start hitting again soon, but it sure looks like deja vu. This thing is about to mushroom.

 

I think attendance will speak volumes.

Our fans don't want to see Dunn and Rios play baseball.

It's just not worth it.

If we could dump those two I think it'd be easier to embrace this team.

Why go to a game and be put into such a bad/sad mood by those two?

 

[Dick Allen]

Lilli and Walker have what to do with each other?

 

I don't think people miss Walker at all.

What they did miss is thinking a new hitting coach would produce a very different result offensively.

[Dick Allen]

I think attendance will speak volumes.

Our fans don't want to see Dunn and Rios play baseball.

It's just not worth it.

If we could dump those two I think it'd be easier to embrace this team.

Why go to a game and be put into such a bad/sad mood by those two?

The broadcasters are making an effort to keep fans away from buying on stubhub and going "directly to the source". I think they realize walk up sales won't be astronomical this season if they aren't winning. Its only 10 games and they are .500. There's still some hope for a fun season.

[Andrew]

There really was no evidence the guy would become historically awful. You could make a case he was due to slip. His second half of 2010 was bad. He's a big guy and the bigger the guy, it seems the earlier they start to decline. He really didn't want to be a DH. He was switching leagues, but no way you could have possibly pegged him with the total he has right now in a White Sox uniform. The Sox didn't contend last year, he was crap. Nothing is expected this year, and he's been pretty bad. He's obviously in a little better shape this year, but it may be a case of too little too late. I guess we just have to hope its one of those things and he's going to start hitting again soon, but it sure looks like deja vu. This thing is about to mushroom.

 

Well, one thing we can agree on is we all hope he'll start to hit.

 

Really, I don't think his shape (or his son; which you didn't even bring up) has anything to do with his issues - I just don't think he's a very valuable hitter and never have. Having said - I hope Robin isn't like Ozzie and WILL bench him. You can't expect a team to win with someone performing to (f***ing recording breaking lows!) in your lineup. This isn't little league - f*** egos. I really hope to see Robin be a stand out and make these kind of tough choices with these s*** pieces he has... Then we can talk about KW...

 

[Dick Allen]

Well, one thing we can agree on is we all hope he'll start to hit.

 

Really, I don't think his shape (or his son; which you didn't even bring up) has anything to do with his issues - I just don't think he's a very valuable hitter and never have. Having said - I hope Robin isn't like Ozzie and WILL bench him. You can't expect a team to win with someone performing to (f***ing recording breaking lows!) in your lineup. This isn't little league - f*** egos. I really hope to see Robin be a stand out and make these kind of tough choices with these s*** pieces he has... Then we can talk about KW...

No way he goes as long as Ozzie did, but you do have to give him more than 10 games. The Sox are 5-5. There isn't a team in baseball that won't have a worse 10 game stretch at some point during the season. Losing 2 at home to Baltimore is depressing, but a couple of wins and people will be optimistic again.

 

I don't know if the son story is true, and his shape, I'll agee somewhat. He did put up big numbers being a fat slob for years. He was no fatter last year than his previous years in Washington. But players carrying extra weight eventually almost always pay for it one way or another, that's one reason why I think Prince Fielder is going to fall apart when he gets to be 31.32.33.

Edited April 18, 2012 by Dick Allen

[Andrew]

No way he goes as long as Ozzie did, but you do have to give him more than 10 games. The Sox are 5-5. There isn't a team in baseball that won't have a worse 10 game stretch as some point during the season. Losing 2 at home to Baltimore is depressing, but a couple of wins and people will be optimistic again.

 

No argument here, DA... I'd assume we're both on the same page.

 

 

 

[caulfield12]

"I'm not down on myself," said Beckham, who was batting .115 with 11 strikeouts entering Tuesday night's game against the Orioles. "I know I had a good spring. I felt good in spring. I know it's right there.

 

"It's just small mechanical stuff. For me, it's just being able to get my foot down and let my hands do the work. The hands are my money maker."

 

Beckham said he started putting his front left foot down sooner after striking out in his first at-bat Monday. He went hitless in his next three at-bats but didn't strike out and believes he is making progress.

 

"I'm making sure I'm on time to hit the ball," Beckham said. "There are a lot of ways to say that, but that's what we're going for. It's not about the hands or anything like that. It's getting my foot down."

 

Beckham claimed he was unaware of suggestions he should sit, and manager Robin Ventura backs his embattled second baseman.

 

"People can think what they want to think," Beckham said. "It's (nine) games."

 

Ventura emphasized the focus on Beckham is on this season and not dwelling on his struggles the last two.

www.chicagotribune.com/sports

 

 

Haven't we all heard this before?

[southsider2k5]

"I'm not down on myself," said Beckham, who was batting .115 with 11 strikeouts entering Tuesday night's game against the Orioles. "I know I had a good spring. I felt good in spring. I know it's right there.

 

"It's just small mechanical stuff. For me, it's just being able to get my foot down and let my hands do the work. The hands are my money maker."

