LittleHurt05 Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 QUOTE (flavum @ Nov 14, 2012 -> 09:17 PM) I think Trout deserves it, but Cabrera will win it and it won't be that close. The Triple Crown will clinch it for too many voters, and I think to an extent, a lot of voters will rationalize it by thinking, "Trout is so good that he'll probably win it some other year where he's played a full season on a playoff team in a year where there wasn't a Triple Crown." If there are 28 voters, I'm predicting 18-10 in favor of Cabrera. Well said, my thoughts as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 Trout, because well, he's just more valuable. Much better fielder in a much more important position and produces way more runs on the bases than Miggy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 (edited) A lot of anti Tiger bias here. Triple Crown winner, played in every game but one, I give it to Cabrera because of the Triple Crown. That is so tough to do these days. Edited November 15, 2012 by kitekrazy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 QUOTE (kitekrazy @ Nov 15, 2012 -> 01:00 PM) A lot of anti Tiger bias here. Triple Crown winner, played in every game but one, I give it to Cabrera because of the Triple Crown. That is so tough to do these days. Just for the record, my Trout pick has nothing to do with "anti-Tiger" bias. Not one bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 QUOTE (flavum @ Nov 15, 2012 -> 01:15 PM) Just for the record, my Trout pick has nothing to do with "anti-Tiger" bias. Not one bit. I picked Cabrera and I f***ing hate the Tigers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiliIrishHammock24 Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 QUOTE (flavum @ Nov 15, 2012 -> 02:15 PM) Just for the record, my Trout pick has nothing to do with "anti-Tiger" bias. Not one bit. Same here, because I think Verlander should have been Cy Young. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iwritecode Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 QUOTE (kitekrazy @ Nov 15, 2012 -> 01:00 PM) A lot of anti Tiger bias here. Triple Crown winner, played in every game but one, I give it to Cabrera because of the Triple Crown. That is so tough to do these days. Triple crown = best hitter. The award is for the most valuable player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swingandalongonetoleft Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 It's unfortunate for Trout that he had the year he did, when he did. He'll have to make do with ROY- not too shabby by any means. He'll have plenty of time to work on an MVP in a year that Cabrera doesn't scare the piss out of anyone who has ever pitched a baseball (including ceremonial first pitch). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 It's Miguel Cabrera. You reach a level of excellence at which the numbers simply don't tell the entire story. Miguel Cabrera was an absolutely fearsome player that changed the way everyone on the field approached the game. Trout had a great year, but compared to Miguel Cabrera I don't think he was feared at all. As a matter of fact, I don't think he was the most feared hitter in his lineup. Cabrera was so good that he'd burn you when you tried to walk him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiliIrishHammock24 Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 The overvaluing of Triple Crown is really hard to believe. It's just a set of 3 arbitrary stats that someone decided upon decades ago. It doesn't even account for 3 different set of skills. AVG/HR/SB or OBP/HR/SB would have been a better representation of a complete hitter. Contact/Power/Speed or OnBase/Power/Speed. RBI is too largely dependent on teammates, and they go to closely with HR, IMO. Oh, and, of course the whole DEFENSIVE thing too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiliIrishHammock24 Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 QUOTE (Jake @ Nov 15, 2012 -> 04:32 PM) It's Miguel Cabrera. You reach a level of excellence at which the numbers simply don't tell the entire story. Miguel Cabrera was an absolutely fearsome player that changed the way everyone on the field approached the game. Trout had a great year, but compared to Miguel Cabrera I don't think he was feared at all. As a matter of fact, I don't think he was the most feared hitter in his lineup. Cabrera was so good that he'd burn you when you tried to walk him. You think anyone on the other side of the field was saying "s***, I hope I don't hit the ball down to 3B, Cabrera is a vacuum down there." No. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 QUOTE (JoeCoolMan24 @ Nov 15, 2012 -> 03:46 PM) The overvaluing of Triple Crown is really hard to believe. It's just a set of 3 arbitrary stats that someone decided upon decades ago. It doesn't even account for 3 different set of skills. AVG/HR/SB or OBP/HR/SB would have been a better representation of a complete hitter. Contact/Power/Speed or OnBase/Power/Speed. RBI is too largely dependent on teammates, and they go to closely with HR, IMO. Oh, and, of course the whole DEFENSIVE thing too. +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 Nate Silver makes the stats case for Trout http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/2...ADCFC814371494F Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swingandalongonetoleft Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 QUOTE (JoeCoolMan24 @ Nov 15, 2012 -> 03:46 PM) Oh, and, of course the whole DEFENSIVE thing too. Cabrera was serviceable at 3B. Coming down the stretch run of the season (30 games) while Detroit was in the process of overtaking