Will the Royals ever be good?

[kitekrazy]

It has to suck the be a K.C. fan. What do they look forward to every season? "Hey maybe we'll crack 75 wins this season".

I hear their farms systems are good. Somewhere that should translate someday to them being good.

 

They use to be a powerhouse in MLB at one time. I think it's bad for baseball that organizations suck for 2 or more decades. Sure there are others but a lot of people in that organization can't be doing things right.

 

I will always criticize Kenny for making trades with that organization. Losing is a habit. I've heard analysts talk about former Cubs removing the "Cub stink". It has to apply to the Riyals as well.

[Quin]

It has to suck the be a K.C. fan. What do they look forward to every season? "Hey maybe we'll crack 75 wins this season".

I hear their farms systems are good. Somewhere that should translate someday to them being good.

 

They use to be a powerhouse in MLB at one time. I think it's bad for baseball that organizations suck for 2 or more decades. Sure there are others but a lot of people in that organization can't be doing things right.

 

I will always criticize Kenny for making trades with that organization. Losing is a habit. I've heard analysts talk about former Cubs removing the "Cub stink". It has to apply to the Riyals as well.

 

According to some on this board, they will leave the Sox in the dust tomorrow.

[Balta1701]

According to some on this board, they will leave the Sox in the dust tomorrow.

I can't figure how a team can get a top 5 pick every year without eventually having a string of hits, even if they have a poor development system/organization.

 

If the Pirates can be 10 games up...

[Brian]

Next year, but if not, the year after. If not that year, the year after.....

[Quin]

I can't figure how a team can get a top 5 pick every year without eventually having a string of hits, even if they have a poor development system/organization.

 

If the Pirates can be 10 games up...

 

But THAT FARM SYSTEM.

[Balta1701]

But THAT FARM SYSTEM.

If you keep a great farm system long enough, eventually it's likely to produce some players.

[High Mileage]

I've been a Royals fan all my life. I'm 26 years old, I was born in 1985 when the Royals won the World Series. It's been a rough ride, but no matter how s***ty they are or have been, they are still my team.

 

This year we were pretty much told we should be competitive in a weak AL Central, but probably wouldn't be able to keep up with the Tigers. We were told the rotation was legit with Hochevar, Bruce Chen, Danny Duffy, and Jonathan Sanchez with Everett Teaford, Nate Adcock, Felipe Paulino, Vin Mazzaro, and Luis Mendoza competing for the 5th spot. The front office didn't do anything like go after Oswalt, Lose, Edwin Jackson, Paul Maholm, Gio Gonzalez, or any other halfway decent starter. Jonathan Broxton was brought in to be a set-up man. Jose Mijares was brought in as a quality lefty reliever. We were told that should be plenty.

 

We needed a utility fielder, so they brought back Yuniesky Betancourt. I don't understand that one. We dumped Mike Aviles to the Red Sox for Yamaico Navarro, the flipped Navaro after 6 games to the Pirates for two mid level, marginal prospects.

 

Lorenzo Cain was suppose to step in and be a big defensive upgrade over Melky Cabrera, while still bringing a decent bat. Then he got hurt. Salvador Perez shoe flashes of greatness last year behind the plate and with the bat, but he got hurt before the season and just returned last week. Joakim Soria got hurt and got TJ surgery for the second time. Then Lorenzo Cain got hurt, he's on his rehab assignment still. Meanwhile Melky is an All-Star starter for the Giants and a serious MVP Candidate. He's shown that his huge year last season with the Royals was no fluke.

 

Jarrod Dyson has been our primary centerfielder.

 

Reliever Blake Wood got hurt, TJ surgery for him.

 

The FO went out and traded two different mid level, marginal prospects to the Astros for catcher Humberto Quintero and former White Sox great, outfielder Jason Bourgeois(sp?).

 

Brayan Pena and Quintero have been pretty s***ty with the bat, Perez, has been hitting since he's been back. Quintero has been released.

 

Danny Duffy went down, TJ for him too.

 

Felipe Paulino. Injured. TJ surgery as well.

 

Eric Hosmer still isn't hitting much.

 

Mike Moustakas has been a huge surprise offensively and defensively. He has expressed his desire to sign long-term.

