CTU is Going on Strike

[Rex Kickass]

I've been following this from afar (New Jersey) and I'm way too lazy to read this whole thread - but when I was a kid, I seem to recall the CTU would strike far more often in the 80s. Like if a lampshade looked at the Union President wrong, there was a strike!

 

Also, generally when days are lost to a teacher's strike, they are made up at the end of the year. So the "how could you do this to the children" meme is sorta bulls***. Unless you do it on every snowday or at the beginning of every summer vacation.

 

I think their strikes would actually be most effective, however, if it was more limited. Rather than just total walkoff, it might make more sense to say walk off one or two days a week.

[Y2HH]

I've been following this from afar (New Jersey) and I'm way too lazy to read this whole thread - but when I was a kid, I seem to recall the CTU would strike far more often in the 80s. Like if a lampshade looked at the Union President wrong, there was a strike!

 

Also, generally when days are lost to a teacher's strike, they are made up at the end of the year. So the "how could you do this to the children" meme is sorta bulls***. Unless you do it on every snowday or at the beginning of every summer vacation.

 

I think their strikes would actually be most effective, however, if it was more limited. Rather than just total walkoff, it might make more sense to say walk off one or two days a week.

 

Tacking days onto the end of the school year does nothing for the kids...it's already summer and hot out, and their ability to learn dwindles during those times.

[BigSqwert]

Director of Private School Where Rahm Sends His Kids Opposes Using Testing for Teacher Evaluations

 

Unlike occasional teacher union opponent Secretary of Education Arne Duncan, Chicago Mayor Rahm Emanuel does not send his kids to public schools. Instead, Emanuel's children attend one of the most elite prep schools in Chicago, the University of Chicago Lab School, where the annual tuition is more than $20,000. (Emanuel has repeatedly refused to answer questions about why he eschews public schools for his children, telling reporters that it is a private family decision.)

 

The conditions at the University of Chicago Lab Schools are dramatically different than those at Chicago Public Schools, which are currently closed with teachers engaged in a high-profile strike. The Lab School has seven full-time art teachers to serve a student population of 1,700. By contrast, only 25% of Chicago’s “neighborhood elementary schools” have both a full-time art and music instructor. The Lab School has three different libraries, while 160 Chicago public elementary schools do not have a library.

 

“Physical education, world languages, libraries and the arts are not frills. They are an essential piece of a well-rounded education,” wrote University of Chicago Lab School Director David Magill on the school's website in February 2009.

 

Chicago Teachers Union (CTU) President Karen Lewis agrees with Magill, and believes what works for Mayor Emanuel’s kids should be a prescription for the rest of the city.

 

“I’m actually glad that he did [send his kids to Lab School] because it gave me an opportunity to look at how the Lab school functions,” Lewis told Chicago magazine in November 2011. “I thought he gave us a wonderful pathway to seeing what a good education looks like, and I think he’s absolutely right, and so we love that model. We would love to see that model throughout.”

 

One of the key sticking points in union negotiations is that Emanuel wants to use standardized tests scores to count for 40 percent of the basis of teacher evaluations. Earlier this year, more than 80 researchers from 16 Chicago-area universities signed an open letter to Emanuel, criticizing the use of standardized test scores for this purpose. “The new evaluation system for teachers and principals centers on misconceptions about student growth, with potentially negative impact on the education of Chicago’s children,” they wrote.

 

CTU claims that nearly 30% of its members could be dismissed within one to two years if the proposed evaluation process is put into effect and has opposed using tests scores as the basis of evaluation. They're joined in their opposition to using testing in evaulations by Magill.

 

Writing on the University of Chicago’s Lab School website two years ago, Magill noted, “Measuring outcomes through standardized testing and referring to those results as the evidence of learning and the bottom line is, in my opinion, misguided and, unfortunately, continues to be advocated under a new name and supported by the current [Obama] administration.”

 

While Magill could not be reached for direct comment on the specifics of the Chicago Teachers’ strike, his past writings on the school's site suggest he might be supportive.

