CTU is Going on Strike

[Soxbadger]

You could have smaller class sizes if you paid teachers less. But when there is no excess money, you cant, pay teachers the same and have more teachers.

 

Math just doesnt work that way, thanks teachers!

[SoxFan1]

I know they love this talking point, but the majority of the money going to the schools is ending up in their hands. If they brought a budget to the CPS taht said "okay, we won't take a raise as long as you promise to decrease class sizes and add desks" you don't think CPS would be all over that?

Oh, I agree with you, I'm just playing devils advocate a bit.

 

It's pissing me off because every other post on my facebook is from CPS teachers or former CPS students saying "Is you're against the teachers strike, you need to get educated."

 

You know what, how about instead of calling people stupid, you f***ing educate us then. And you know who IS NOT getting educated? The students sitting at home because the teachers aren't in the classrooms.

[southsider2k5]

Oh, I agree with you, I'm just playing devils advocate a bit.

 

It's pissing me off because every other post on my facebook is from CPS teachers or former CPS students saying "Is you're against the teachers strike, you need to get educated."

You know what, how about instead of calling people stupid, you f***ing educate us then. And you know who IS NOT getting educated? The students sitting at home because the teachers aren't in the classrooms.

 

lol.

[SoxFan1]

lol.

EXACTLY

[mr_genius]

Does anyone have a reference for the "the average teacher in chicago makes $74k" number?

 

I'm going through the BLS tables, it's a nightmare to figure out, but they list something like 200k teachers in the chicago area and show an average teacher salary of $56k, with a wide distribution depending on specialty.

 

The trib is reporting they average lik 76k or something, more than twice as much as the average pay of the people the teachers want to raise taxes on . Oh and the rest of us don't get 4 months vacation.

 

[Y2HH]

The trib is reporting they average lik 76k or something, more than twice as much as the average pay of the people the teachers want to raise taxes on . Oh and the rest of us don't get 4 months vacation.

 

 

Friend of mine is a teacher, doesn't work 24/7, or hardly at all after hours...never works on vacations, nor does he work all summer long (refuses to do summer school because he says he makes enough money without it). Other friend of mine is married to one, who confirms.

 

A few years ago, he was playing World of Warcraft with us, during the school year, 4 nights a week from 7pm-12 or 1am. That's how busy he was with all this "after school work", which he said was nothing more than lazy teachers bringing work home that they didn't need to bring home, because there is plenty of downtime during the school day to get ALL of that work done...but most of them don't. They text message, make phone calls, or sit around watching TV in the lounges.

 

Anecdotal or not, I call BS on all of this.

 

I went to high school. I saw how much downtime teachers had then, and I'm guessing they have even more now.

 

In all, with a city/state nearing insolvency, this is pretty much the worst time to be strong-arming taxpayers for more. f***wads.

Edited September 10, 2012 by Y2HH

[MurcieOne]

Oh, I agree with you, I'm just playing devils advocate a bit.

 

It's pissing me off because every other post on my facebook is from CPS teachers or former CPS students saying "Is you're against the teachers strike, you need to get educated."

 

What's really funny is that I bet the majority of those same people don't really understand the issues at hand.

[Steve9347]

My clock never turns off. I am literally on call 24 hours a day, every single day, without exception.

 

At any time my phone can ring with an emergency.

Teachers and those who defend them never understand this... all teachers do is b**** constantly despite an easy schedule. OMG you had to work late one Saturday, better b**** about it! And those 100 straight days you did jack s*** all summer?

[Steve9347]

If you're posting on SoxTalk, you're not working. Teachers generally don't get the luxury of taking those sorts of mental breaks throughout the day.

Don't teachers across all levels get plenty of mental breaks during the day?

 

Grade school it's art/music/library classes and lunchtime.

High school they get a free period, and lunch time.

College? WTF have you seen those hilariously bad office hours?

 

All that on top of not working summers, getting 2-4 weeks off every September, and at least a week off in the Spring. All that on top of reporting for duty for a whopping 7 hour day and being done with work by between 2 and 3:30pm.

 

OH POOR TEACHERS.

[Steve9347]

Had teachers not spent their entire lives lying and b****ing to anyone who will listen about how their job sucks, I'd likely have become one because they don't work for s*** and get fatty pension and don't have to f***ing worry about losing their jobs ever.

[Steve9347]

The average CPS teacher, who has about 14 years of experience, gets a total compensation equal to about $74,798/year or $34.50/hour. The average percentage of CPS students who meet or exceed state standards is 66%. The percentage of CPS 11th graders who meet college readiness benchmarks is 21% in Reading, 19% in Math, 11% in Science and 38% in English.

 

The average Chicagoan works a comparable schedule to a CPS teacher, yet earns half as much in total compensation, 33 fewer days off, higher health care costs for lower quality health benefits and either a 401(k) that they contribute heavily into or no retirement package at all.

 

http://www.chicagonow.com/windy-city-young...r-compensation/

 

But keep b****ing and spreading the myth, teachers!

[EvilMonkey]

The Teachers contract that I posted a link to earlier had that info on it as well towards the end. It worked out to a little over $20 an hour to coach any of the teams and $16 if the teachers did 'crowd control' at events.