 

Billy Butler is a well deserving All-Star. He's finally show ability to hit homers on a regular basis.

 

Alcides Escobar has been spectacular defensively and offensively. They said when we got him that he wouldn't hit much. He's arguably the best hitting shortstop in the AL and was All-Star worthy.

 

Alex Gordon started off really slow but has cone around and he's been pretty good offensively and he's made some huge plays in left this year, do.t be surprised if he wins his 2nd consecutive Gold Glove.

 

Jeff Francoeur has regressed. He's pretty much blocking top prospect Wil Myers. Our GM Dayton Moore has had a hard on for Jeff Francoeur since he scouted him in high school while Moore was with the Braves. They are close friends. Moore won't be pulling the plug on Frenchy anytime soon no matter how bad it gets. Frenchy is under contract for another season after this one for $6.75M.

 

Chris Getz has been good when he's been on the field, but he's been on the DL three times already. He's on rehab in Omaha, and hitting well. Johnny Giavotella can't hit or field, his window may be closed. Betancourt has seen a lot of playing time at 2nd, he's awful. They need to go out and get somebody.

 

The bullpen has been rock solid all season. They been the best in the league, and have pitched more than any bullpen in the league due to our starters being so s***ty. TIM Collins had All-Star numbers. Broxton has been shaky each outing but also was a worthy All-Star. Aaron acrow and Greg Holland have been solid as well. Mijares too.

 

Ned Upstate has done some really, really stupid things this season. Like sitting our best hitter (Billy Butler) for three consecutive games against an NL opponent at their park, so we could have better defense at 1st (Hosmer). Francoeur has been our primary clean up hitter.

 

I don't think this team can be taken seriously until something is done with the rotation. Jonathan Sanchez needs to go, dude is worthless. I am going t be upset this off-season when the Royals don't even attempt to sign Greinke or Kansas City native Shawn Marcum. Top prospect Jake Odorizzi was the key piece in the Greinke to Milwaukee trade, and he appears to be ready. He along with Wil Myers will be playing in the Futures Game. This years' 5th overall pick, starting pitcher Kyle Zimmer is suppose to be quick to the big leagues.

 

This team also seems incapable of winning more than four in a row. I've got to say they are out of it as of now despite having 15 games left with the White Sox. If they make a run and make a real move or two that could change, but I'm not holding my breath.

 

Bottomline is that money needs to be spent in the free agency to fill in the gaps. Our farm system has produced well and there are more guts coming, but it hasn't produced much starting pitching. The FO has been relying too heavily on the farm and scrap heap finds. Our $61M payroll says it all. It's 4th lowest in baseball.

 

Attendance is up over 5,000 fans per game. They got the All-Star Game this year, money needs to be spent.

Edited July 7, 2012 by High Mileage

[Jake]

The Sox farm system is terrible

 

brb 10 rookies on a first place team

 

brb several of best players played in our farm system (Sale, Beckham, Alexei, Dayan, Gavin, Quintana)

[GoodAsGould]

The Sox farm system is terrible

 

brb 10 rookies on a first place team

 

brb several of best players played in our farm system (Sale, Beckham, Alexei, Dayan, Gavin, Quintana)

 

Your last point kind of goes to s*** including Alexei, Gavin, and Quintana.

[iamshack]

This is what happens when you try to develop everyone from within.

 

Opportunity costs, folks. Kills you.

[greg775]

I've been a Royals fan all my life. I'm 26 years old, I was born in 1985 when the Royals won the World Series. It's been a rough ride, but no matter how s***ty they are or have been, they are still my team.

 

This year we were pretty much told we should be competitive in a weak AL Central, but probably wouldn't be able to keep up with the Tigers. We were told the rotation was legit with Hochevar, Bruce Chen, Danny Duffy, and Jonathan Sanchez with Everett Teaford, Nate Adcock, Felipe Paulino, Vin Mazzaro, and Luis Mendoza competing for the 5th spot. The front office didn't do anything like go after Oswalt, Lose, Edwin Jackson, Paul Maholm, Gio Gonzalez, or any other halfway decent starter. Jonathan Broxton was brought in to be a set-up man. Jose Mijares was brought in as a quality lefty reliever. We were told that should be plenty.

