The Debates!

[Soxbadger]

Maybe the saddest part is that some people actually think any of this dog and pony show matters when it comes to the economy.

 

Obama is going to screw people for his rich friends. Romney is going to screw people for his rich friends. You dont raise $1bil without having to pay back a lot of favors.

 

That being said, the areas that do matter, social, most people are not going to change their mind.

[mr_genius]

the moderator, the altitude, global warming, and even that Obama lost on purpose to make better commercials

 

All of which were Bush's fault

[StrangeSox]

<!--quoteo(post=2715404:date=Oct 12, 2012 -> 10:25 AM:name=bmags)-->

<!--quotec-->Sure you did.

 

 

Because he did.

 

 

 

Is there a difference between Al Gore saying one dumb thing and the reaction of the entire media as BS was talking about? It was overwhelmingly and quickly accepted that Obama performed poorly and was disengaged or uninspired or whatever other adjective you want to toss out there.

[southsider2k5]

Sure you did.

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-22...rack-Obama.html

 

Presidential debate moderator Jim Lehrer was today savaged for his handling of the first TV debate and was accused of letting himself be too easily rolled over by the rival candidates.

 

Throughout the 90-minute clash between Mitt Romney and Barack Obama, the PBS veteran seemed to adopt a passive role, neglecting to challenge facts and failing to ask detailed questions.

 

At times, the 78-year-old, who has now moderated 12 presidential debates since 1988 lost control of the the candidates to such a degree that an entire 15-minute pre-agreed segment had to be dropped after the time allotted expired.

 

Commentators have singled out how Mitt Romney took advantage of Lehrer's passivity when at one point the Republican simply said 'No' to the veteran newsman's efforts to interrupt, saying, 'I have to respond.'

 

Both candidates also clashed with the veteran Mr Lehrer, who had the control of an NFL replacement ref as they happily ignored the time limits and frequently went off-topic.

 

Obama supporters pounced on the moderator's weak handling of the debate to try to excuse the President's own lackluster performance.

 

The left accused Mr Lehrer of allowing Romney to speak and cut off the president more often, but when the debate was over, Obama had spoken for four minutes longer than Romney.

 

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/...te-performance/

 

The most intriguing concept came from former Vice President Al Gore. Speaking on his Current TV, the 2000 Democratic presidential nominee asked his audience to consider the geography.

 

“I’m going to say something controversial here,” Gore began. “Obama arrived in Denver at 2 p.m. today – just a few hours before the debate started. Romney did his debate prep in Denver. When you go to 5,000 feet, and you only have a few hours to adjust – I don’t know…”

 

so i've been hearing more mumbling and grumbling that Obama's PLAN was to shut up and let Romney talk so they could put out the new commercials having him contradict himself. Because that's EXACTLY what he did last night. He said the opposite of all the things he's been saying on the trail for months. And now Obama has the proof.

 

Betcha Bam bounces back next time.

 

I even forgot about all of the "Its John Kerry's fault" stuff.

 

[Jenksismyhero]

btw I don't think that's completely accurate. link?

 

http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/posts/20...nghazi_security

 

And your line about Dems/Repubs looking different is bulls***. Biden could have been aggressive but respectful and it would have been fine. Instead he was smirking, smiling, laughing, throwing his hands in the air, i.e. being an asshole. This is a near universal criticism of his performance last night.

[southsider2k5]

All of which were Bush's fault

 

Very true.

[StrangeSox]

http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/posts/20...nghazi_security

 

And your line about Dems/Repubs looking different is bulls***. Biden could have been aggressive but respectful and it would have been fine. Instead he was smirking, smiling, laughing, throwing his hands in the air, i.e. being an asshole. This is a near universal criticism of his performance last night.

 

There is no reason to be respectful of someone who is lying to your face. As I said with that Australian PM video I posted yesterday, we need less of this fake decorum bulls***, not more.

[Soxbadger]

All of which were Bush's fault

 

Instead of arguing about who may be at fault, why dont we talk about solutions. Whether or not global warming is real or a myth, cant we all agree that it would make sense from a risk standpoint to do our best to take preventive measures regardless?

 

Why does it always have to be arguing about who did what or who is to blame. I dont believe that has ever solved a problem, unless the problem was figuring out who was to blame.

[Jenksismyhero]

There is no reason to be respectful of someone who is lying to your face. As I said with that Australian PM video I posted yesterday, we need less of this fake decorum bulls***, not more.

