Time to revisit the 2nd Amendment?

[Y2HH]

Yelp a place to buy cocaine, let me know what you find out.

 

I'll find the nearest place to buy a gun. Lets see who finds it first.

 

Wasn't the point, and you know it.

[StrangeSox]

You seem very sure of this...but I suspect you wouldn't be quite as sure as you seem believe if you actually ever tried. A person that's never bought drugs before probably thinks they're hard to get, too...and I'm not talking about marijuana, either. Where there is a will...there will be a way.

Right, a will. A very determined person can still get a handgun in countries where handguns are legal. But they won't have one laying around if they snap. They will have to go through significant efforts to get one, not just go grab it outta grandpa's dresser.

 

I know that drugs are readily and easily obtained in this country, but that is because there's a large black market, and much of that demand is addiction-based. The market for guns isn't readily comparable to that, nor would the manufacture of the weapons and ammunition.

[RockRaines]

Trucks from Mexico and a guy on the corner that can sell you an illegal handgun? Are gangs going to start outdancing and outsinging the other? You guys are completely delusional if you think making gun ownership illegal would magically cure this problem or even put a dent into it.

According to statistics, it would put a HUGE dent in it. Over 267 crimes last year most of them homicides would never have happened in chicago.

[StrangeSox]

How's that war on drugs working out?

 

Guns and drugs do not represent similar goods and markets. Demand is not driven by nearly the same thing.

[mr_genius]

Right. You brought the left/right into this.

 

wrong

 

i'm so goddamned sick of this. and i'm sick of the people who defend it. personal freedom is bulls*** and it's what got a bunch of KIDS killed today.

 

then the political thread pops up

[StrangeSox]

Trucks from Mexico and a guy on the corner that can sell you an illegal handgun? Are gangs going to start outdancing and outsinging the other? You guys are completely delusional if you think making gun ownership illegal would magically cure this problem or even put a dent into it.

 

So what can we do about this problem if gun regulation won't do s***? Nothing?

[Y2HH]

According to statistics, it would put a HUGE dent in it. Over 267 crimes last year most of them homicides would never have happened in chicago.

 

First and foremost...stop with your statistics that are completely made up.

 

Hand guns are ILLEGAL in Chicago. So any gang banger with a handgun living in Chicago did NOT legally obtain it, register it and own it in this city. If they got them from a gun store, the store sold it to them ILLEGALLY. You claim these are legal purchases, no...they are not.

[RockRaines]

Show me facts, you're the one that made the false claim that all the gangbangers in the US have legally purchased guns...which is an absolute f***ing lie.

yes, they gave guns that were purchased legally. And I was wrong 268 of the almost 1400 last year came from one shop, not 267.

 

 

[Jenksismyhero]

According to statistics, it would put a HUGE dent in it. Over 267 crimes last year most of them homicides would never have happened in chicago.

 

That's assuming those criminals would not find (1) another gun (2) another means of killing. Guns aren't the only way to kill people.

[RockRaines]

First and foremost...stop with your statistics that are completely made up.

 

Hand guns are ILLEGAL in Chicago. So any gang banger with a handgun living in Chicago did NOT legally obtain it, register it and own it in this city. If they got them from a gun store, the store sold it to them ILLEGALLY. You claim these are legal purchases, no...they are not.

LOL, where does Chicago end dude

 

http://www.suntimes.com/news/crime/1471565...o-buy-guns.html

 

 

But the truth is most guns recovered in crimes here were originally bought in Illinois.

 

More specifically, in Cook County.

Edited December 14, 2012 by RockRaines

[RockRaines]

That's assuming those criminals would not find (1) another gun (2) another means of killing. Guns aren't the only way to kill people.

But clearly one of the most if not THE most efficient way.

[Quin]

wrong

 

 

 

then the political thread pops up

 

Whatever. Your first post was a disgusting joke.

 

Making it a pissing contest doesn't help. Reddy's was a gut reaction, your's was to instigate. Maybe just telling him it's not the place or time for that would have worked?

 

But no, we had to make it a senseless pissing contest between left and right.

[Y2HH]

yes, they gave guns that were purchased legally. And I was wrong 268 of the almost 1400 last year came from one shop, not 267.

 

And I repeat, those were NOT obtained legally. Handguns cannot be sold in Chicago, or registered in Chicago. Thus, anyone with a handgun in Chicago that is not a law enforcement official obtained it illegally and did not register it...illegally.

