SpringfieldFan Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 Hey, I need a little reassurance right now, so hopefully you all can set me straight. What kind of hope should I realistically be keeping for this season? I grant that they are firmly in this race right now at 2 game back (hell, as long as they are within 4 when the last week rolls around they are still in it). However, I won't beat around the bush about it: I want the Sox in the World Series. Period. Now, what kind of evidence can I be looking at to assure me they at least have a reasonable chance at getting there. Even given their recent surge, there are still unresolved issues. So far they still cannot win out west. They also haven't shown they can create victories when the bats have off nights. Finally, they still haven't proven they can win on the road against quality opponents (except for KC, if you call them quality). Now, they still have difficult trips to make to the homes of some of the best the league has to offer, and if they manage to get the division title, it may very well mean a trip to Seattle or Oakland soon after that. Given all this, I could really use some specific concrete reasons to be optimistic and believe that these handicaps will simply go away or at least not stand in their way. Can anyone give me any? LT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmr31 Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 The ceiling for this team is a quick, 1st round exit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUKE_CLEVELAND Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 The ceiling for this team is a quick, 1st round exit. WE HAD A BETTER TEAM IN 2000 AND HAD A QUICK 1ST ROUND EXIT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 WE HAD A BETTER TEAM IN 2000 AND HAD A QUICK 1ST ROUND EXIT. I disagree, this is a better team then 2000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpringfieldFan Posted August 15, 2003 Author Share Posted August 15, 2003 WE HAD A BETTER TEAM IN 2000 AND HAD A QUICK 1ST ROUND EXIT. You ain't helpin' me, guys! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUKE_CLEVELAND Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 I disagree, this is a better team then 2000. MAYBE ON PAPER IT WAS, BUT NOT IN TERMS OF HEART. WAIT, STOP. IN 2000 WE TOTALLY DESTROYED THE YANKEES AND AN INTACT INDIANS TEAM FOR A MONTH STRAIGHT. COULD WE DO SOMETHING LIKE THAT TO SAY.......THE YANKS AND OAKLAND, OR YANKS AND BOSOX THIS SEASON. NO f***ING WAY! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmr31 Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 MAYBE ON PAPER IT WAS, BUT NOT IN TERMS OF HEART. WAIT, STOP. IN 2000 WE TOTALLY DESTROYED THE YANKEES AND AN INTACT INDIANS TEAM FOR A MONTH STRAIGHT. COULD WE DO SOMETHING LIKE THAT TO SAY.......THE YANKS AND OAKLAND, OR YANKS AND BOSOX THIS SEASON. NO f***ING WAY! I agree with Rowand. I think this current team is better on paper. Theyre just mentally inferior to the other good teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 Potential-wise this team is way better than the 2000 team. The pitching staff blows away the 2k staff. For some reason this team just can't keep focused. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUKE_CLEVELAND Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 Potential-wise this team is way better than the 2000 team. The pitching staff blows away the 2k staff. For some reason this team just can't keep focused. POTENTIAL IS JUST EXACTLY THAT. POTENTIAL HAS NEVER WON 1 BASEBALL GAME. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Lopez Ghost (old) Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 No one, not even Gene Autrey's ghost, figured California as last year's champs. Get in the playoffs, hope you get great pitching, and hot at the plate. Likely? Maybe not, but it's our best hope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rafacosta Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 Hey, I need a little reassurance right now, so hopefully you all can set me straight. What kind of hope should I realistically be keeping for this season? I grant that they are firmly in this race right now at 2 game back (hell, as long as they are within 4 when the last week rolls around they are still in it). However, I won't beat around the bush about it: I want the Sox in the World Series. Period. Now, what kind of evidence can I be looking at to assure me they at least have a reasonable chance at getting there. Even given their recent surge, there are still unresolved issues. So far they still cannot win out west. They also haven't shown they can create victories when the bats have off nights. Finally, they still haven't proven they can win on the road against quality opponents (except for KC, if you call them quality). Now, they still have difficult trips to make to the homes of some of the best the league has to offer, and if they manage to get the division title, it may very well mean a trip to Seattle or Oakland soon after that. Given all this, I could really use some specific concrete reasons to be optimistic and believe that these handicaps will simply go away or at least not stand in their way. Can anyone give me any? LT You are a White Sox fan and not a Cubs fan... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUKE_CLEVELAND Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 No one, not even Gene Autrey's ghost, figured California as last year's champs. Get in the playoffs, hope you get great pitching, and hot at the plate. Likely? Maybe not, but it's our best hope. TEAMS LIKE THAT WIN BECAUSE OF, AND I WILL SPELL THIS, H-E-A-R-T!