2012-2013 Sox off season Catch-All thread

[southsider2k5]

I'm not buying the Sox, in need of some help on offense, and maybe the bullpen are going to be trying to sign McCarthy. Sure, they could sign him and move Floyd, but I think Floyd is going to be moved anyways.

 

Unless they get some awesome deal, I don't get it.

[cabiness42]

Unless they get some awesome deal, I don't get it.

 

The Sox don't get anything in return for not getting Brandon McCarthy, but if they sign McCarthy they can get something in return for trading Gavin Floyd. Plus, you can probably get McCarthy on a 1-2 year deal with an option, so you have him longer than 2013 whereas Gavin is a free agent after 2013. This is all assuming that the price and performance of McCarthy are both comparable to Floyd. In addition, signing McCarthy takes him away from another team which adds another suitor for Floyd.

 

[southsider2k5]

The Sox don't get anything in return for not getting Brandon McCarthy, but if they sign McCarthy they can get something in return for trading Gavin Floyd. Plus, you can probably get McCarthy on a 1-2 year deal with an option, so you have him longer than 2013 whereas Gavin is a free agent after 2013. This is all assuming that the price and performance of McCarthy are both comparable to Floyd. In addition, signing McCarthy takes him away from another team which adds another suitor for Floyd.

 

The White Sox have pitching in their system already. Brandon McCarty is everything the Sox don't buy into in pitching. He is an extreme injury risk, only throwing over 110 innings ONCE since leaving Chicago, which was only 170 IP. His road ERA is 0.90 runs higher away from home. McCarthy would be leaving the extreme pitchers park of Oakland for the extreme hitters park of Chicago, which would probably make that differential even higher, especially when you factor in his extreme flyball nature.

 

There is no way you can assume his performance will be near Floyd, because odds are he will pitch around half the innings of Gavin. You are probably getting half a season of Bmac and half of a season of Axelrod.

 

I get the trading Floyd for a 3B part, I don't get the McCarthy to the Sox part. While I am one of Brandon's biggest fans for a long time now, I don't see him as a fit here.

[cabiness42]

The White Sox have pitching in their system already. Brandon McCarty is everything the Sox don't buy into in pitching. He is an extreme injury risk, only throwing over 110 innings ONCE since leaving Chicago, which was only 170 IP. His road ERA is 0.90 runs higher away from home. McCarthy would be leaving the extreme pitchers park of Oakland for the extreme hitters park of Chicago, which would probably make that differential even higher, especially when you factor in his extreme flyball nature.

 

There is no way you can assume his performance will be near Floyd, because odds are he will pitch around half the innings of Gavin. You are probably getting half a season of Bmac and half of a season of Axelrod.

 

I get the trading Floyd for a 3B part, I don't get the McCarthy to the Sox part. While I am one of Brandon's biggest fans for a long time now, I don't see him as a fit here.

 

I'm actually with you on that one, I was just trying to explain the logic in the move. Maybe if you can get him for 1-year $6M with an option you take that chance, but not for any more than that. It really depends on how good of a deal for Floyd there is out there and what other pitcher options there are. I don't really like the idea of having to rely on BOTH Quintana and Santiago and would rather see the two of them competing for the #5 spot with the other going to AAA as insurance.

[southsider2k5]

I'm actually with you on that one, I was just trying to explain the logic in the move. Maybe if you can get him for 1-year $6M with an option you take that chance, but not for any more than that. It really depends on how good of a deal for Floyd there is out there and what other pitcher options there are. I don't really like the idea of having to rely on BOTH Quintana and Santiago and would rather see the two of them competing for the #5 spot with the other going to AAA as insurance.

 

In terms of what is best for the team, I would rather see the Sox bring back Myers as a starter, versus McCarthy. In terms of people, sure I would take back Brandon is a heartbeat. McCarthy is one of my favorite players ever, but he just wouldn't be a good fit here.

[CyAcosta41]

The White Sox have pitching in their system already. Brandon McCarty is everything the Sox don't buy into in pitching. He is an extreme injury risk, only throwing over 110 innings ONCE since leaving Chicago, which was only 170 IP. His road ERA is 0.90 runs higher away from home. McCarthy would be leaving the extreme pitchers park of Oakland for the extreme hitters park of Chicago, which would probably make that differential even higher, especially when you factor in his extreme flyball nature.

 

There is no way you can assume his performance will be near Floyd, because odds are he will pitch around half the innings of Gavin. You are probably getting half a season of Bmac and half of a season of Axelrod.