 

We needed a utility fielder, so they brought back Yuniesky Betancourt. I don't understand that one. We dumped Mike Aviles to the Red Sox for Yamaico Navarro, the flipped Navaro after 6 games to the Pirates for two mid level, marginal prospects.

 

Lorenzo Cain was suppose to step in and be a big defensive upgrade over Melky Cabrera, while still bringing a decent bat. Then he got hurt. Salvador Perez shoe flashes of greatness last year behind the plate and with the bat, but he got hurt before the season and just returned last week. Joakim Soria got hurt and got TJ surgery for the second time. Then Lorenzo Cain got hurt, he's on his rehab assignment still. Meanwhile Melky is an All-Star starter for the Giants and a serious MVP Candidate. He's shown that his huge year last season with the Royals was no fluke.

 

Jarrod Dyson has been our primary centerfielder.

 

Reliever Blake Wood got hurt, TJ surgery for him.

 

The FO went out and traded two different mid level, marginal prospects to the Astros for catcher Humberto Quintero and former White Sox great, outfielder Jason Bourgeois(sp?).

 

Brayan Pena and Quintero have been pretty s***ty with the bat, Perez, has been hitting since he's been back. Quintero has been released.

 

Danny Duffy went down, TJ for him too.

 

Felipe Paulino. Injured. TJ surgery as well.

 

Eric Hosmer still isn't hitting much.

 

Mike Moustakas has been a huge surprise offensively and defensively. He has expressed his desire to sign long-term.

 

Billy Butler is a well deserving All-Star. He's finally show ability to hit homers on a regular basis.

 

Alcides Escobar has been spectacular defensively and offensively. They said when we got him that he wouldn't hit much. He's arguably the best hitting shortstop in the AL and was All-Star worthy.

 

Alex Gordon started off really slow but has cone around and he's been pretty good offensively and he's made some huge plays in left this year, do.t be surprised if he wins his 2nd consecutive Gold Glove.

 

Jeff Francoeur has regressed. He's pretty much blocking top prospect Wil Myers. Our GM Dayton Moore has had a hard on for Jeff Francoeur since he scouted him in high school while Moore was with the Braves. They are close friends. Moore won't be pulling the plug on Frenchy anytime soon no matter how bad it gets. Frenchy is under contract for another season after this one for $6.75M.

 

Chris Getz has been good when he's been on the field, but he's been on the DL three times already. He's on rehab in Omaha, and hitting well. Johnny Giavotella can't hit or field, his window may be closed. Betancourt has seen a lot of playing time at 2nd, he's awful. They need to go out and get somebody.

 

The bullpen has been rock solid all season. They been the best in the league, and have pitched more than any bullpen in the league due to our starters being so s***ty. TIM Collins had All-Star numbers. Broxton has been shaky each outing but also was a worthy All-Star. Aaron acrow and Greg Holland have been solid as well. Mijares too.

 

Ned Upstate has done some really, really stupid things this season. Like sitting our best hitter (Billy Butler) for three consecutive games against an NL opponent at their park, so we could have better defense at 1st (Hosmer). Francoeur has been our primary clean up hitter.

 

I don't think this team can be taken seriously until something is done with the rotation. Jonathan Sanchez needs to go, dude is worthless. I am going t be upset this off-season when the Royals don't even attempt to sign Greinke or Kansas City native Shawn Marcum. Top prospect Jake Odorizzi was the key piece in the Greinke to Milwaukee trade, and he appears to be ready. He along with Wil Myers will be playing in the Futures Game. This years' 5th overall pick, starting pitcher Kyle Zimmer is suppose to be quick to the big leagues.

 

This team also seems incapable of winning more than four in a row. I've got to say they are out of it as of now despite having 15 games left with the White Sox. If they make a run and make a real move or two that could change, but I'm not holding my breath.

 

Bottomline is that money needs to be spent in the free agency to fill in the gaps. Our farm system has produced well and there are more guts coming, but it hasn't produced much starting pitching. The FO has been relying too heavily on the farm and scrap heap finds. Our $61M payroll says it all. It's 4th lowest in baseball.

 

Attendance is up over 5,000 fans per game. They got the All-Star Game this year, money needs to be spent.