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmr31 Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 TEAMS LIKE THAT WIN BECAUSE OF, AND I WILL SPELL THIS, H-E-A-R-T!!! LOL EXACTLY!!! Sorry to the optimists, but we dont have guys like Eckstein and Erstad on this team. Nice try, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forkit Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 First we are not out of this by a long stretch. Minnie and KC play each other while we are at Texas. Let those paly themselves out before you get all itchy. Second, there are about 40 games left. We have tons of head to head games with Minnie and KC AND we have been beating them this year, so just take a breath. Last, if you are looking for a place to jump off, wait until you see us play some quality teams again at home. IF we cannot win series at home while we're still in this race, then you can run away. Until then, however, you are just crying "The sky is falling!" You can't just take over first place from 7 1/2 back with no back and forth movement in the standings. It took a HUGE surge of emotions and playing great baseball to make up that deficit. That in and of itself was difficult to do. Now you have to expect some ebb and flow while the Sox regroup and regain some emotional stability and get ready for their next surge. It'll come. As for the playoffs? I have no interest in making predictions about the playoffs [or thinking about, frankly, until we are in them]. But if you find that you must indulge in that exercise, our starting pitching this year is MUCH better than it has been in many, many years. With our top three starters, we could win some 2-1 ball games in a playoff for a change. And with Robbie up the middle, the defense is better than it has been in some time. The offense? If it shows up, it won't be beat. If it doesn't, at least we have three decent starting pitchers and better defense. Don't keep jumping off the Sox playoff wagon and then jumping back on again when they win the next series...Take a step back from the window ledge and remember that this race will take some time to play out. Just don't get so high when they are winning and so low when they lose a game or two. It ain't over yet, no matter what BMR says here every day, in every way. That's why they play the games. That's why North and friend are getting their heads shaved. It ain't over. If you're a Sox fan, be a Sox fan and get some steel in your gut and support your team. Leave the whining and crying and hand wringing in the closet. IF the day of the first playoff game comes and we're not penciled in, bring them out and have at it. Until then, enjoy being in a close race. That's what good sprots is about--keeping you on your seat for the entire season! We're in it to win it! Forkit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 No one, not even Gene Autrey's ghost, figured California as last year's champs. Get in the playoffs, hope you get great pitching, and hot at the plate. Likely? Maybe not, but it's our best hope. most sensible thing here - get in and then the team gets hot and gets lucky wins - all the ecperts who tell us what this team can and cannot do as pure "fact" are the same ones who took Miami over Ohio State, took Yankees over Arizona, never had Anaheim, and took St Louis over New England. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmr31 Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 most sensible thing here - get in and then the team gets hot and gets lucky wins - all the ecperts who tell us what this team can and cannot do as pure "fact" are the same ones who took Miami over Ohio State, took Yankees over Arizona, never had Anaheim, and took St Louis over New England. Sorry, every one of those teams showed heart. This sox team shows NONE........and if you want facts, for every ONE of your teams above, there are hundreds just like them, who DONT do anything. Keep trying, maybe you will strike your one in a million some day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesox247 Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 Do the Yankees have heart? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmr31 Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 Do the Yankees have heart? uh yeah? What kind of question is that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUKE_CLEVELAND Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 Do the Yankees have heart? OBVIOUSLY NOT SINCE THEY LOST TO AN INFERIOR ANGELS TEAM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesox247 Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 uh yeah? What kind of question is that? It doesnt seem like they do. And they heavily rely on the three-run homers too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 most sensible thing here - get in and then the team gets hot and gets lucky wins - all the ecperts who tell us what this team can and cannot do as pure "fact" are the same ones who took Miami over Ohio State, took Yankees over Arizona, never had Anaheim, and took St Louis over New England. Sorry, every one of those teams showed heart. This sox team shows NONE........and if you want facts, for every ONE of your teams above, there are hundreds just like them, who DONT do anything. Keep trying, maybe you will strike your one in a million some day. this is pointless but, as I see it, you are wrong about this team not having heart. I have seen this team plenty - the series against cubs/twins/cubs/twins - the way we roared after the all star break the series in KC and then home against KC - plenty of heart the 2-1 loss to Anaheim showed heart for AR and MB and MO this team has never surrended, never given up, never backed down, and for all its problems at time it is