 

“I shudder to think of who would be attracted to teach in our public schools without unions,” Magill wrote on the school’s website in February 2009, adding that, even with unions, many teachers "have had no choice but to take on second jobs to make ends meet.“

 

But Magill's writings also note just how fine a line CTU will have to walk to keep public sentiment, which currently supports the strike 47% to 39%, on its side according to one recent poll. Acknowledging the "distressing...generational change in the public’s attitude toward teachers," Magill writes, "Some would say that teachers are responsible for this change by publicly participating in actions designed to bring attention to sub-standard working conditions and compensation. These actions often cause unintended collateral damage to students. Parents and the public at large have long memories when the education of their children is interrupted. We must find a way to conclude collective bargaining without raising doubts about the professionalism of those whose work should be valued the most.”

[StrangeSox]

So maybe they should quit being crabs in a bucket trying to take more from the 80% of people below them who are paying their salaries?

 

Their summary plan talks about closing corporate loopholes to boost revenues.

 

The crab mentality refers more to workplace conditions and rights than salary; specifically, it came up in the context of "I could be fired in ten seconds without notice and no severance or ability to contest!" I think that's a terrible system and that instead of trying to make sure everyone has to work under those same conditions, it'd be better if there were stronger employment protections. Not necessarily tenure-for-everyone systems, either.

[StrangeSox]

Tacking days onto the end of the school year does nothing for the kids...it's already summer and hot out, and their ability to learn dwindles during those times.

 

well...if they put A/C into the classrooms...

 

The thing with strikes is that they're meant to bring things to a head. They can actually be very beneficial at getting things resolved quicker than they otherwise would. That's not universally the case, of course, and we'll see what happens here.

[NorthSideSox72]

Here's a prediction, and something to consider...

 

CPS student numbers have gone up more in recent years than the city population would seem to dictate, and one of the primary reasons for this is that parents who normally would have packed up the kids and moved to the burbs for better schools (or sent them to private schools), are unable to move (or afford private school) because of the economy and the housing market realities. Lower grade levels are being overwhelmed - this is part of the reason some of these kids have 35 people in their 1st grade classes. This is a pent up wave.

 

Now, with the strike going on, regardless of who parents blame (probably should blame both sides), they are angry at the school system. More pent up desire to leave the system with their kids.

 

So, when the economy finally does recover with a bit more flourish, sometime in the next few years... you will see a new wave of urban flight, as families with kids take their kids away from the schools and crime in the city. Probably won't be as profound as what happened in the 70's and 80's, but it will happen. On the one hand, that will help lower class sizes in the city schools at first, and allow a greater percentage of kids to go to magnets. On the other hand, the bottom drops out of the budget, as tax revenues decrease and per-head state and fed money drops as well. So the fiscal nightmare the schools system is already in, may not actually get better when the economy does.

 

Just something to think about.

 

[StrangeSox]

That is just a terrible meme.

 

Humans are not in some bucket that if we all just work together we will escape to unlimited riches and freedom. You do realize that there are costs to the other crabs escaping. And that if we all escape, there is no one left to do anything.

 

I never said anything about unlimited riches and freedom. I was talking about workplace and worker rights. If you want to get a much better understanding of what I'm riffing off of than I could ever provide (I recognize I'm not doing a great job of communicating itt), you could start here and tumble down the rabbit hole of links.

[southsider2k5]

Their summary plan talks about closing corporate loopholes to boost revenues.

 

The crab mentality refers more to workplace conditions and rights than salary; specifically, it came up in the context of "I could be fired in ten seconds without notice and no severance or ability to contest!" I think that's a terrible system and that instead of trying to make sure everyone has to work under those same conditions, it'd be better if there were stronger employment protections. Not necessarily tenure-for-everyone systems, either.

 

The "corporate loopholes" thing is a joke. It isn't going to close a billion dollar deficit. It also doesn't change wanting more from people below them.

[Y2HH]

Their summary plan talks about closing corporate loopholes to boost revenues.

 

The crab mentality refers more to workplace conditions and rights than salary; specifically, it came up in the context of "I could be fired in ten seconds without notice and no severance or ability to contest!" I think that's a terrible system and that instead of trying to make sure everyone has to work under those same conditions, it'd be better if there were stronger employment protections. Not necessarily tenure-for-everyone systems, either.

