Viciedo Not Worth The Wait

[Marty34]

I don't believe Viciedo will be worth the wait, too many holes in his swing without much development of patience. At best I see him as a 5-6-7 hitter, not the dynamic 3-hitter we had hoped. I think it'd be a good move to deal him before his value drops further (see Beckham).

[Balta1701]

Yeah, we know.

[LittleHurt05]

I don't believe Viciedo will be worth the wait, too many holes in his swing without much development of patience. At best I see him as a 5-6-7 hitter, not the dynamic 3-hitter we had hoped. I think it'd be a good move to deal him before his value drops further (see Beckham).

 

If he is as bad as you say, then what value does he even have now anyway? The other 31 MLB teams watch these games too.

[Kyyle23]

SMH

[Marty34]

If he is as bad as you say, then what value does he even have now anyway? The other 31 MLB teams watch these games too.

 

You hope some team values him more than the Sox. Matt Thornton was traded for Joe Borchard after all.

[Balta1701]

You hope some team values him more than the Sox. Matt Thornton was traded for Joe Borchard after all.

And so why are you judging that he's unfixable if you're assuming other teams will find him a developable talent? And if teams are deciding whether he's repairable despite all the issues you're highlighting, then why would you expect his "Value can fall farther" than it has already?

[Marty34]

Yeah, we know.

 

B, I don't think he'll reach that Vlad Guerrero upside!

[Balta1701]

B, I don't think he'll reach that Vlad Guerrero upside!

Yeah, we know.

[iamshack]

I'd protect him right now and play him during the most favorable matchups, wait for him to hit a few bombs, and then try and move him...I'd even consider moving Morel as well for a stud 3b prospect.

 

 

[Marty34]

And so why are you judging that he's unfixable if you're assuming other teams will find him a developable talent? And if teams are deciding whether he's repairable despite all the issues you're highlighting, then why would you expect his "Value can fall farther" than it has already?

 

He has value to a team that's rebuilding. Slugging LF'er is the easiest position on the field for a big market team to fill.

[Balta1701]

He has value to a team that's rebuilding. Slugging LF'er is the easiest position on the field for a big market team to fill.

Like a team that cut its payroll by $25 million last year, fired its manager, traded away an all star, let its most reliable pitcher walk, and traded away their closer, bringing back nothing but minor leaguers, while signing only 1 backup OF on the free agent market hte entire offseason.

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

If he is as bad as you say, then what value does he even have now anyway? The other 31 MLB teams watch these games too.

 

[kageman129]

Like a team that cut its payroll by $25 million last year, fired its manager, traded away an all star, let its most reliable pitcher walk, and traded away their closer, bringing back nothing but minor leaguers, while signing only 1 backup OF on the free agent market hte entire offseason.

 

That sounds like a similar position the Sox are in . . . Oooo I see what you did there.

[Marty34]

Like a team that cut its payroll by $25 million last year, fired its manager, traded away an all star, let its most reliable pitcher walk, and traded away their closer, bringing back nothing but minor leaguers, while signing only 1 backup OF on the free agent market hte entire offseason.

 

Pitching staff says they aren't rebuilding.

[Balta1701]

Pitching staff says they aren't rebuilding.

Yeah, Going with effectively a rookie who threw 60 innings in the bullpen last year, 2 guys who tired out after 100 innings last year (one of whom is a ~30 year old who has been cut by 3 teams in the last couple years), and one of the worst "#1" starters in baseball, while letting the most reliable starting pitcher in your rotation walk and fielding trade calls on the others, that's totally not rebuilding.

 

Edit: Oh, and rookie closer/bullpen with 4 rookies while we're at it.

[MEANS]

just give up on everyone!!! threads like these are hilarious.

[caulfield12]

Yeah, because there are so many 23 year old hitters in baseball lighting up the major leagues right now.

 

So, we take one of the few possible impact bats that's cost-controlled for the next few years...and play Jordan Danks or Conor Jackson or Brent Lillibridge?

 

Wait.

 

That Michell kid's going guns blazing'. Maybe we should promote him?

 

Because then we'll have another struggling young hitter in the line-up we can trade at the June/July deadline.

 

And maybe we should trade Santiago, because he's not fixable. And just waive Beckham and Morel, because we know they can't be fixed...and Alexei's overrated, so someone will give us their top two pitching prospects for him and replace him with Lillibridge or Escobar.

