**2012 Election Day thread**

[pettie4sox]

It's so disappointing to see some of the posts on Facebook and the like after the election. And as some of you have mentioned about those saying they are goijng to move to Canada or Europe...they just don't get it.

 

There were many I know whose position was "anyone but Obama". So to them it didn't matter who the GOP rolled up there, that's who was going to get their vote. That's the problem with the two party system. For so many voters it didn't matter what Obama was promising or what Romney said he's do different. It was Democrat and Republican. Obama or the other guy.

 

I've taken those tests online that ask a bunch of questions to see where you are in regards to political alliance. For the most part I end up leaning towards Democrat, but there are things that I believe that are opposite the Democratic way. If there wasn't a two party system, we as voters would probably pay a lot more attention to what the candidates believe in and say they will do.

 

Obviously the party system will never go away, but it's a shame that so many voters are uninformed and for the most part don't want to be informed.

 

YES! I think most Americans are probably very similar but allow themselves to get caught up with the partisan politics.

 

You don't owe a particular party any allegiance! If anything, they owe you to gather your vote. I'll be an independent until the day I take a dirt nap.

[Reddy]

Is Chris Christie still highly thought of in the GOP as a candidate for 2016? I wonder how much damage was done when he praised the President. It's a shame that even in a time of crisis politics still rule.

 

I have no doubt in my mind that if Christie runs in 2016, he will be very, very tough to beat. I watched him handling the hurricane, and he's all sorts of presidential. if he loses 100 pounds...

[GoSox05]

Oh the irony!

 

As for the results, I think this is a clear message to the GOP that the national party committee needs to "rig" the system so that the primaries aren't about all about appealing to the crazy right and then be forced back to the middle come election time. It's time to concede the gay marriage and abortion battles in order to win the war. It's time to fight back on the immigration message and give the American people a good reason why 100% amnesty isn't the answer, and if you oppose 100% amnesty you don't condone the killing and raping of little latino girls.

 

I'm not very optimistic about the next 4 years. It's still a divided country, and i'm sad that we're becoming western Europe more and more by the day. "Ask not what your country can do for you - ask what you can do for your country" has been completely flipped in 50 years. We are an entitled nation that now demands the Federal government play the role of babysitter and provider. That's sad. There's a place for that in the government's responsibilities, but not at the cost of losing that mentality of individualism and self-responsibility.

 

I'm 100% in agreement with SS2k5 - give me a candidate that stays out of my wallet and out of my bedroom. Legalize drugs, stop the abortion fight, allow gay marriage, whatever. But if we're deciding government can't decide moral issues, then the government shouldn't be able to take my money in order to pay for governments supposed moral responsibilities.

 

People in this country got a taste of the anti-western Europe, the Tea Party. Extreme social conservatism and free market liberal economics. Yesterday they said we don't want that.

 

I don't think we are anywhere close to becoming Europe or that by rejecting the Tea Party people want to totally be Europe, but I don't think becoming more like Europe in certain areas is a bad thing and I think people in this country see that.

 

Especially when it comes to social issues.

 

 

 

 

[Jenksismyhero]

Is Chris Christie still highly thought of in the GOP as a candidate for 2016? I wonder how much damage was done when he praised the President. It's a shame that even in a time of crisis politics still rule.

 

The main issue with that was the timing. It was a week before the election. If that was 6 months ago, fine, no problem. But as O'Reilly correctly pointed out last night, Sandy was a big blow (ba-doom-ching) to Romney's campaign. He was off the front page for 4-5 days, and in his place was the President talking on the phone or wearing a jacket with the Presidential seal or walking with Christie.

 

I think the GOP has to go with Rubio or at least Rubio as a VP. I'm kind of surprised they didn't do that this year but I guess the thought was to try and catch one last tea party wave. This was such a winnable election.

[pettie4sox]

I have no doubt in my mind that if Christie runs in 2016, he will be very, very tough to beat. I watched him handling the hurricane, and he's all sorts of presidential. if he loses 100 pounds...

