1/3 of the way through the season

[iamshack]

To his expectations...

Your expectations are insane then...

 

What the hell does he have to do to get an A?

 

Meanwhile, Konerko is spending half his at bats trying to serve singles into RF and he gets an A...

[cabiness42]

Sometime late this afternoon, I'll compile all the posts in this thread and produce a composite report card.

[southsider2k5]

Your expectations are insane then...

 

What the hell does he have to do to get an A?

 

Meanwhile, Konerko is spending half his at bats trying to serve singles into RF and he gets an A...

 

Konerko is also hitting .360 and still putting up pretty much his average in traditional power numbers. His OPS is .100 points over his career high right now.

[SoxAce]

Paulie - A (NEVER FORGET!)

 

How in God's name is that man not an A+ considering you have De Aza and Sale as A+'s? Hell, he would probably be the AL MVP if the season ended today. His clutch stats are amazing... I'll post it again... AMAZING.

Edited June 4, 2012 by SoxAce

[southsider2k5]

Adam Dunn is clearly a unique player. No other player has such a high walk rate and ISO rate to be able to have a batting average of .220 yet an OPS over .920.

 

That said, it will take an OPS much higher than .920 to win AL MVP, and his average will have to get up to at least .240-.250 in order to get his OPS up high enough for MVP consideration.

 

Still, if Dunn's final slash line for the season is similar to the .222/.376/.545 it is now, I'll be thrilled.

 

Compared to last year, you can't help but be happy with what he is doing. Compared to the rest of his career, he can do better.

[caulfield12]

How in God's name is that man not an A+ considering you have De Aza and Sale as A+'s? Hell, he would probably be the AL MVP if the season ended today.

 

 

DeAza was actually better statistically last year (especially OPS/power), but he's been more consistent this year and has supplied a number of "clutch" hits.

 

On the other hand, his defense was very shaky during that 3-11 stretch that knocked us back.

 

Not an A+, but an A-/A.

[iamshack]

Konerko is also hitting .360 and still putting up pretty much his average in traditional power numbers. His OPS is .100 points over his career high right now.

I don't dispute PK with the A as much as I do that in relation to Adam and his C.

 

I think Adam has had as much to do with this team's success as PK.

 

 

[hogan873]

I always like these types of threads. Great reading for an off day.

 

Without grading everyone, I would say:

 

Konerko - A (Like a fine wine...)

Beckham - C (His recent improved hitting and plus defense gets him to a C)

Morel - D (Good defense, terrible bat. Hopefully he comes back from AAA improved)

Alexei - C- (Great defense, offense has been pretty bad)

Tank - B- (Slow start followed by an incredible hot streak, meh defense)

De Aza - A (The lead-off guy and CFer this team has needed)

Rios - B (I think we might have to actually say Rios is...good)

AJ - A (Surprise all around. Great bat, good game calling, much improved throwing out runners)

Dunn - A- (He is truly that three outcome hitter this year. Would like to see fewer K's, though)

 

Peavy - A (This is the guy we wanted to see)

Humber - C- (Perfect then not so perfect then pretty good...I'll take pretty good the rest of the way)

Floyd - D (Inconsistent and seems to fold under pressure too easily)

Danks - D (Not good so far...hopefully injury-related)

Sale - A+ (Is there a grade higher than A+?)

Edited June 4, 2012 by pittshoganerkoff

[Reddy]

I don't dispute PK with the A as much as I do that in relation to Adam and his C.

 

I think Adam has had as much to do with this team's success as PK.

completely agree. this team has been successful because of that terrifying 3-4 punch we've got now that we also have a leadoff man who gets on base. our success is due to:

 

De Aza

Paulie

Dunn

Peavy

Sale

 

without any one of those guys, we don't have the badass record we do now.

[caulfield12]

completely agree. this team has been successful because of that terrifying 3-4 punch we've got now that we also have a leadoff man who gets on base. our success is due to:

 

De Aza

Paulie

Dunn

Peavy

Sale

 

without any one of those guys, we don't have the badass record we do now.