 

Since we've pretty much never successfully identified any young hitter under 30 since Carlos Quentin in the last decade, we should be trusting KW to find MORE good/young hitting to build for the future.

 

Ooops, we're in win-now mode. And that means KW fails if Molina and Zach Stewart fail to make it as starters. Oops. Maybe we actually are going to have to wait until the 40 or 54 game mark. Oops, no. Jeff Manto has said he's not concerned about anyone's average this year until the 250 or 300 at-bat mark. Hmmmm.

 

Maybe, just maybe, we should look at Viciedo and Ramirez and their typical track records in April and relax a little bit.

 

 

 

 

 

[southsider2k5]

we must have lost last night.

[iamshack]

Yeah, Going with effectively a rookie who threw 60 innings in the bullpen last year, 2 guys who tired out after 100 innings last year (one of whom is a ~30 year old who has been cut by 3 teams in the last couple years), and one of the worst "#1" starters in baseball, while letting the most reliable starting pitcher in your rotation walk and fielding trade calls on the others, that's totally not rebuilding.

Call it whatever the hell you want...I'd rather trade Wily Mo Pena now while we can still get something of value for him.

[caulfield12]

We're in first place. Trade the whole team.

 

Punish them for playing better than expected by anyone but Marty34 and Cowley.

 

Punish the entire pitching staff for Hector Santiago's ROOKIE mistakes. Because normally pitchers move all the way from A Ball to the majors in one full minor league season and just throw out an 85-90% save conversion percentage when they've never even been asked to close a game in the minors before.

 

Sure, that sounds logical.

[iamshack]

We're in first place. Trade the whole team.

 

Punish them for playing better than expected by anyone but Marty34 and Cowley.

 

Punish the entire pitching staff for Hector Santiago's ROOKIE mistakes. Because normally pitchers move all the way from A Ball to the majors in one full minor league season and just throw out an 85-90% save conversion percentage when they've never even been asked to close a game in the minors before.

 

Sure, that sounds logical.

Why does the fact that he wants to move him necessarily have to have any correlation to the loss last night, or Hector Santiago?

[southsider2k5]

Yeah, because there are so many 23 year old hitters in baseball lighting up the major leagues right now.

 

So, we take one of the few possible impact bats that's cost-controlled for the next few years...and play Jordan Danks or Conor Jackson or Brent Lillibridge?

 

Wait.

 

That Michell kid's going guns blazing'. Maybe we should promote him?

 

Because then we'll have another struggling young hitter in the line-up we can trade at the June/July deadline.

 

And maybe we should trade Santiago, because he's not fixable. And just waive Beckham and Morel, because we know they can't be fixed...and Alexei's overrated, so someone will give us their top two pitching prospects for him and replace him with Lillibridge or Escobar.

 

Since we've pretty much never successfully identified any young hitter under 30 since Carlos Quentin in the last decade, we should be trusting KW to find MORE good/young hitting to build for the future.

 

Ooops, we're in win-now mode. And that means KW fails if Molina and Zach Stewart fail to make it as starters. Oops. Maybe we actually are going to have to wait until the 40 or 54 game mark. Oops, no. Jeff Manto has said he's not concerned about anyone's average this year until the 250 or 300 at-bat mark. Hmmmm.

 

Maybe, just maybe, we should look at Viciedo and Ramirez and their typical track records in April and relax a little bit.

 

It is so funny, we get all of these trade and bench all of the kids right now type threads, yet no one can handle the kids playing for 18 games. If you are going to be rebuilding, retooling, or whatever it is called, this is the type of thing that goes with the territory. Kids go through struggles, and some never do pan out. This is where the Sox are right now.

 

[MEANS]

Why does the fact that he wants to move him necessarily have to have any correlation to the loss last night, or Hector Santiago?

 

b/c that's what a troll does. think he would have made this thread if we would have won last night and everyone's in a good mood? nah, I don't think so.

[NorthSideSox72]

These...

 

just give up on everyone!!! threads like these are hilarious.

 

we must have lost last night.

 

Viciedo had adjustment periods at two levels in the minors as well. Give the man a chance. You can't develop young talent by giving them three weeks as a starter and then throwing in the towel. Total absurdity.

 

[iamshack]

I am just legitimately down on Viciedo.

 

He looks like Wily Mo Pena or Juan Pierre's bigger brother to me.

 

I would move him before his star fades too much...and I said it the other day in chat in the midst of a winning streak.

 

I don't agree that it's some taboo topic that can only be raised out of frustration after a loss...