[StrangeSox]

Trucks from Mexico and a guy on the corner that can sell you an illegal handgun? Are gangs going to start outdancing and outsinging the other? You guys are completely delusional if you think making gun ownership illegal would magically cure this problem or even put a dent into it.

 

But now Remington and Colt are producing tens of thousands of less guns every year. Ammunition suppliers are producing millions of less rounds. You can't just go to Bass Pro or Walmart to pick this s*** up--there's not a fully legal, national distribution network and demand. Make guns illegal, and now you've really gotta want a gun to get it. You want to be willing to risk being imprisoned and having a felony record to keep that shotgun in the closet or that 1911 in the nightstand. Demand would be seriously reduced and, with it, supply.

[Y2HH]

LOL, where does Chicago end dude

 

http://www.suntimes.com/news/crime/1471565...o-buy-guns.html

 

And again...if you are going to own a gun legally in Chicago, you have to register it.

 

Thus...it's NOT legal.

[mr_genius]

Whatever. Your first post was a disgusting joke.

 

Reddy's was a gut reaction, your's was to instigate.

 

bulls***. his was a sad attempt to politically exploit a tragedy and I called HIM out on it.

[RockRaines]

And I repeat, those were NOT obtained legally. Handguns cannot be sold in Chicago, or registered in Chicago. Thus, anyone with a handgun in Chicago that is not a law enforcement official obtained it illegally and did not register it...illegally.

But the gun was originally bought legally, thus obtained from a store legally by someone. If that dries up then where do they get them?

[Jenksismyhero]

So what can we do about this problem if gun regulation won't do s***? Nothing?

 

Stop pretending that guns are the problem. Focus efforts elsewhere. That'd be the first step IMO.

 

Make them more difficult for me to obtain. Make me take a course every year or two. Fine. But the idea that we need to "revisit the 2nd amendment" is, quite frankly, idiotic. Especially as a response to a tragedy like this.

[StrangeSox]

But clearly one of the most if not THE most efficient way.

and we're back to West Side Story knife-fights

[Y2HH]

But the gun was originally bought legally, thus obtained from a store legally by someone. If that dries up then where do they get them?

 

...elsewhere?

[mr_genius]

Maybe just telling him it's not the place or time for that would have worked?

 

that clearly would have been a better response. so i agree with you there.

Edited December 14, 2012 by mr_genius

[Jenksismyhero]

But now Remington and Colt are producing tens of thousands of less guns every year. Ammunition suppliers are producing millions of less rounds. You can't just go to Bass Pro or Walmart to pick this s*** up--there's not a fully legal, national distribution network and demand. Make guns illegal, and now you've really gotta want a gun to get it. You want to be willing to risk being imprisoned and having a felony record to keep that shotgun in the closet or that 1911 in the nightstand. Demand would be seriously reduced and, with it, supply.

 

Yep, and if we made alcohol illegal all the alcohol makers would shore up and then no one would have the ability to drink!

 

You all have established the need for guns for criminals. Why do you not think there'd be a similar demand in a black market that people would be willing to spend top dollar for?

[StrangeSox]

Stop pretending that guns are the problem. Focus efforts elsewhere. That'd be the first step IMO.

 

Make them more difficult for me to obtain. Make me take a course every year or two. Fine. But the idea that we need to "revisit the 2nd amendment" is, quite frankly, idiotic. Especially as a response to a tragedy like this.

 

I think the 2nd amendment is actually quite a bit more broad than where current interpretation stands, and that if we want sane gun regulations or even to keep current regulations (NFA/machine gun ban) constitutional, we do need to revisit an amendment written in the 1790's based on 1790's technology and society.

 

That doesn't mean we need to ban guns, but we can't have a sane conversation about guns in this country as long as we have the 2nd, imo.

[southsider2k5]

For the last time, stop the personal back and forth, and stick to the topic.

[StrangeSox]

Yep, and if we made alcohol illegal all the alcohol makers would shore up and then no one would have the ability to drink!

 

You all have established the need for guns for criminals. Why do you not think there'd be a similar demand in a black market that people would be willing to spend top dollar for?

 

Drugs, of which alcohol is one, do not represent the same type of demand as guns do. It isn't even close to comparable.

 

But "people willing to spend top dollar" for guns means that people have to spend top dollar and that when someone with schizophrenia goes off of their medication, there's not guns laying around all over the place for them to pick up and start shooting.

 

edit: I can make bathtub gin or beer or wine on my own pretty easily. my great-grandparents built a home in Kankakee to do exactly that! fermenting fruit or grain isn't that difficult. owning a machine shop and building guns is considerably more complex.

Edited December 14, 2012 by StrangeSox