 

Beckham said he started putting his front left foot down sooner after striking out in his first at-bat Monday. He went hitless in his next three at-bats but didn't strike out and believes he is making progress.

 

"I'm making sure I'm on time to hit the ball," Beckham said. "There are a lot of ways to say that, but that's what we're going for. It's not about the hands or anything like that. It's getting my foot down."

 

Beckham claimed he was unaware of suggestions he should sit, and manager Robin Ventura backs his embattled second baseman.

 

"People can think what they want to think," Beckham said. "It's (nine) games."

 

Ventura emphasized the focus on Beckham is on this season and not dwelling on his struggles the last two.

www.chicagotribune.com/sports

 

 

Haven't we all heard this before?

 

Of course we have. What do you expect him to say?

[macsandz]

That new timing mechanism is gonna set him back before it helps. That's not to say it won't work but he's gonna swing much more often in the meantime so any chance at seeing pitches is gone. Again, this is the kind of work in progress you do in AAA not in MLB games.

[iamshack]

This is good news in my mind though. At least he is aware of what is perceived to be the issue.

 

Sure would be nice if they'd move him down to Charlotte to work on it now...

[macsandz]

This is good news in my mind though. At least he is aware of what is perceived to be the issue.

 

Sure would be nice if they'd move him down to Charlotte to work on it now...

Dont get your hopes up just yet. He was talking about loading earlier at Soxfest.

[SI1020]

"I'm not down on myself," said Beckham, who was batting .115 with 11 strikeouts entering Tuesday night's game against the Orioles. "I know I had a good spring. I felt good in spring. I know it's right there.

 

"It's just small mechanical stuff. For me, it's just being able to get my foot down and let my hands do the work. The hands are my money maker."

 

Beckham said he started putting his front left foot down sooner after striking out in his first at-bat Monday. He went hitless in his next three at-bats but didn't strike out and believes he is making progress.

 

"I'm making sure I'm on time to hit the ball," Beckham said. "There are a lot of ways to say that, but that's what we're going for. It's not about the hands or anything like that. It's getting my foot down."

 

Beckham claimed he was unaware of suggestions he should sit, and manager Robin Ventura backs his embattled second baseman.

 

"People can think what they want to think," Beckham said. "It's (nine) games."

 

Ventura emphasized the focus on Beckham is on this season and not dwelling on his struggles the last two.

www.chicagotribune.com/sports

 

 

Haven't we all heard this before?

To me this confirms that the guy really is messed up, and quite possibly it won't get better. I've long believed that thinking and hitting don't go together. From the time the ball leaves the pitchers hand until it approaches the batter's hitting zone is short and the less intellectualizing the better. Everyone's style is a little different. As for the back and forth on Beckham's swing it was a thing of beauty at Georgia. The hitch with the hands was very slight, followed by a quick fluid swing. He hit the ball everywhere. He seemed to carry that swing into his rookie year but after that I don't know what the hell happened. Now the hitch and the length of the swing are both longer. He can't catch up to a decent fastball and he chases all kinds of bad pitches out of the zone. I'm not a big fan of KW, but with Beckham he has it right I believe. Just go back to what you once were, find it somehow in the recesses of your mind and quit over thinking.

[greg775]

If it's about getting your foot down, Gordon, get your foot down.

I think you can hit or your can't and it's possible like Brian Anderson, he can't.

[Wanne]

To me this confirms that the guy really is messed up, and quite possibly it won't get better. I've long believed that thinking and hitting don't go together. From the time the ball leaves the pitchers hand until it approaches the batter's hitting zone is short and the less intellectualizing the better. Everyone's style is a little different. As for the back and forth on Beckham's swing it was a thing of beauty at Georgia. The hitch with the hands was very slight, followed by a quick fluid swing. He hit the ball everywhere. He seemed to carry that swing into his rookie year but after that I don't know what the hell happened. Now the hitch and the length of the swing are both longer. He can't catch up to a decent fastball and he chases all kinds of bad pitches out of the zone. I'm not a big fan of KW, but with Beckham he has it right I believe. Just go back to what you once were, find it somehow in the recesses of your mind and quit over thinking.

 

 

Agreed. Paralysis by analysis.

[The Ginger Kid]

While I'd miss his glove at 2B, I'd love to see Gordon get time to work on his swing outside the glare of the MLB spotlight. Then again...he kind of had all winter and spring, so...

[jeffro2525]

Considering I don't know who Pedro Alvarez is, I am.

 

Speaking of Alvarez...he just homered off of Daniel Hudson to tie that game at 1-1 in the 7th.

[justBLAZE]

Speaking of Alvarez...he just homered off of Daniel Hudson to tie that game at 1-1 in the 7th.

 

I remember J4A having a huge boner for Alvarez couple years ago..

[southsider2k5]

Frank breaks down Gordo's swing

 

http://www.csnchicago.com/baseball-chicago...tm_medium=email

[SI1020]

Frank breaks down Gordo's swing

 

http://www.csnchicago.com/baseball-chicago...tm_medium=email

Great clip. It's a wonder he ever gets a hit now. Some may find this interesting too. After a solid rookie year Beckham started his nosedive the following year. Perhaps this clip will helped show what happened.