 

It's sad but I could see people disregarding him as a candidate because he's obese. People tend to vote for the "better looking" candidates.

[Reddy]

The main issue with that was the timing. It was a week before the election. If that was 6 months ago, fine, no problem. But as O'Reilly correctly pointed out last night, Sandy was a big blow (ba-doom-ching) to Romney's campaign. He was off the front page for 4-5 days, and in his place was the President talking on the phone or wearing a jacket with the Presidential seal or walking with Christie.

 

I think the GOP has to go with Rubio or at least Rubio as a VP. I'm kind of surprised they didn't do that this year but I guess the thought was to try and catch one last tea party wave. This was such a winnable election.

people have very, very short memories.

 

people didn't even care that Obama got bin Laden by the time the election happened.

[Steve9347]

Could the Republicans win a national election without appealing to their very socially conservative base?

I think they could have an openly gay candidate and still clean up the Confederacy simply because of the R next to their name.

[SOXOBAMA]

Bush said he had a mandate after he won 286 electoral votes in 2004. So, Obama must have a giant mandate by comparison

[pettie4sox]

The main issue with that was the timing. It was a week before the election. If that was 6 months ago, fine, no problem. But as O'Reilly correctly pointed out last night, Sandy was a big blow (ba-doom-ching) to Romney's campaign. He was off the front page for 4-5 days, and in his place was the President talking on the phone or wearing a jacket with the Presidential seal or walking with Christie.

 

I think the GOP has to go with Rubio or at least Rubio as a VP. I'm kind of surprised they didn't do that this year but I guess the thought was to try and catch one last tea party wave. This was such a winnable election.

 

Timing wouldn't have helped Romney. He was a pathetic candidate just like Kerry in 2004. He simply couldn't be trusted and was a complete and utter clown.

 

Even his own party wasn't excited about him.

 

2016 will be a better presidential race for sure.

[StrangeSox]

Bush said he had a mandate after he won 286 electoral votes in 2004. So, Obama must have a giant mandate by comparison

 

No. According to Politico and the WSJ, it dasn't a broad mandate because he had to rely on minorities and women to win instead of winning the white male vote.

[bmags]

There were many I know whose position was "anyone but Obama". So to them it didn't matter who the GOP rolled up there, that's who was going to get their vote.

 

But why not? These men leading are just leaders of policy. If they disagree with the policy, why would you want that person in charge?

 

Overall who these men are mean a lot less than the institutions they run. Those people seem like they have a pretty good handle on how to vote to better their policy interests.

[Reddy]

No. According to Politico and the WSJ, it dasn't a broad mandate because he had to rely on minorities and women to win instead of winning the white male vote.

who... don't... count??

[southsider2k5]

Is Chris Christie still highly thought of in the GOP as a candidate for 2016? I wonder how much damage was done when he praised the President. It's a shame that even in a time of crisis politics still rule.

 

I think it puts him a great position for those who are in the middle. Not quite with where the Dems are, but not where the Repubs are either. There is plenty of room in the middle that is just begging to be claimed.

[SOXOBAMA]

Tester taking Montana and Heitkamp North Dakota. This would make Senate 55-45 with a +2 gain for Dems.

[Jenksismyhero]

I think they could have an openly gay candidate and still clean up the Confederacy simply because of the R next to their name.

 

No way, because he would never get on the ballot. That's the problem with the GOP right now. The vast majority of the party doesn't care (or care enough) about those social issues, but a very strong minority does. And that minority has a good hold on the primary elections. So you have to come off as extreme and then get back towards the middle come election time. But at that point you've already got quotes and video clips saying those extreme things, so it doesn't play with independents and moderate voters.

 

Romney is closer to Obama than people think, especially on social issues. But like McCain he was forced to look much more extreme than he really is.

