CubKilla Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 On a positive note, there aren't many more road games after this...Just a couple more road trips that are week-long, while there's 1 that just a few games. They DO play much better at home. There's ALWAYS hope! WHOOPEE! Too bad we're going to have to play well on the road if we make the playoffs since we ain't gonna have jack-s*** for homefield advantage. That is, unless, we go all the way to the World Series . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 Hey Ncorgbl, this is off topic, but I thought you might be able to answer it... How much input does Mr. Reinsdorf have in what players are obtained (thinking more of free agents than trades, but not excluding trades) and their contract negotiations? Does he give the GM a set of guidelines, or does he get personally involved in approving/disapproving of contracts of individual players? On more than just a rubber stamp level? Not being from Chicago and seeing the Sox organization from the bottom up, so to speak, I am not sure how involved he is and am curious. Thanks for your input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 The fact that Colon is 10-11 with a 4.25 ERA, and Buehrle is 10-12 with a 4.22 ERA right now, is disappionting compared to what most White Sox fans had hoped for from these two players. In the end if we can still win the World Series this year, it won't matter at all. Some fans don't believe we can do that. Only when we have been eliminated will I be convinced of it. In the face of how things have gone in the last two series, I can understand why there is reason not to have much faith in this team. If any of you can understand why I still do, then you are a step ahead of the pack in my eyes. With the exception of Loaisa. Marte, and maybe Wunch, all Sox pitchers have underachieved this season. Maybe Cooper is next on the firing line. It seems this organization likes to put the blame on coaches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CubKilla Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 Maybe Cooper is next on the firing line. It seems this organization likes to put the blame on coaches. And who is the one constant through all of this ? Hmmmmm..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 Believe me, I hear ya. Its ridiculous this guy still has a job. Buy him a big hammock and let him sleep in his backyard, not in the White Sox dugout. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 what has Carlos, Mags, and Ordonez done Anyways, the one point I'd like to bring up is this. Does anyone remember what happened to Bart before his past two starts? I do. In the 8th inning in his game against KC, he had some kind of injury. Am I the only one who thinks that that injury may be affecting him still? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 Anyways, the one point I'd like to bring up is this. Does anyone remember what happened to Bart before his past two starts? I do. In the 8th inning in his game against KC, he had some kind of injury. Am I the only one who thinks that that injury may be affecting him still? He was 97 on the Fox gun last night. Texas has a lot of good hitters, and that park is a bandbox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ncorgbl Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 I believe you are the one to bring up money as the big difference between Colon and Buehrle. To avoid scrolling your quote was: "The difference to me between Buehrle and Goo is about $9 million next season, and about $6 million this year. Colon came here with a rep, and a $12+ million wannabe, and hasn't pitched up to that. Buehrle is looking for about 1/3 of that." end quote Again I ask you, since their stats are about the same, would you reverse your opinion if Mark was asking for $12,000,000 and Colon was not? Your quote above leads me to believe you would and I could respect you for that. Last I saw, Mark hasn't signed and I'm certain if he had E-Lo type numbers this season and on his way to a 20 win season he would be asking for the dollars that Colon was asking for after his season. As does every employee, people look around and figure what others are getting paid and you want to make the same or more. Athletes are competitive and its one way they compete, by seeing who's got the bigger contract. You could knock a zero off every contract out there and the guys would be just as happy, as long as they are earning more than the next guy. No I am not happy with the effort from a few players on this team. I expected far more from our pitching staff this season. Botch, Mark, and Bart have all dissapointed big time. I also thought Frank would have had a better year so I'm a little disappointed at him. I'll toss Kong on that list and perhaps Crede but the Crede pick would be a bit unfair because of nothing to compare him to. Getting back to Colon, I believe he is one of the top two or three pitchers in our system and will be for the next 2-3 years if he decides to stay. I can't really judge his effort because I honestly do not remember watching too much of him before this season. I know some very laid back looking guys who are fierce competitors. We use to say they had ice water running through their veins, now we want our athletes more animated. Thank you for at least having a well formed opinion and sticking to it. As I recall, you started the Colon sucks bandwagon early in the season and pulled it out of the gate. I will also concede he has not produced the won-loss record that most fans expected so you are correct that he wasn't the second coming. I brought up the money first, but as I said, it is part of the comparison. Yes, if Buehrle was the guy with the big rep, the 'horse', the innings eater, the Ace, the complete gamer and pitched like he has I'd be all over him as well. But probably not as hard as Colon. Buehrle impresses me as making an effort, and Colon doesn't show me an effort at all. That lack of effort is far more important to me than anything else. I just don't think he wants to be here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ncorgbl Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 Hey Ncorgbl, this is off topic, but I thought you might be able to answer it... How much input does Mr. Reinsdorf have in what players are obtained (thinking more of free agents than trades, but not excluding trades) and their contract negotiations? Does he give the GM a set of guidelines, or does he get personally involved in approving/disapproving of contracts of individual players? On more than just a rubber stamp