mid Agust and we are 2 out that that is heart enough shown to indicate that we may have all we need now say something caustic and insulting and sarcastic about how I know nothing about baseball and am not a true fan and all the other things you have posted about me and I will go back to wisely ignoring you and keep trying, maybe you will strike your one in a million some day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmr31 Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 It doesnt seem like they do. And they heavily rely on the three-run homers too. Well teams chemistry changes from year to year, but they have proven winners up and down their lineup and pitching staff. It doesnt mean theyre going to win it all, but id take my chances with them, over a team lead by Frank Thomas. Thats for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmr31 Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 most sensible thing here - get in and then the team gets hot and gets lucky wins - all the ecperts who tell us what this team can and cannot do as pure "fact" are the same ones who took Miami over Ohio State, took Yankees over Arizona, never had Anaheim, and took St Louis over New England. Sorry, every one of those teams showed heart. This sox team shows NONE........and if you want facts, for every ONE of your teams above, there are hundreds just like them, who DONT do anything. Keep trying, maybe you will strike your one in a million some day. this is pointless but, as I see it, you are wrong about this team not having heart. I have seen this team plenty - the series against cubs/twins/cubs/twins - the way we roared after the all star break the series in KC and then home against KC - plenty of heart the 2-1 loss to Anaheim showed heart for AR and MB and MO this team has never surrended, never given up, never backed down, and for all its problems at time it is mid Agust and we are 2 out that that is heart enough shown to indicate that we may have all we need now say something caustic and insulting and sarcastic about how I know nothing about baseball and am not a true fan and all the other things you have posted about me and I will go back to wisely ignoring you and keep trying, maybe you will strike your one in a million some day. LOL, ill ignore your self pity. Back to your other points. YES, they show heart when they want to, but that only seems to be against certain teams. You know the old saying.............you cant just turn it on and off when you want, and expect to go anywhere. This sox team does that and i really dont see how you can deny that. DOes this team have the talent to win it all? Yes. I cant and wont debate that. I just know that i know what a winning baseball teams looks like, and i try not to let my love for the white sox ruin my onjectivity. I want this team to win badly. I just dont think they want it as badly as i do, or you do. Their lack of interest, at times, shows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forkit Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 Actually, one reason I think JR and friends have been shipping in additional talentis because they think that maybe the normal front runners are a bit "iffy" this year. Do the Yankees have heart? Dunno. I hope we get to find out if we have more heart than they do during the playoffs, and that's the difference between BMR and me. I think the Sox showed tremendous heart to get it together in the second half. You can't expect them to win all 81 games in the second half--there's always going to be ebb and flow. It would have been typical and easy for this team to blub along to the end of year at 5-8 games under. But instead, they got off their butts and got back in it. That was some serious heart, in my book. Does that mean they have won all the games they could have or we would have liked them to win in the second half? No. But it ain't over yet and if they take care of the other talented teams as they visit the Cell and win those series, maybe BMR will have to admit some heart was seen on the field. We'll see. But the truth is, we can post all we want about it. We won't know what their final "heart size" is until the year is over. BMR can't see into the future. Nor can I. Let them play the games. Be a good fan and support the team on this 40 game stretch and enjoy the race! If they don't make the playoffs, you'll have all winter to b**** and moan and whine and throw insults at the team [and they'll deserve it]. But if they DO make the playoffs and you spent these next 40 games whining and wringing your hands, you may have missed all the nail-biting fun! Get on the band wagon and stay on it until the race is won. You MAY find that we won it. Forkit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wong & Owens Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 I really don't see how you can judge whether a team has heart or not unless you see a ton of blatant examples, or have frequent clubhouse access. I don't think not hitting for a 2-3 game stretch qualifies. As big a no-name as Shields is, he did have really good stuff yesterday. I don't understand what people are referring to when they say no heart. Rowand's plays on Wed= no heart? Everett's HR theft = no heart? Buehrle's outing vs Oakland = no heart? Frank's 8-hour at-bat before hr-ing to beat Twins= no heart? Konerko somehow turning around a lost season = no heart? Lee catching fly ball after falling on his ass= no heart? Granted, I'm still not getting the playoff vibe from these guys, and I agree they're a pretty stupid team. But no heart? I don't agree with that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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