 

I get the trading Floyd for a 3B part, I don't get the McCarthy to the Sox part. While I am one of Brandon's biggest fans for a long time now, I don't see him as a fit here.

 

 

I think McCarthy is an intriguing possible acquisition. IF the Sox could get him at a price commensurate with his many risk factors, then I'd be in favor of it. Who really knows how he feels about the organization these days, anyway. It seems that he's had a bit of a chip-on-his-shoulder about the Sox since departing for Danks, but I'm guessing much of that was actually having a problem with Guillen (who would have thunk THAT? problems with Ozzie Guillen???). He supposedly has a strong professional and personal relationship with a certain Rick Hahn ... who just happens to be our current GM. Hmmm?

 

southsider2k5, agree with much of what you say about Brandon, but not what I highlighted above -- the present incarnation of Brandon McCarthy is NOT an extreme flyball pitcher and, in fact, is now somewhat of a control-freak, groundball pitcher. Pitchers can and do change. Especially when they learn a new pitch, grip, approach, or, most importantly, realize they must change or perish. Gone are the days when McCarthy was essentially an over-the-top pitching machine, with a middling fastball (at best). He had a pretty widely publicized epiphany and completely revamped his approach. Yes ... one always has to take into account ballpark factors when looking at guys from Oakland, San Diego, and certain other parks. But, in projecting McCarthy going forward, I think the last couple of years -- especially control, GB%, and HR % -- show a completely different pitcher than we saw Round I here in Chicago, or during his stint in Texas.

 

For any who didn't see it before, I think the linked article is very interesting (not to mention, particularly insightful for ESPN):

http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/7602264/...s-espn-magazine

 

Brandon IS a risk for many reasons, health and durability being paramount. But, I'm not at all concerned about his "fit" at the Cell. If anything, he's keenly aware that he must stick with his new approach to avoid the problems he had on his first go-around. If the price is right, I'd do it (knowing that we have some reasonable depth if he gets hurt). And then trade Gavin plus something else for a legit third-sacker!

 

 

[southsider2k5]

I had no idea how much his groundballs had increased over the years.

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

Best part of the article posted above.....

 

"I don't suck anymore," he says.

[CyAcosta41]

I had no idea how much his groundballs had increased over the years.

 

Great article, wasn't it? He's a totally different pitcher. Maybe it's just me, but it's difficult to read that article and not root for the guy, and not want him as one of your own (especially when he originally was).

 

And, neither here nor there, but his wife Amanda is a complete babe. But not Central Casting Bimbo Baseball Wife, she's a real looker who's also smart, witty, and (seemingly) pretty grounded.

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

Great article, wasn't it? He's a totally different pitcher. Maybe it's just me, but it's difficult to read that article and not root for the guy, and not want him as one of your own (especially when he originally was).

 

And, neither here nor there, but his wife Amanda is a complete babe. But not Central Casting Bimbo Baseball Wife, she's a real looker who's also smart, witty, and (seemingly) pretty grounded.

 

And obviously knows how to take a joke, since Brandon likes to rip on her (literally, he says he farts on her pillows after their fight).

[southsider2k5]

Great article, wasn't it? He's a totally different pitcher. Maybe it's just me, but it's difficult to read that article and not root for the guy, and not want him as one of your own (especially when he originally was).

 

And, neither here nor there, but his wife Amanda is a complete babe. But not Central Casting Bimbo Baseball Wife, she's a real looker who's also smart, witty, and (seemingly) pretty grounded.

 

I've been a fan of Brandon's since he and his Dad both used to post here before he ever got to the majors. Brandon is a great guy. I am always rooting for him.

[Dick Allen]

Jim "Bulls" Durham, former voice of the Bulls, and perhaps the greatest basketball PBP guy I have ever heard, also a former voice of the White Sox for a couple years in the late '80s, dead at 65. RIP.

[fathom]

I loved when Durham used to say "book it"

[southsider2k5]

Jon Morosi ‏@jonmorosi

 

The more I think about it, #WhiteSox in strong position as offseason begins. Figure out C and 3B, maybe add an arm. Good team.

[iamshack]

Jon Morosi ‏@jonmorosi

 

The more I think about it, #WhiteSox in strong position as offseason begins. Figure out C and 3B, maybe add an arm. Good team.

Wow...I wish I could agree with him...

[2nd_city_saint787]

Wow...I wish I could agree with him...

 

Why not?

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

Wow...I wish I could agree with him...