 

http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/...gordon-beckham/

 

Beckham at Georgia. The leg kick and the hitch are there, but the hesitancy isn't and the bat speed looks good.

 

http://www.baseball-intellect.com/Articles...kham-swing.html

 

[elrockinMT]

Lots of comments and analysis on Gordon Beckhams swing, etc. It's almost like we think he isn't working on getting better or is a tremendous flop. Beckham will be working on his own and with those on the team that can help him get back to where he needs to be. It would be interesting to go back to when Robin V went 0-41 and see what fans were saying back them about Ventura. Robin is in Beckham's corner and that's good enough for me. I am sure if the organizations leadership thought Beckham was a lost cause we would have seen him gone by now. Patience and hard work will pay off and I think the kid can do it. It's not like he was a long term vet on his way down. He is a young talented player with a future.

Edited April 19, 2012 by elrockinMT

[jamesdiego]

Lots of comments and analysis on Gordon Beckhams swing, etc. It's almost like we think he isn't working on getting better or is a tremendous flop. Beckham will be working on his own and with those on the team that can help him get back to where he needs to be. It would be interesting to go back to when Robin V went 0-41 and see what fans were saying back them about Ventura. Robin is in Beckham's corner and that's good enough for me. I am sure if the organizations leadership thought Beckham was a lost cause we would have seen him gone by now. Patience and hard work will pay off and I think the kid can do it. It's not like he was a long term vet on his way down. He is a young talented player with a future.

 

 

It's not like this is the first year he is struggling. People are frustrated because he seems to be regressing every year, not getting better. Hopefully last night is a sign of things to come. I doubt it though, I think he needs time in the minors to work everything out.

[southsider2k5]

http://www.csnchicago.com/baseball-chicago...tm_medium=email

 

Manto, Ventura discuss Beckham's approach

April 19, 2012, 11:21 am

 

Gordon Beckham's timing has been off, causing him to be late on some pitches recently.

 

JJ STANKEVITZ

csnchicago.png

 

On Wednesday, Frank Thomas offered up his thoughts on Gordon Beckham's new hitting approach. In looking at Beckham, Thomas figured the second baseman could use a few days off to clear his head and really nail down his timing, which has escaped him in trying to get his front foot down.

 

While Beckham isn't in Thursday's getaway day lineup, don't expect him to get multiple days off to get comfortable with his swing.

 

"Any time you do something different, it's going to take a little time. But it's not like we're asking him to hit left-handed," manager Robin Ventura said prior to Thursday's game. "We're just asking him to get started a little earlier. It's something that happens to most guys -- everybody changes an approach or tinkers with things enough during the season that you're used to doing that. I don't see it taking a whole long time for him to do that."

 

Hitting coach Jeff Manto and Ventura are on the same page: Beckham's change really isn't very drastic.

 

"What we're asking is not invasive at all," Manto said. "It's a very easy fix -- it's a timing mechanism, it's not like we're moving hands, moving feet, moving heads -- it's just a matter of getting your foot down and the at-bat's over. Let the at-bat take care of itself once you get ready to hit. If we got a little bit to where it's invasive, that would be a problem."

 

The goal of having Beckham getting his foot down early is to improve his pitch recognition, which has escaped him for extended stretches since his outstanding rookie year. Since he hit .270/.347/.460 in 2009, Beckham's production has slid to a .238/.303/.351 line with just 19 home runs in 1,091 plate appearances -- only five more than he had in 430 trips to the plate three years ago.

 

Thomas and Manto agree that Beckham has too much talent to stay down for much longer. And Beckham's struggles haven't been for a lack of effort, either.

 

"He's been working his butt off in the cage every day, he hasn't backed down from the work," Manto said. "He's not complaining, he's staying positive, and he is close. Like Frank's saying, as soon as he gets the ability to stay behind the ball, he's going to be fine."

 

When he's going to be fine, though, is still the question. The White Sox have been waiting for him to be fine for three seasons now. Beckham's had flashes of his 2009 self here or there -- he had an .811 OPS through his first 13 games in 2011 and had an .877 OPS after the All-Star break in 2010 -- but he hasn't been able to sustain those bursts of success.

 

Perhaps working in his favor, too, is that the Sox don't have a viable replacement for him at second base in their organization. Eduardo Escobar hasn't hit outside of short spurts in Arizona, while Brent Lillibridge may not have the defensive prowess the Sox want.

 

Short-term, though, Manto won't panic if results don't start to come for Beckham as the Sox head to Seattle and Oakland. Although two-thirds of the year is a bit of an exaggeration.

 

"I hate to put a timetable on it, because you don't know what we're going to run into out west," Manto said. "But more importantly, he's in a good frame of mind, we just work it from there. He stays positive. Hell, we got eight months left, so there's no urgency."