[StrangeSox]

The vast majority of the Republicans who don't care about those social issues (I don't think that's accurate but w/e) could vote in the primaries.

[bmags]

No way, because he would never get on the ballot. That's the problem with the GOP right now. The vast majority of the party doesn't care (or care enough) about those social issues, but a very strong minority does. And that minority has a good hold on the primary elections. So you have to come off as extreme and then get back towards the middle come election time. But at that point you've already got quotes and video clips saying those extreme things, so it doesn't play with independents and moderate voters.

 

Romney is closer to Obama than people think, especially on social issues. But like McCain he was forced to look much more extreme than he really is.

 

Exactly. No reason R's should have lost Lugar's seat, but 14% of their electorate voted convincingly for a dude only 14% of the electorate wanted.

[hogan873]

The main issue with that was the timing. It was a week before the election. If that was 6 months ago, fine, no problem. But as O'Reilly correctly pointed out last night, Sandy was a big blow (ba-doom-ching) to Romney's campaign. He was off the front page for 4-5 days, and in his place was the President talking on the phone or wearing a jacket with the Presidential seal or walking with Christie.

 

I think the GOP has to go with Rubio or at least Rubio as a VP. I'm kind of surprised they didn't do that this year but I guess the thought was to try and catch one last tea party wave. This was such a winnable election.

I agree. In my opinion, for two straight elections the GOP put up weak candidates. McCain was a heart attack away from leaving the office to Sarah Palin. And Romney had the Tea Party and Mormon tags. I don't think Paul Ryan helped Romney much at all, either. When he was first picked, there was some talk of him being a great pick and that it was looking bad for Obama. But it just seemed like he faded from view after the debate.

 

I think that if Christie is the GOP candidate in 2016, the Democrats will need to have a very strong candidate to beat him. The general public, no matter their political alliance, was impressed with his handling of the disaster.

[Jenksismyhero]

The vast majority of the Republicans who don't care about those social issues (I don't think that's accurate but w/e) could vote in the primaries.

 

But they don't. And that's a problem with the party.

 

[StrangeSox]

I doubt Christie's handling of Sandy in 2012 will play prominently in 2016.

[hogan873]

But why not? These men leading are just leaders of policy. If they disagree with the policy, why would you want that person in charge?

 

Overall who these men are mean a lot less than the institutions they run. Those people seem like they have a pretty good handle on how to vote to better their policy interests.

I see your point, and that's the problem with the two party system. It's gotten to the point that it doesn't matter who the person is. It's what party they are aligned with.

[cabiness42]

I think this is a clear message to the GOP that the national party committee needs to "rig" the system so that the primaries aren't about all about appealing to the crazy right and then be forced back to the middle come election time.

 

This X 100. The extremes of both parties dominate the primary process. I'm not sure how easy the "rig" can be though. The big problem is that independents/moderates tend not to vote in primaries, which leaves the people voting in the primaries as being pretty extreme, which leads to extremist candidates getting nominated, which in turn drives more independents/moderates away from the primaries.

 

Maybe having single instead of separate primaries where candidates from both parties are on the ballot and the independent/moderate voter can vote for a Republican for President and a Democrat for Governor (or vice versa) would get independents/moderates more involved in the primary process and lead to better candidates???

 

I know I personally voted in the Republican primary this year solely to support Lugar over Murdock, but that meant I didn't get to vote on the Democratic nominee to run against my congressman, and ended up not voting for the Democratic candidate because I didn't like her.

[SOXOBAMA]

A few pundits think Christie will become an independent..

[hogan873]

I doubt Christie's handling of Sandy in 2012 will play prominently in 2016.

Not prominently, no. But it won't be forgotten. And it's not going to hurt him.

[pettie4sox]

No. According to Politico and the WSJ, it dasn't a broad mandate because he had to rely on minorities and women to win instead of winning the white male vote.

 

Who f***ing cares about the white male vote? If anything this election should prove they can't pander to one demographic and expect to win.