 

You got tickets to the all-star game?

This current Sox hot streak coupled with a s***ty road trip by KC has the Royals 9.5 out.

That really sucks for KC because KC was hanging within five games in the loss column for a long long time.

The Royals excuse this year is injuries. There's always something.

If Hosmer gets hot the second half to go with Sox-killer Butler, KC could beat the Sox 10 out of 15 though and pick up five games that way. KC seems to do very well against Sox last few seasons.

However, the Sox hitters may finally lick their chops against KC. The Royals' rotation is miserable right now. Rany or somebody was saying recently KC should have its starters go five innings max and just bring in the brigade of power relievers.

Had we not picked up Youk, I'd say KC would own the Sox second half.

Youk seems to be adding a tone of legitimacy to our team right now.

 

I think I'll go see some Sox-KC games in Kauffman this year.

[southsider2k5]

The problem is, as soon as guys get good, they leave. KC is in the same death spiral that Oakland is in.

[Balta1701]

The problem is, as soon as guys get good, they leave. KC is in the same death spiral that Oakland is in.

How did the Rays get out of it? Or Pittsburgh?

[kitekrazy]

I've been a Royals fan all my life. I'm 26 years old, I was born in 1985 when the Royals won the World Series. It's been a rough ride, but no matter how s***ty they are or have been, they are still my team.

 

At some point fans realize there are irreconcilable differences. Loyalty should be a two way street.

 

[DukeNukeEm]

How did the Rays get out of it? Or Pittsburgh?

It all has to come together one year and they have to win their division. For KC, and I havent checked but I'd assume the same for Pittsburgh, I'd expect attendance to really go up and more money to come into which will allow to retain talent.

 

The Tigers were also absolutely s*** for a while, but they got bailed out by a spendy owner.

[Balta1701]

but they got bailed out by a spendy owner.

And it also helped when they got the #2 pick and Justin Verlander wound up in their hands. Good work San Diego!

[Melissa1334]

I've been a Royals fan all my life. I'm 26 years old, I was born in 1985 when the Royals won the World Series. It's been a rough ride, but no matter how s***ty they are or have been, they are still my team.

 

This year we were pretty much told we should be competitive in a weak AL Central, but probably wouldn't be able to keep up with the Tigers. We were told the rotation was legit with Hochevar, Bruce Chen, Danny Duffy, and Jonathan Sanchez with Everett Teaford, Nate Adcock, Felipe Paulino, Vin Mazzaro, and Luis Mendoza competing for the 5th spot. The front office didn't do anything like go after Oswalt, Lose, Edwin Jackson, Paul Maholm, Gio Gonzalez, or any other halfway decent starter. Jonathan Broxton was brought in to be a set-up man. Jose Mijares was brought in as a quality lefty reliever. We were told that should be plenty.

 

We needed a utility fielder, so they brought back Yuniesky Betancourt. I don't understand that one. We dumped Mike Aviles to the Red Sox for Yamaico Navarro, the flipped Navaro after 6 games to the Pirates for two mid level, marginal prospects.

 

Lorenzo Cain was suppose to step in and be a big defensive upgrade over Melky Cabrera, while still bringing a decent bat. Then he got hurt. Salvador Perez shoe flashes of greatness last year behind the plate and with the bat, but he got hurt before the season and just returned last week. Joakim Soria got hurt and got TJ surgery for the second time. Then Lorenzo Cain got hurt, he's on his rehab assignment still. Meanwhile Melky is an All-Star starter for the Giants and a serious MVP Candidate. He's shown that his huge year last season with the Royals was no fluke.

 

Jarrod Dyson has been our primary centerfielder.

 

Reliever Blake Wood got hurt, TJ surgery for him.

 

The FO went out and traded two different mid level, marginal prospects to the Astros for catcher Humberto Quintero and former White Sox great, outfielder Jason Bourgeois(sp?).

 

Brayan Pena and Quintero have been pretty s***ty with the bat, Perez, has been hitting since he's been back. Quintero has been released.

 

Danny Duffy went down, TJ for him too.

 

Felipe Paulino. Injured. TJ surgery as well.

 

Eric Hosmer still isn't hitting much.