 

This is a classic example of misdirection. Closing corporate loopholes? You mean the ones they specifically grant these companies to come to their cities/states? Such as the sweetheart deal Daley gave Boeing to move into Chicago? History is replete with examples such as this...they grant added loopholes on top of the pre-existing ones in the tax code and then talk about closing them? It's deception...stop falling for it.

[G&T]

I never said anything about unlimited riches and freedom. I was talking about workplace and worker rights. If you want to get a much better understanding of what I'm riffing off of than I could ever provide (I recognize I'm not doing a great job of communicating itt), you could start here and tumble down the rabbit hole of links.

 

The problem with that article is that it is pointing out illegal employment practices as though there were no remedy.

 

You have to understand that the freedom cuts both ways. Employers can fire me at will, and I can leave at will. What if there were a requirement that upon hire, you must work for 1 year at the particular job and could not leave? That's the way it was in England and now they have moved to a simple notice requirement prior to quitting (in other words, becoming more of an American system).

 

I actually think unions are an important part of employment in this country. They set a standard for wages and labor practices that we all benefit from regardless of whether we join. As for this strike, why the hell are they allowed to strike? In New York, for example, striking for unionized public employees has been outlawed for like 40 years.

[Balta1701]

Tacking days onto the end of the school year does nothing for the kids...it's already summer and hot out, and their ability to learn dwindles during those times.

I'm pretty sure this is completely untrue. In fact it's the opposite of reality...the long summer winds up being a setback for most kids.

 

Or at least it would be if the Chicago Area schools reached the 1970's and had air conditioning.

[bmags]

Here's a prediction, and something to consider...

 

CPS student numbers have gone up more in recent years than the city population would seem to dictate, and one of the primary reasons for this is that parents who normally would have packed up the kids and moved to the burbs for better schools (or sent them to private schools), are unable to move (or afford private school) because of the economy and the housing market realities. Lower grade levels are being overwhelmed - this is part of the reason some of these kids have 35 people in their 1st grade classes. This is a pent up wave.

 

Now, with the strike going on, regardless of who parents blame (probably should blame both sides), they are angry at the school system. More pent up desire to leave the system with their kids.

 

So, when the economy finally does recover with a bit more flourish, sometime in the next few years... you will see a new wave of urban flight, as families with kids take their kids away from the schools and crime in the city. Probably won't be as profound as what happened in the 70's and 80's, but it will happen. On the one hand, that will help lower class sizes in the city schools at first, and allow a greater percentage of kids to go to magnets. On the other hand, the bottom drops out of the budget, as tax revenues decrease and per-head state and fed money drops as well. So the fiscal nightmare the schools system is already in, may not actually get better when the economy does.

 

Just something to think about.

 

I think your prediction flies in the face of every trend right now. There aren't more people in the city because people couldn't sell their house (if you can't sell your house, you can rent it to the booming rental market right now and pay your new mortgage.), there are more people in the city because more people are moving into the city. I think realistically you are going to add a nice tax base of younger people who will not be having kids or will move before they do, which will support those who do have kids in school. Once the economy recovers and even more move in, it should be fine, except we have a massive debt to the pensions which needs to get solved.

 

[bmags]

Per kids losing these early days, it is pretty s***ty for college seniors who should be talking to their guidance counselors preparing. You can't make that up at the end of the year.

[Y2HH]

I'm pretty sure this is completely untrue. In fact it's the opposite of reality...the long summer winds up being a setback for most kids.

 

Or at least it would be if the Chicago Area schools reached the 1970's and had air conditioning.

 

I recall the strike when I was in grammar school and they extended the school year...we were still in school at the end of June...it wasn't good. I remember doing/accomplishing nothing after the first week of June.

 

It's impossible to gauge, however...but I think there is more truth to it than you want to believe. But to claim it's completely untrue? Based on what? At least I'm basing it on *something*, rather than just saying it. Kids do NOT want to be in school when the sun is shining and it's warm out. You simply said it's untrue, and opposite of reality? What reality? The fake one you try to live in where there is no poverty, everyone has a job, and is rich? Wake up.