[Balta1701]

The average CPS teacher, who has about 14 years of experience, gets a total compensation equal to about $74,798/year or $34.50/hour. The average percentage of CPS students who meet or exceed state standards is 66%. The percentage of CPS 11th graders who meet college readiness benchmarks is 21% in Reading, 19% in Math, 11% in Science and 38% in English.

How do those numbers compare when you control for the fact that 90% of CPS students are low enough income to qualify for government assisted meals?

[Soxbadger]

How do those numbers compare when you control for the fact that 90% of CPS students are low enough income to qualify for government assisted meals?

 

Where is that argument going? Poor people arent smart?

[iamshack]

The average CPS teacher, who has about 14 years of experience, gets a total compensation equal to about $74,798/year or $34.50/hour. The average percentage of CPS students who meet or exceed state standards is 66%. The percentage of CPS 11th graders who meet college readiness benchmarks is 21% in Reading, 19% in Math, 11% in Science and 38% in English.

 

The average Chicagoan works a comparable schedule to a CPS teacher, yet earns half as much in total compensation, 33 fewer days off, higher health care costs for lower quality health benefits and either a 401(k) that they contribute heavily into or no retirement package at all.

 

http://www.chicagonow.com/windy-city-young...r-compensation/

 

But keep b****ing and spreading the myth, teachers!

But they can't post on Soxtalk!

[Soxbadger]

But they can't post on Soxtalk!

 

Look, wed all trade 40 extra days of vacation for just 1 second of sweet sweet Soxtalk.

[Steve9347]

But they can't post on Soxtalk!

STRIKE!

[Steve9347]

Look, wed all trade 40 extra days of vacation for just 1 second of sweet sweet Soxtalk.

100 days, you mean.

 

*Soxtalk still worth it, though.

Edited September 10, 2012 by Steve9347

[bmags]

Where is that argument going? Poor people arent smart?

 

Don't be dense.

[flippedoutpunk]

http://iirc.niu.edu

 

That's the tool I've had to use for my Educational Foundations classes at Northeastern.

 

These are the stats...

 

District Summary

Avg. Teacher Salary $71,236

Avg. Teacher Experience 13.7 Years

Instructional Expenditure Per Pupil $7,946

Operational Expenditure Per Pupil $13,078

Low Income 86%

[Soxbadger]

Don't be dense.

 

What conclusion should I be reaching? I didnt make the post, I just simply asked where it was going because I was interested. Since you seem to know the answer, why dont you enlighten me.

 

 

[Jake]

Like it or not, it's specialized labor that requires a good deal of education and is also essential to our society. I can't evaluate every individual area's teacher grievances, but comparing it to other professions doesn't make sense.

 

I will say that the district where I'm from pays much less than CPS apparently. It is probably also much easier to each where I'm from than CPS, and living costs are way lower. That said, starting salary for a teacher with a BA where I am from is 30k. A 20 year tenured teacher with a masters make roughly 75k. Administrators make about 100 (principal, superintendent).

 

I plan to teach in college, talk about some yummy hours, pay, benefits, vacations. The 10 years of college and the fact I'll be able to do things that nobody else can will make it all worth it though

[EvilMonkey]

I will say that the district where I'm from pays much less than CPS apparently. It is probably also much easier to each where I'm from than CPS, and living costs are way lower. That said, starting salary for a teacher with a BA where I am from is 30k. A 20 year tenured teacher with a masters make roughly 75k. Administrators make about 100 (principal, superintendent).

you say those as if they are bad. Maybe bad for inner city Chicago, but not in other areas. Those numbers look similar to the pay scale in the town I grew up in.

[Balta1701]

What conclusion should I be reaching? I didnt make the post, I just simply asked where it was going because I was interested. Since you seem to know the answer, why dont you enlighten me.

There is a huge correlation between the socioeconomic status of the parents and the performance of the kids in school. I wouldn't be surprised if it was the single biggest factor in determining the average outcome of a population of students.

 

Thus, if you tell me that the population of students is performing vastly below average, but its from a group that is economically disadvantaged, I'm not surprised.

 

The next question then is...how are they performing when you control for socioeconomic status?

 

You could have the best group of teachers in the world, but if they're put into a district where 90% of the population qualifies for reduced price meals, the overall results on average will look poor, because the greatest teachers in the country will be swamped out by socioeconomic status compared to an area with a more average income distribution. I'd like to see that variable controlled for so that I can judge that performance level.

[bmags]

What conclusion should I be reaching? I didnt make the post, I just simply asked where it was going because I was interested. Since you seem to know the answer, why dont you enlighten me.

 

A higher % of low-income classified kids is a higher batch of kids with quite a bit less resources. Worse nutrition, worse home conditions, less parental help on homework, parents who are there less to help develop their kids at an early age with reading, etc etc. They are typically further behind when they get to school, and fall further behind when they leave school.

 

Go look at chicago magazines "top public high schools", it's no surprise that the ones they champion are those with 2-3% low-income. It's no different than colleges "improving" by changing their inputs rather than improving their teaching. Being from a low income area doesn't mean you are stupid, but it does often mean you need to play catch-up and need more attention.

 

CPS teachers have and do a hell of a job. But they need to realize the city could be pushed to default, which will not only mean good-bye pensions, it means an awful lot of pain for the students they'd teach. This city is a city pretty stretched on taxes. There's not a lot more to go.