 

I love how thisis only the case when it's a democat being the asshole. Bush bringing his "texas gunslinger" style = terrible. Biden being a condescending, disrespectful career politician = no more fake decorum bulls***!

[Y2HH]

Instead of arguing about who may be at fault, why dont we talk about solutions. Whether or not global warming is real or a myth, cant we all agree that it would make sense from a risk standpoint to do our best to take preventive measures regardless?

 

Why does it always have to be arguing about who did what or who is to blame. I dont believe that has ever solved a problem, unless the problem was figuring out who was to blame.

 

I think in many ways, we already are. Pretty much everything we do is more efficient and cleaner than it's ever been before, but we aren't even making a dent. This is a simplified solution (discussion) to a complex problem...this isn't a USA issue, it's a world issue. And unless until you can get EVERYONE on board, it doesn't matter if you cut emissions and North Korea cranks out 50x more, nullifying advances we would make. Everyone has to do this together.

[Jenksismyhero]

And really, even if the pomp and circumstance is bulls***, it's still not a smart thing to do because the majority of the country votes on who they like more, not what they actually stand for. So it was dumb of Biden to act like that, and it's being shown in the debate polls that he wasn't very relate-able/like-able.

[StrangeSox]

I love how thisis only the case when it's a democat being the asshole. Bush bringing his "texas gunslinger" style = terrible. Biden being a condescending, disrespectful career politician = no more fake decorum bulls***!

 

Bush's style was dumb and funny but I don't care if it was "rude" to Kerry or not

[StrangeSox]

And really, even if the pomp and circumstance is bulls***, it's still not a smart thing to do because the majority of the country votes on who they like more, not what they actually stand for. So it was dumb of Biden to act like that, and it's being shown in the debate polls that he wasn't very relate-able/like-able.

 

Opinions on that differ:

 

http://themonkeycage.org/blog/2012/10/12/t...who-watched-it/

 

All throughout last night’s debate, I read a zillion tweets wondering how the exchange between Biden and Ryan, deemed “aggressive quarreling” on the front page of my New York Times this morning, would “play” with undecided voters or “Middle America” or whatever. One notion was that ordinary voters would get turned off by the combat and go watch baseball.

 

Here’s some breaking news: the kind of people who choose to watch a vice-presidential debate instead of baseball or football or a cooking show are not sensitive souls who curl up into a ball at the first sign of disagreement between politicians. People who choose to watch political conflict can deal with it. Those who can’t—or just aren’t interested in the first place—are watching something else. Research by political scientists Kevin Arceneaux and Martin Johnson shows this.

 

I also found it a bit rich that media commentators wondered how the debate would “play” with voters. The answer to that question, of course, is how it “played” with the news media. The media supplies the interpretation of events like debates, and that helps shape how voters understand them too.

 

The media drives how the debates are seen in retrospect pretty significantly. The most notable case of this was one of the Bush-Gore debates where Gore had a comfortable win in the immediate post-debate polls, but after the media obsessed on his mannerisms (the sigh) for days, well, it turns out people thought Bush did better.

Edited October 12, 2012 by StrangeSox

[Soxbadger]

I think in many ways, we already are. Pretty much everything we do is more efficient and cleaner than it's ever been before, but we aren't even making a dent. This is a simplified solution (discussion) to a complex problem...this isn't a USA issue, it's a world issue. And unless until you can get EVERYONE on board, it doesn't matter if you cut emissions and North Korea cranks out 50x more, nullifying advances we would make. Everyone has to do this together.

 

It doesnt matter that the US isnt making a dent today, you dont give up just because you cant immediately fix a problem. And I completely understand that if everyone else is polluting that the US changing wont really mean much, but that isnt the point. The point is that before I can fix the problems of the world, I need to fix the problems in my little plot of land. And if I cant even get agreement on a simple issue such as "we shouldnt destroy our own plot of land", how can I convince the world they shouldnt destroy their plot of land.

 

Just more blame game.

Edited October 12, 2012 by Soxbadger

[Jenksismyhero]

More fuel!

 

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/raddat...rch_654296.html

 

Raddatz Visited Biden at His Residence in March

 

 

White House records reveal that the moderator of last night's vice presidential debate, Martha Raddatz, visited Vice President Joe Biden at his official residence on March 26, 2012. Raddatz is an employee of ABC News.