 

I'm going to just have to disagree with you...you've based your opinion on nothing.

 

Edit: And getting out on time does not make the summer any shorter/longer. They get the same amount of days off.

Edited September 12, 2012 by Y2HH

[Balta1701]

Here's a prediction, and something to consider...

 

CPS student numbers have gone up more in recent years than the city population would seem to dictate, and one of the primary reasons for this is that parents who normally would have packed up the kids and moved to the burbs for better schools (or sent them to private schools), are unable to move (or afford private school) because of the economy and the housing market realities. Lower grade levels are being overwhelmed - this is part of the reason some of these kids have 35 people in their 1st grade classes. This is a pent up wave.

 

Now, with the strike going on, regardless of who parents blame (probably should blame both sides), they are angry at the school system. More pent up desire to leave the system with their kids.

 

So, when the economy finally does recover with a bit more flourish, sometime in the next few years... you will see a new wave of urban flight, as families with kids take their kids away from the schools and crime in the city. Probably won't be as profound as what happened in the 70's and 80's, but it will happen. On the one hand, that will help lower class sizes in the city schools at first, and allow a greater percentage of kids to go to magnets. On the other hand, the bottom drops out of the budget, as tax revenues decrease and per-head state and fed money drops as well. So the fiscal nightmare the schools system is already in, may not actually get better when the economy does.

 

Just something to think about.

I can't speak to Chicago in particular, but over the last 10 years, the exact opposite has been happening nationwide (on average). Fueled mainly by Fuel prices, but also by the fact that the neighborhoods have become more liveable/walkable, the trend has been people moving back closer to cities and urban areas rather than into the suburbs where the commutes are longer and more expensive.

[bmags]

I recall the strike when I was in grammar school and they extended the school year...we were still in school at the end of June...it wasn't good. I remember doing/accomplishing nothing after the first week of June.

 

It's impossible to gauge, however...but I think there is more truth to it than you want to believe. But to claim it's completely untrue? Based on what? At least I'm basing it on *something*, rather than just saying it. Kids do NOT want to be in school when the sun is shining and it's warm out. You simply said it's untrue, and opposite of reality? What reality? The fake on you try to live in?

 

I'm going to just have to disagree with you...you've based your opinion on nothing.

 

Edit: And getting out on time does not make the summer any shorter/longer. They get the same amount of days off.

 

 

I think there's merit to this largely because of expectations. If your expectaiton is you go to school until mid-june, you wouldn't have been so adversely affected. But you expect to be out in June, so it was harder to concentrate.

[Y2HH]

I can't speak to Chicago in particular, but over the last 10 years, the exact opposite has been happening nationwide (on average). Fueled mainly by Fuel prices, but also by the fact that the neighborhoods have become more liveable/walkable, the trend has been people moving back closer to cities and urban areas rather than into the suburbs where the commutes are longer and more expensive.

 

What neighborhoods do you live in? There are *some* neighborhoods that are livable/walkable...but there are still just as many that aren't. Again, you live in a false reality and need to take a look around. Either that, or get out more. I can take you to 500 Chicago neighborhoods and drop you off for a "walk" since they're so livable/walkable...but we'd never see you again.

 

Try basing what you say on reality for a change.

[Y2HH]

I think there's merit to this largely because of expectations. If your expectaiton is you go to school until mid-june, you wouldn't have been so adversely affected. But you expect to be out in June, so it was harder to concentrate.

 

I think it has a lot more to do with the weather than anything else.

[Balta1701]

I recall the strike when I was in grammar school and they extended the school year...we were still in school at the end of June...it wasn't good. I remember doing/accomplishing nothing after the first week of June.

 

It's impossible to gauge, however...but I think there is more truth to it than you want to believe. But to claim it's completely untrue? Based on what? At least I'm basing it on *something*, rather than just saying it. Kids do NOT want to be in school when the sun is shining and it's warm out. You simply said it's untrue, and opposite of reality? What reality? The fake one you try to live in where there is no poverty, everyone has a job, and is rich? Wake up.