 

 

Without Viciedo and Beckham firing on all cyclinders, we're not talking about a 14-2 run and first place, either.

[SoxAce]

DeAza was actually better statistically last year (especially OPS/power), but he's been more consistent this year and has supplied a number of "clutch" hits.

 

On the other hand, his defense was very shaky during that 3-11 stretch that knocked us back.

 

Not an A+, but an A-/A.

 

What does last year have to do with this year and this thread which was discussing this year? Not counting June yet since Konerko and De Aza have only had 9 and 11 PA respectively, but one was hitting .383/.444/.679/1.123 and .379/.464/.611 1.074 from March-May and the other .247/.323/.471/.794 and .313/.394/.384/.778 from March-May. Don't even bring up the clutch stats between the two. (and De Aza has been good but yea.. not comparable) Now, if you want to bring up defensive measures into this, fine (although Konerko is having a great year, UZR wise) but yea other than Cy Sale, I personally give an A+ to the ones who have been outstanding/incredible/scary good (De Aza is an A.. no doubt) but hey.. I guess you can say I have a strict grade policy.

 

Oh, and I find it more incredible he's doing this at age 36. Seriously WTF Pauly?

Edited June 4, 2012 by SoxAce

[Princess Dye]

southsider2k - batting average is just one slice of the pie. focusing way too much on that. in the important categories, he is somewhere between 'very good' and absolutely carrying us

[hogan873]

southsider2k - batting average is just one slice of the pie. focusing way too much on that. in the important categories, he is somewhere between 'very good' and absolutely carrying us

Another thing about Dunn. He's walking a ton, pitchers are pitching around him, and the guy behind him (Konerko) is getting better pitches because of that. The guy has a ton of value for this team.

[Princess Dye]

What does last year have to do with this year and this thread which was discussing this year?

 

The first post specifically mentions De Aza's 2011 stats as part of its argument about him.

[BigEdWalsh]

So we have made it through 54 of the 162 games, 108 more to go. I figured I would do my usual grade the players thread today. Go ahead throw your grades out there if you like. For my scale, expectations are a part of the final grade. Players who have higher expectations are graded harder than ones who don't.

 

The C's

Adam Dunn- Nice to see the power numbers rebound, but the guy is on pace for 264 K's and average is back into the .220's

 

The D's

Gordon Beckham- Awful start, has started to rebound, close to a C because of defense

Will Ohman- Peripherals look great, but has had some spectacular fails pitching to anything but lefties.

 

The F'

Gavin Floyd- Super inconsistent this year. Great or awful, unfortunately awful has won out most of the season.

I get where you're coming from about expectations, but I still think these grades are too low. Floyd gave maybe 4 very good starts. He deserves better than an F and to be lumped in with Danks. Ohman is who he is and ought to be a C. He's just the guy that everybody seems to love to hate. Beckham, I know we all expect better, but I think he has shown enough signs of improvement even before his parents showed up to warrant a C. Dunn deserves a B, period. Enough has already been said about his power returning and his OBP.

As far as expectations go, what I'm perhaps happiest about is Ventura. No one knew what to expect, given his total lack of managerial experience and he has done a great job. We're in 1st place. I didn't see that coming.

[SoxAce]

The first post specifically mentions De Aza's 2011 stats as part of its argument about him.

 

Then I apologize to caulfield since I saw the thread title and Mike's first paragraph discussing this season and expectations. Also read his post wrong about De Aza as he was actually agreeing with me about the grade. I doubt anyone thought Konerko would be doing this.. at his age. I remember much more optimism, including myself, with De Aza before the season, obviously not his .329/.400/.520/.920 from his callup, but certainly better than what Pierre gave us. The top 3 candidate for AL MVP (if the season ended today) not getting an A+ is criminal (and ya I'm arguing about the "+" so sue me).

Edited June 4, 2012 by SoxAce

[LittleHurt05]

How in God's name is that man not an A+ considering you have De Aza and Sale as A+'s? Hell, he would probably be the AL MVP if the season ended today. His clutch stats are amazing... I'll post it again... AMAZING.