 

I agree with him, really. 3B is really our only gaping hole. Yeah, Flowers is a question mark, but every team can afford 1-2 below average players (Flowers, Beckham). If we can get a stud 3B, and just because we are all smoking the same thing, let's say Headley....

 

1) CF De Aza

2) SS Ramirez

3) RF Rios

4) 3B Headley

5) 1B Konerko

6) DH Dunn

7) LF Viciedo

8) C Flowers

9) 2B Beckham

 

Sale-Peavy-Danks-Quintana-Santiago/Axelrod/Castro

 

That's a really solid team.

[iamshack]

I just feel like we sort of blew our load last year and came up short. Almost everything we needed to happen did happen...and it still wasn't enough...I just don't know that everything is going to fall into place like it did for us last season...

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

I just feel like we sort of blew our load last year and came up short. Almost everything we needed to happen did happen...and it still wasn't enough...I just don't know that everything is going to fall into place like it did for us last season...

 

Huh? No one including us here on this site expected us to compete with Detroit. The fact that we did was all a bonus. I don't see how we are any worse off in 2013 than we were going in to 2012, in fact, I'd say we are better off because now Sale has the experience of a full year, Quintana emerged, our bullpen full of rookies got a year of experience in. I feel better going in to 2013 than I did last year, and that's what was expected.

[iamshack]

Huh? No one including us here on this site expected us to compete with Detroit. The fact that we did was all a bonus. I don't see how we are any worse off in 2013 than we were going in to 2012, in fact, I'd say we are better off because now Sale has the experience of a full year, Quintana emerged, our bullpen full of rookies got a year of experience in. I feel better going in to 2013 than I did last year, and that's what was expected.

Well I expected us to compete and expected many of the turnarounds...the fact that it wasn't enough, coupled with the Tigers relatively mediocre performance in the regular season is somewhat frightening to me.

 

I certainly hope that we can get the same kind of performances we did out of key components like we did last season, but I don't know that you can expect it.

 

The question is not how did or does everyone "feel" about the White Sox going into the season. It is absolutely irrelevant what the performance of the team is compared to expectations by the mass media or fanbase. What is relevant is what is the talent level of the team, the performances we can get out of players at this stage of their careers, the resources available (including $ and players to move), etc., as opposed to our likely competition.

 

I certainly hope I am wrong, but I fear the 2013 season may end up being the one many fans expected they would get in 2012.

[2nd_city_saint787]

Well I expected us to compete and expected many of the turnarounds...the fact that it wasn't enough, coupled with the Tigers relatively mediocre performance in the regular season is somewhat frightening to me.

 

I certainly hope that we can get the same kind of performances we did out of key components like we did last season, but I don't know that you can expect it.

 

The question is not how did or does everyone "feel" about the White Sox going into the season. It is absolutely irrelevant what the performance of the team is compared to expectations by the mass media or fanbase. What is relevant is what is the talent level of the team, the performances we can get out of players at this stage of their careers, the resources available (including $ and players to move), etc., as opposed to our likely competition.

 

I certainly hope I am wrong, but I fear the 2013 season may end up being the one many fans expected they would get in 2012.

 

 

I believe, like last year, and really the year before too, this teams success will be measured by the success of Adam Dunn and Paul Konerko. If they're healthy and mashing the team will compete.

 

If Rios stays consistent, Dayan takes a step another step forward, and they add a solid 3B they should be able to compete with that offense.

[DukeNukeEm]

People are really underestimating the loss of AJ. You're taking a .280 hitter with 27 dingers out of the lineup, where the hell are we going to get that production from?

[Jake]

I think as fans that follow the team so closely, it is far easier for us to imagine the many bad ways for the next season to go. It's less objective and of course we don't look at others teams closely enough to see the cracks in their armor (real or imagined)

[2nd_city_saint787]

People are really underestimating the loss of AJ. You're taking a .280 hitter with 27 dingers out of the lineup, where the hell are we going to get that production from?

 

Hopefully from the 3B position.

 

I also somewhat expect AJ to be back unless the Sox can grab a LH 3B. I can't imagine they go into the season with De Aza and Dunn as the only LH hitters. In a perfect world they get AJ and a LH 3B to really balance out that lineup.

Edited November 6, 2012 by 2nd_city_saint787

[southsider2k5]

SSS with a great study on the Sox 1st round draft pick history. Trivia question from it... Sale and Beckham are the leaders from the Sox last 21 1st round picks with WARs of 9.0 and 3.5 respectively... The question is, who is third? Link if you have to peak.

 

http://www.southsidesox.com/2012/11/6/3608...s-in-the-making