 

I'm going to just have to disagree with you...you've based your opinion on nothing.

 

Edit: And getting out on time does not make the summer any shorter/longer. They get the same amount of days off.

The data on how much summer hurts kids in the educational system has been piled up over a century and really couldn't be clearer.

The problem of summer vacation, first documented in 1906, compounds year after year. What starts as a hiccup in a 6-year-old's education can be a crisis by the time that child reaches high school. After collecting a century's worth of academic studies, summer-learning expert Harris Cooper, now at Duke University, concluded that, on average, all students lose about a month of progress in math skills each summer, while low-income students slip as many as three months in reading comprehension, compared with middle-income students. Another major study, by a team at Johns Hopkins University, examined more than 20 years of data meticulously tracking the progress of students from kindergarten through high school. The conclusion: while students made similar progress during the school year, regardless of economic status, the better-off kids held steady or continued to make progress during the summer, but disadvantaged students fell back. By the end of grammar school, low-income students had fallen nearly three grade levels behind, and summer was the biggest culprit. By ninth grade, summer learning loss could be blamed for roughly two-thirds of the achievement gap separating income groups.

 

Read more: http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/...l#ixzz26GVHtivT

[MurcieOne]

More great discussion on Chicago Tonight. They are focusing on the main issues of contention, evaluations and hiring.

 

This. I watched the videos last night and Chicago Tonight explains the issues better than any other outlet I've seen thus far.

[Balta1701]

What neighborhoods do you live in? There are *some* neighborhoods that are livable/walkable...but there are still just as many that aren't. Again, you live in a false reality and need to take a look around. Either that, or get out more. I can take you to 500 Chicago neighborhoods and drop you off for a "walk" since they're so livable/walkable...but we'd never see you again.

 

Try basing what you say on reality for a change.

The trend has really been unmistakable in terms of developing more walkable neighborhoods in response to demand. This really isn't hard. Price of fuel goes up, demand for urban areas where fuel isnt' a concern goes up, and over time neighborhoods evolve in response.

[bmags]

What neighborhoods do you live in? There are *some* neighborhoods that are livable/walkable...but there are still just as many that aren't. Again, you live in a false reality and need to take a look around. Either that, or get out more. I can take you to 500 Chicago neighborhoods and drop you off for a "walk" since they're so livable/walkable...but we'd never see you again.

 

Try basing what you say on reality for a change.

 

Spend a day in Oswego, or Oak Brook, and then tell me what's walkable. You have to drive from one store to the store across the street because you will be crossing an 8 lane street of insanity where cars aren't used to seeing pedestrians. You drive from one store to another in the same parking lot.

[Y2HH]

The data on how much summer hurts kids in the educational system has been piled up over a century and really couldn't be clearer.

 

I'm not saying added school is bad, but warmer weather WILL affect American students when they've grown up with guaranteed vacation days all summer long. If you started new kids from K-onward with a full school year, they'd probably adapt better to this than current students. This has nothing to do with my point that American students will tend to concentrate less as their extended vacation looms closer.

 

Also, since the teachers contract guarantees these vacations...try taking them away now. Hell, Rham tried to extend their school day by 1 hour and they flipped out and wanted huge raises. Try going to them and saying there will be no more summer vacation.

 

LOL.

 

Again, based on reality...their contracts, their unions...you can't just ignore these factors...which is what you're doing here.

[Y2HH]

Spend a day in Oswego, or Oak Brook, and then tell me what's walkable. You have to drive from one store to the store across the street because you will be crossing an 8 lane street of insanity where cars aren't used to seeing pedestrians. You drive from one store to another in the same parking lot.

 

There are two sides to that, places like that where walking is impossible...and places where walking is dangerous. In either case, I can go to any big city and show you places that are the exact opposite of what he claimed.

[StrangeSox]

The data on how much summer hurts kids in the educational system has been piled up over a century and really couldn't be clearer.

 

FWIW some of CPS has moved to "year-round" school years that have shorter summer breaks.