 

Mike Moustakas has been a huge surprise offensively and defensively. He has expressed his desire to sign long-term.

 

Billy Butler is a well deserving All-Star. He's finally show ability to hit homers on a regular basis.

 

Alcides Escobar has been spectacular defensively and offensively. They said when we got him that he wouldn't hit much. He's arguably the best hitting shortstop in the AL and was All-Star worthy.

 

Alex Gordon started off really slow but has cone around and he's been pretty good offensively and he's made some huge plays in left this year, do.t be surprised if he wins his 2nd consecutive Gold Glove.

 

Jeff Francoeur has regressed. He's pretty much blocking top prospect Wil Myers. Our GM Dayton Moore has had a hard on for Jeff Francoeur since he scouted him in high school while Moore was with the Braves. They are close friends. Moore won't be pulling the plug on Frenchy anytime soon no matter how bad it gets. Frenchy is under contract for another season after this one for $6.75M.

 

Chris Getz has been good when he's been on the field, but he's been on the DL three times already. He's on rehab in Omaha, and hitting well. Johnny Giavotella can't hit or field, his window may be closed. Betancourt has seen a lot of playing time at 2nd, he's awful. They need to go out and get somebody.

 

The bullpen has been rock solid all season. They been the best in the league, and have pitched more than any bullpen in the league due to our starters being so s***ty. TIM Collins had All-Star numbers. Broxton has been shaky each outing but also was a worthy All-Star. Aaron acrow and Greg Holland have been solid as well. Mijares too.

 

Ned Upstate has done some really, really stupid things this season. Like sitting our best hitter (Billy Butler) for three consecutive games against an NL opponent at their park, so we could have better defense at 1st (Hosmer). Francoeur has been our primary clean up hitter.

 

I don't think this team can be taken seriously until something is done with the rotation. Jonathan Sanchez needs to go, dude is worthless. I am going t be upset this off-season when the Royals don't even attempt to sign Greinke or Kansas City native Shawn Marcum. Top prospect Jake Odorizzi was the key piece in the Greinke to Milwaukee trade, and he appears to be ready. He along with Wil Myers will be playing in the Futures Game. This years' 5th overall pick, starting pitcher Kyle Zimmer is suppose to be quick to the big leagues.

 

This team also seems incapable of winning more than four in a row. I've got to say they are out of it as of now despite having 15 games left with the White Sox. If they make a run and make a real move or two that could change, but I'm not holding my breath.

 

Bottomline is that money needs to be spent in the free agency to fill in the gaps. Our farm system has produced well and there are more guts coming, but it hasn't produced much starting pitching. The FO has been relying too heavily on the farm and scrap heap finds. Our $61M payroll says it all. It's 4th lowest in baseball.

 

Attendance is up over 5,000 fans per game. They got the All-Star Game this year, money needs to be spent.

the royals dont have the best bullpen(orioles) and alcides escobar is not the best hitting ss in the a.l. not even close, there are atleast 7 better hitting short stops , with asdrubal leading the way

[southsider2k5]

It all has to come together one year and they have to win their division. For KC, and I havent checked but I'd assume the same for Pittsburgh, I'd expect attendance to really go up and more money to come into which will allow to retain talent.

 

The Tigers were also absolutely s*** for a while, but they got bailed out by a spendy owner.

 

Detroit is also a much bigger market than Kansas City.

[caulfield12]

Escobar, when you take into consideration his fielding and age, definitely Top 3.

 

The Myers blocked by Cain and Francouer scenario is kind of a nightmare in the making...

 

Agreed about Betancourt, that was another version of Willie Bloomquist...better to give those opportunities to a youngster.

 

In the end, the Royals have been bitten hard by all those injuries, moreso than most teams. That said, they will have to spend money on a Hamels or Greinke caliber of frontline starter. They did it b4 with Meche, although he was really more a 2/3 guy and obviously injury-prone.

 

Maybe an Erik Bedard...that at least has the ABILITY to be a 1/2, even if his stats or injury history is questionable. Francisco Liriano would be another possibility. Two guys like that....or one "surefire" frontline starter, and they'll be in much better shape moving the rest of the rotation back on spot.

 

 

[High Mileage]

You got tickets to the all-star game?