 

Josh Hamilton?

 

I guess it's just the expectations. And Sale is a Cy Young candidate. ADA gets a sentimental plus boost for overall excitement and boost over previous leadoff hitters.

[Dick Allen]

southsider2k - batting average is just one slice of the pie. focusing way too much on that. in the important categories, he is somewhere between 'very good' and absolutely carrying us

I'd say the guys carrying the White Sox offensively during this hot streak are Konerko, Viciedo and Beckham. De Aza and Dunn have definitely contributed a lot, but I think the view on Dunn is skewed. Compared to last year, he's outstanding. Compared to what was expected when he signed and the rest of his career, he's average.

[SoxAce]

Josh Hamilton?

 

 

Yea he's scary good I didn't realize his OPS was that insane already. (although not as clutch in late/close games as Konerko) but considering everyone thought we would suck, and without looking at Josh's numbers (a critical mistake on my part, although he's been awful in CF so far and before anyone points it out, I'm well aware writers don't look at that) I'll rephrase and say top 3 candidate. Still well deserving of an A+ for this team though, which was my original point. If you were expecting those kind of numbers from a 36 year old, then hey.. props to you.

Edited June 4, 2012 by SoxAce

[hogan873]

I'd say the guys carrying the White Sox offensively during this hot streak are Konerko, Viciedo and Beckham. De Aza and Dunn have definitely contributed a lot, but I think the view on Dunn is skewed. Compared to last year, he's outstanding. Compared to what was expected when he signed and the rest of his career, he's average.

Average as in "this is what we expected" or average as in "okay, but we expected more"?

[LittleHurt05]

Yea he's scary good I didn't realize his OPS was that insane already. (although not as clutch in late/close games as Konerko) but considering everyone thought we would suck, and without looking at Josh's numbers (a critical mistake on my part, although he's been awful in CF so far and before anyone points it out, I'm well aware writers don't look at that) I'll rephrase and say top 3 candidate. Still well deserving of an A+ for this team though, which was my original point. If you were expecting those kind of numbers from a 36 year old, then hey.. props to you.

 

I'll agree, maybe I did short change Paulie by not giving him the plus. I guess you just get used to him and expect greatness.

[Dick Allen]

Average as in "this is what we expected" or average as in "okay, but we expected more"?

I think when he signed the Sox and all of us expected a .900 or so OPS. Drive in 100 runs. That's about where he's at. When Thome was putting up those numbers for a lot less money, he was hated as an all or nothing guy. Dunn is obviously valuable if he can keep up his current pace. I think coming into this year, just about everyone would have taken an .800 OPS driving in about 75. IMO, it is what makes his performance look better than it really is.

Edited June 4, 2012 by Dick Allen

[ScottyDo]

Haven't a bunch of Dunn's homers been of the game-tying or go-ahead variety? I think the import of those home runs vastly outweighs the import of those K's. Not to pile on or anything

[iamshack]

I think when he signed the Sox and all of us expected a .900 or so OPS. Drive in 100 runs. That's about where he's at. When Thome was putting up those numbers for a lot less money, he was hated as an all or nothing guy. Dunn is obviously valuable if he can keep up his current pace. I think coming into this year, just about everyone would have taken an .800 OPS driving in about 75. IMO, it is what makes his performance look better than it really is.

I am probably going to echo the Hawkeroo here, but it's not just that he is hitting home runs and driving in runs, but he has hit some BIG home runs that have won games for us.

 

I will say this...just because a guy has put up big numbers his whole career, and then he does it again or exceeds those numbers, I don't believe you grade him as average because there are certain expectations.

 

If a guy scores 95's on tests his whole academic career, you don't say he should get a "C" because that is what he does every time. A "95" is still an "A," no matter how you slice it.

[fathom]

Beckham's had so many clutch hits over the last month or so, and people forget just how terrible the 2nd spot was producing before he got going. I can think off the top of my head about 5 games where Beckham had the game winning RBI.