 

 

As the records show, that day Raddatz visited the VPR (or, the vice president's residence) for a "Women's History Month Reception." That record was released on June 29, 2012.

 

According to Biden's schedule released the day before the event, "the Vice President and Dr. Jill Biden will host a reception in honor of Women’s History Month at the Naval Observatory."

 

There appears to be no pool report from the event, which presumably was widely attended, that might have recorded the details from the events.

 

On at least one other occasion, Raddatz visited the White House. According to records, that visit was on December 18, 2009. The reason for that visit is not know, though her meeting appears to have taken place in the Old Executive Office Building, and not the West Wing.

 

Before last night's debate, Raddatz came under scrutiny after the Daily Caller revealed she had attended President Barack Obama's wedding in 1991 with her now ex-husband, Obama administration official Julius Genachowski.

[Soxbadger]

And really, even if the pomp and circumstance is bulls***, it's still not a smart thing to do because the majority of the country votes on who they like more, not what they actually stand for. So it was dumb of Biden to act like that, and it's being shown in the debate polls that he wasn't very relate-able/like-able.

 

I think people like heart over head in a debate, which is why Romney/Biden looked better than Obama/Ryan. But passion is a tricky b****.

[Y2HH]

It doesnt matter that the US isnt making a dent today, you dont give up just because you cant immediately fix a problem. And I completely understand that if everyone else is polluting that the US changing wont really mean much, but that isnt the point. The point is that before I can fix the problems of the world, I need to fix the problems in my little plot of land. And if I cant even get agreement on a simple issue such as "we shouldnt destroy the our own plot of land", how can I convince the world they shouldnt destroy their plot of land.

 

Just more blame game.

 

I agree on that, but the solution is very complex. We don't have any money to be throwing at the wall "hoping" it helps, but things that we know will help we should do IF we can do it, much less even afford to do it.

 

This is what happens when you spend all of your money...when you find yourself needing money in an emergency, and I'd call this a potential emergency, you don't have it. We don't have it. Whether it be because of wars, or healthcare, or whatever have you, we don't have it. This is what happens when governments spend during bad times (which they should), and then continue spending during good times (which they shouldn't). Now, when we need resources for a worthy cause...they aren't there. And what will the people do? Elect the same government royalty that got here us.

Edited October 12, 2012 by Y2HH

[Soxbadger]

More fuel!

 

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/raddat...rch_654296.html

 

So what youre saying is that the Republican party is so negligent that they didnt even vet the moderator, and this is the party you want in power?

 

Anything can be spun into gold.

[BigSqwert]

More fuel!

 

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/raddat...rch_654296.html

 

 

"The reason my guy gave terrible, vague answers to straight-forward questions is because the moderator attended some sort of Women's Appreciation clinic at the Biden residence!"

 

 

[StrangeSox]

More fuel!

 

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/raddat...rch_654296.html

 

A foreign policy journalist attended functions at the White House and the VP's house! BIAS!

[mr_genius]

So what youre saying is that the Republican party is so negligent that they didnt even vet the moderator

 

it really is a problem in the GOP. they walk blindly into these situations where they have been completely set up. they need to be more aware. the moderator of the last debate was unacceptable and should have been replaced.

[iamshack]

And, by the way, they talk about this Great Recession if it fell

out of the sky, like, "Oh, my goodness, where did it come from?" It

came from this man voting to put two wars on a credit card, to at the

same time put a prescription drug benefit on the credit card, a

trillion-dollar tax cut for the very wealthy. I was there. I voted

against them. I said, no, we can't afford that.

 

And now, all of a sudden, these guys are so seized with the

concern about the debt that they created.

 

Thank you, Biden...this is exactly the sort of thing that Joe can say that is more difficult for Barack....and what needed to be said.

[StrangeSox]

Thank you, Biden...this is exactly the sort of thing that Joe can say that is more difficult for Barack....and what needed to be said.

 

Biden performed a role similar to what Clinton did at the convention.

[Y2HH]

Thank you, Biden...this is exactly the sort of thing that Joe can say that is more difficult for Barack....and what needed to be said.

 

The problem with that is Obama continued those same policies, wars, extended the Bush tax cuts, added more tax cuts on top of them, and...well...there we have it.

[StrangeSox]

Obama did not continue the Iraq war.