the AL Central lead, he had 1 error. You always heard people whining about how the opposition should just bunt towards 3B, yet it never happened. It shouldn't be lost on anyone that he was willing to slide over to 3B in order to accommodate Fielder at 1B. That was a pretty valuable thing to do in itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 QUOTE (Swingandalongonetoleft @ Nov 15, 2012 -> 04:27 PM) Cabrera was serviceable at 3B. Coming down the stretch run of the season (30 games) while Detroit was in the process of overtaking the AL Central lead, he had 1 error. You always heard people whining about how the opposition should just bunt towards 3B, yet it never happened. It shouldn't be lost on anyone that he was willing to slide over to 3B in order to accommodate Fielder at 1B. That was a pretty valuable thing to do in itself. I still don't understand why that's such a big deal. It was a position he had played before, and it's not like he switched to catcher. If he wasn't capable of playing it, they wouldn't have asked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjshoe04 Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 M Cab. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 He was terrible defensively, costing the Tigers an entire win because of his defense. He can get away with it because he's so good offensively (worth 67.9 runs above replacement this year, even with the -10 UZR he cost on defense). You can't use the "not bad" defense against Miguel Cabrera though, because he was the worst defensive 3Bman in the game this year. He might not be bad (or even good) compared to me, but compared to his peers, he was terrible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted November 15, 2012 Author Share Posted November 15, 2012 QUOTE (Swingandalongonetoleft @ Nov 15, 2012 -> 04:27 PM) Cabrera was serviceable at 3B. Coming down the stretch run of the season (30 games) while Detroit was in the process of overtaking the AL Central lead, he had 1 error. You always heard people whining about how the opposition should just bunt towards 3B, yet it never happened. It shouldn't be lost on anyone that he was willing to slide over to 3B in order to accommodate Fielder at 1B. That was a pretty valuable thing to do in itself. Cabrera was a bad 1B. The reason he switched to 1B was because he was awful at 3B. And he was awful at 3B this year. He also played the position with one leg for like two weeks. Remember when KW got pissed that Robin didn't bunt at Cabrera more? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted November 15, 2012 Author Share Posted November 15, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (Jake @ Nov 15, 2012 -> 03:32 PM) It's Miguel Cabrera. You reach a level of excellence at which the numbers simply don't tell the entire story. Miguel Cabrera was an absolutely fearsome player that changed the way everyone on the field approached the game. Trout had a great year, but compared to Miguel Cabrera I don't think he was feared at all. As a matter of fact, I don't think he was the most feared hitter in his lineup. Cabrera was so good that he'd burn you when you tried to walk him. Everybody sure feared Albert Pujols when he was hitting .170 for the first two months of the year. Keep this in mind: if Trout doesn't come up in late April and give the Angels a spark, that team might not have finished above .500. Mike Trout turned their season around. Edited November 15, 2012 by chw42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 They made the right choice. Butthurt White Sox fans be damned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 QUOTE (chw42 @ Nov 15, 2012 -> 05:29 PM) Everybody sure feared Albert Pujols when he was hitting .170 for the first two months of the year. Keep this in mind: if Trout doesn't come up in late April and give the Angels a spark, that team might not have finished above .500. Mike Trout turned their season around. And if Cabrera isn't on the Tigers, they probably finish 3rd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted November 15, 2012 Author Share Posted November 15, 2012 QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Nov 15, 2012 -> 05:46 PM) They made the right choice. Butthurt White Sox fans be damned. I think the majority of people here who thought Trout should win didn't base it around their hatred of Miguel Cabrera. Now I'm just wondering how close it was... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted November 15, 2012 Author Share Posted November 15, 2012 (edited) Wow...Trout with only 6 first place votes. BBWAA is still stuck in 2003. And somebody put Trout THIRD. Some writers don't deserve the right to vote. Edited November 15, 2012 by chw42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted November 15, 2012 Author Share Posted November 15, 2012 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 15, 2012 -> 05:48 PM) And if Cabrera isn't on the Tigers, they probably finish 3rd. Behind the Indians? Really? Without Cabrera, they probably finish 2nd. But without Trout, the Angels probably finish with something like 78-79 wins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 QUOTE (chw42 @ Nov 15, 2012 -> 05:54 PM) Behind the Indians? Really? Without Cabrera, they probably finish 2nd. But without Trout, the Angels probably finish with something like 78-79 wins. That is right about where the Tigers would have finished too. Looking at the standings I didn't realize 3rd place fell off that far, but the point remains that the Tigers don't win s*** without Miguel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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