level? Not being from Chicago and seeing the Sox organization from the bottom up, so to speak, I am not sure how involved he is and am curious. Thanks for your input. JR is informed about everyone, but it is pretty individual as to who he gets involved with and not. Most are handled by the G.M., when Schu was here it was more than not. Thomas' contract has always been handled by JR only, but Williams invoked the RPR clause when he was not supposed to, so JR had to rework it. Right now if Hemond wants someone, as he did Alomar and Everett, he turns around and asks Einhorn. If Einhorn agrees, and he almost always does with Hemond, the deal is done. JR will never say no to Eddie, and vice versa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Showtime Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 Right now if Hemond wants someone, as he did Alomar and Everett, he turns around and asks Einhorn. If Einhorn agrees, and he almost always does with Hemond, the deal is done. That's how it should work in a big market like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 Hey Ncorgbl, this is off topic, but I thought you might be able to answer it... How much input does Mr. Reinsdorf have in what players are obtained (thinking more of free agents than trades, but not excluding trades) and their contract negotiations? Does he give the GM a set of guidelines, or does he get personally involved in approving/disapproving of contracts of individual players? On more than just a rubber stamp level? Not being from Chicago and seeing the Sox organization from the bottom up, so to speak, I am not sure how involved he is and am curious. Thanks for your input. JR is informed about everyone, but it is pretty individual as to who he gets involved with and not. Most are handled by the G.M., when Schu was here it was more than not. Thomas' contract has always been handled by JR only, but Williams invoked the RPR clause when he was not supposed to, so JR had to rework it. Right now if Hemond wants someone, as he did Alomar and Everett, he turns around and asks Einhorn. If Einhorn agrees, and he almost always does with Hemond, the deal is done. JR will never say no to Eddie, and vice versa. Fair enough, but your answer brings me to another question (intended respectfully) ......... Is Hemond really making the decisions? If he is, then what good reason on earth would there be for the Sox to hide it and allow Kenny to maintain the title publicly, including doing all of the media interviews? Also, if KW is not dealing with other clubs in terms of trades, etc., how in the hell are the Sox keeping a lid on this? I am all for KW not being the GM for the Sox so I am on the same side here, but I just find it hard to believe there is a valid reason for this charade to exist, which makes me wonder if it really does. Surely you can understand my skepticism here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 Ok, one more question Ncorgbl.... Is there any truth to the rumor that KW had a contract extension with Buehrle agreed upon and ready to be signed, but that JR nixed it? I'm talking last off-season, of course. Thanks for your input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ncorgbl Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 Ok, one more question Ncorgbl.... Is there any truth to the rumor that KW had a contract extension with Buehrle agreed upon and ready to be signed, but that JR nixed it? I'm talking last off-season, of course. Thanks for your input. There are a few reasons, none of which I agree with, that KW is still the 'face' of the G.M. That's their business. Do notice, however, regardless the reporter, the media outlet, the FULL story never is reported for the Sox, only partials to slant one way or another, usually for a controversey. Case in point the comments by Manuel that all but one reporter left out of an interview that then made it look as though Manuel was bashing Frank, instead of praising him as was the truth. I suspect for that reason that the organization is looking for the totally controllable moment to 'allow' Williams to take another position in the system for family reasons. It'd be much more contrllable if the Sox were in control of the division race, and easier to happen and then move on quickly to other things. Most deals in MLB are made by the G.M.'s office, so when another team is contacted by Hemond or Hahn it's just normal business. But remeber too, hurting another franchise is not in the best interest of baseball or the individual franchise itself. One hurts, they all suffer and the bigger picture is a protected concern most of the time. As to Buehrle the big contract KW spoke of was never offered to Buehrle or his agent. They never turned it down. Last season JR wanted to give Mark a good, fair contract, and Williams talked him into playing 'hardball', figuring Mark was locked in, why bend over. This past spring Williams had played too many games and they were piling up on him. He misrepresented the offer to Buehrle, infuriating the entire Buehrle camp. Mark insists that had nothing to do with his poor start, but it is my opinion that he's just as human as we are, and it did. There is no mystery in my mind that Mark's return to winning coincided with Williams' 'lessened duties'. A new, fair contract is being worked on now, and it will be Mark's decision if he takes it or not. He wants to stay a White Sox, the Cardinal thing is just a guy playing to his home town crowd that's become an option, and I think he'll stay, but only if Williams is gone. The same applies for Thomas, and quite a few others as well, when their times come. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 Thanks for your input. It is hard to understand why the Sox need a more controllable time, yet I do to a point. I am also not there in their offices, so there is no way to know everything that is going on. It is easy to judge from afar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxplosion Posted August 19, 2003 Share Posted August 19, 2003 Thomas, Marte and Lee are the only ones who I want anymore of... Everetts pretty cool too... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JUGGERNAUT Posted August 19, 2003 Share Posted August 19, 2003 I find it hard to believe that this is the truth. What are your sources? I can understand the Cubune, Times, & even the Herald overlooking all this but never the Southtown. If this is the truth, then how does it escape the Southtown, WSCR, ESPN radio, etc? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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