I do not have tickets to the ASG but I will be in attendance for tomorrow's Futures Game.

 

The problem is, as soon as guys get good, they leave. KC is in the same death spiral that Oakland is in.

Things use to be that way, but now they actually extend guys to get at least 2-3 more years. Greinke, Gordon, Butler, Soria, Perez, and Escobar were all extended by Dayton Moore.

 

How did the Rays get out of it? Or Pittsburgh?

They were even worse for even longer. They both annually had higher picks than the Royals.

 

the royals dont have the best bullpen(orioles) and alcides escobar is not the best hitting ss in the a.l. not even close, there are atleast 7 better hitting short stops , with asdrubal leading the way

Well the bullpen thing must've recently changed. It may have been early last week but I heard it numerous times on our Fox Sports broadcasts.

 

Escobar has the highest average among AL shortstops. He's third in OBP, second in SLG, second in OPS. Third in total hits, tied for first in doubles. I guess I shouldn't have been so vague.

 

[greg775]

I do not have tickets to the ASG but I will be in attendance for tomorrow's Futures Game.

 

 

Things use to be that way, but now they actually extend guys to get at least 2-3 more years. Greinke, Gordon, Butler, Soria, Perez, and Escobar were all extended by Dayton Moore.

 

 

They were even worse for even longer. They both annually had higher picks than the Royals.

 

 

Well the bullpen thing must've recently changed. It may have been early last week but I heard it numerous times on our Fox Sports broadcasts.

 

Escobar has the highest average among AL shortstops. He's third in OBP, second in SLG, second in OPS. Third in total hits, tied for first in doubles. I guess I shouldn't have been so vague.

 

I'll be at the futures game too.

And I got my tix for friday night's sox-royals.

[caulfield12]

I'll be at the futures game too.

And I got my tix for friday night's sox-royals.

 

 

Who would u cheer for if the Royals played the Marlins?

 

What if Buehrle was pitching for the Royals against Ozzie?

 

 

 

[iamshack]

How did the Rays get out of it? Or Pittsburgh?

Pittsburgh isn't out of anything yet.

 

But it helps to have guys like Longoria and Price, or McCutcheon and McDonald, etc.

 

 

[Chicago White Sox]

Pittsburgh isn't out of anything yet.

 

But it helps to have guys like Longoria and Price, or McCutcheon and McDonald, etc.

Thank you. Pittsburgh may have a good record right now, but it's not going to last, as their offense is incredibly bad. Also, they have two starters in Burnett and Bedard that aren't long-term solutions. Everyone likes how they're building that organization, but let's not give them too much props just yet.

 

One other thing people need to realize is that teams like KC and Pittsburgh have spent big on the draft to quicken their rebuilding efforts, but a good chunk of these over-slot players are Boras clients. So they'll have these guys for six years and then they're likely off to the highest bidders. IMO, the Royals are in big trouble, because by the time they develop a half-way decent pitching staff, a bunch of their position players will be gone.

[iamshack]

Thank you. Pittsburgh may have a good record right now, but it's not going to last, as their offense is incredibly bad. Also, they have two starters in Burnett and Bedard that aren't long-term solutions. Everyone likes how they're building that organization, but let's not give them too much props just yet.

 

One other thing people need to realize is that teams like KC and Pittsburgh have spent big on the draft to quicken their rebuilding efforts, but a good chunk of these over-slot players are Boras clients. So they'll have these guys for six years and then they're likely off to the highest bidders. IMO, the Royals are in big trouble, because by the time they develop a half-way decent pitching staff, a bunch of their position players will be gone.

I just think it is darn near impossible to build a contender that is almost all players developed from within. I still can't figure out how the Rays have sustained the consistent success they have with what they have gone through over the course of the last 4 years.

 

When you are developing so many players from within, you have to give those players opportunities. Those opportunities mean you're not signing other productive players. Thus, when one of the young players gets injured, struggles, or just plain doesn't turn into the player you thought he would be, then you usually don't have much to replace him with in-season. When you're talking about giving these opportunities to 15+ players simultaneously, the odds for it all coming together at one time are extremely low.

 

Hats off to the Rays, who are pulling this off because they have no other choice.