Official 2013-2014 NCAA Football Thread

[cabiness42]

And this guy wonders why no one takes him seriously.

 

Sorry, I was just countering all the irrational bulls*** from the other side.

[gatnom]

Looks like the NCAA has reduced the sanctions on Penn State.

 

http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/public...te+scholarships

 

 

[RockRaines]

Looks like the NCAA has reduced the sanctions on Penn State.

 

http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/public...te+scholarships

LOL NCAA. So the penalty was either correct or incorrect. That org is run by f***ing morons.

[LittleHurt05]

Looks like the NCAA has reduced the sanctions on Penn State.

 

http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/public...te+scholarships

 

If you cover up child rape, but later show good behavior, then your punishment will be reduced. But god forbid one player takes a little money, there is no turning back from that!

[cabiness42]

If you cover up child rape, but later show good behavior, then your punishment will be reduced. But god forbid one player takes a little money, there is no turning back from that!

 

Penn State got rid of everybody who was involved in the cover up and settled with the victims. I have no problems with the NCAA rewarding the behavior of those left behind to clean up the mess.

 

[RockRaines]

Penn State got rid of everybody who was involved in the cover up and settled with the victims. I have no problems with the NCAA rewarding the behavior of those left behind to clean up the mess.

So the same should be for all sanctions. Fire whole staff get rid of players get a reduction.

[cabiness42]

So the same should be for all sanctions. Fire whole staff get rid of players get a reduction.

 

If it's purely an internal issue, then yes. A lot of the "payment scandals" involve boosters/alumni, so I think those penalties need to stick in order to deter further occurrences.

 

[RockRaines]

If it's purely an internal issue, then yes. A lot of the "payment scandals" involve boosters/alumni, so I think those penalties need to stick in order to deter further occurrences.

or you cut their ties to anything related to the university.

 

You cannot have different tiers where schools can "repent." The NCAA is f***ing crazy and now have set a precedent where schools will keep appealing for reduced sanctions.

[cabiness42]

or you cut their ties to anything related to the university.

 

You cannot have different tiers where schools can "repent." The NCAA is f***ing crazy and now have set a precedent where schools will keep appealing for reduced sanctions.

 

Yes, in a perfect world that's what happens, but it's nearly impossible for the NCAA to verify whether or not boosters/alumni have "had their ties cut". No doubt that continuing sanctions are not a fair way to punish the transgressions, but it's the only real leverage the NCAA has.

 

[LittleHurt05]

If it's purely an internal issue, then yes. A lot of the "payment scandals" involve boosters/alumni, so I think those penalties need to stick in order to deter further occurrences.

 

You don't think the PSU scandal involved boosters and alumni? That was way more than an internal issue.

[RockRaines]

Yes, in a perfect world that's what happens, but it's nearly impossible for the NCAA to verify whether or not boosters/alumni have "had their ties cut". No doubt that continuing sanctions are not a fair way to punish the transgressions, but it's the only real leverage the NCAA has.

Well in the PSU case you have administrators, police, lawyers, boosters, ex-coaches, etc that we involved in a giant cover up over several decades. Show me a scandal that was covered up for longer by more people.

[cabiness42]

You don't think the PSU scandal involved boosters and alumni? That was way more than an internal issue.

 

But the university knew what was going on and they could have stopped it regardless of whether or not others were involved. I'm talking about situations where people outside the university are providing money/stuff directly to players. The NCAA doesn't have the reach to sanction those individuals so penalties to the school are the only option.

[LittleHurt05]

But the university knew what was going on and they could have stopped it regardless of whether or not others were involved. I'm talking about situations where people outside the university are providing money/stuff directly to players. The NCAA doesn't have the reach to sanction those individuals so penalties to the school are the only option.

 

So if a player is caught taking money, then the school should take blame for paying the kid, instead of blaming a booster? That way, they can be forgiven and have scholarships reduced. That's fair.

[cabiness42]

So if a player is caught taking money, then the school should take blame for paying the kid, instead of blaming a booster? That way, they can be forgiven and have scholarships reduced. That's fair.

 

You must have missed the part where I said it isn't fair. The problem is the NCAA can't do anything to the booster. The only leverage the NCAA has is to make the booster unhappy by penalizing the program.

 

[Soxbadger]

The reason that the NCAA did this is because its semi-unclear if criminal actions unrelated to the sport were subject to sanctions by the NCAA in the first place.

 

I dont really see a booster situation as comparable seeing as I doubt many people would say that the reason Sandusky was raping kids was to help get Penn State recruits. Which is ultimately the NCAA's function, to keep a fair playing field.

 

NCAA is a joke regardless.

[IlliniKrush]

LOL NCAA. So the penalty was either correct or incorrect. That org is run by f***ing morons.

What a joke.

 

Stolen from http://illiniboard.com/2013/09/24/penn-sta...nctions-lifted/

 

Here’s the math they were facing before today.

 

2013: 72 scholarship players, 18 seniors

2014: 54 on scholarship, recruiting class of 15, -4 for attrition: 64 (14 seniors)

2015: 50 on scholarship, +15, -4: 61 (approx. 16 seniors)

2016: 45 on scholarship, +15, -4: 56 (approx. 10 seniors)

2017: 46 on scholarship, +25 (sanctions lifted), -4: 67 (approx. 10 seniors)

2018: 57 on scholarship, +25, -4: 78

2019: Approx. 68 on scholarship plus a full class = max 85 scholarship players

 

So it would be 2019 before they had a full roster again. And an insurmountable 55 or so scholarship players in 2016.

 

Here’s the new math after four years of 15 scholarships was reduced to one year of 15 and one year of 20:

 

2013: 72 scholarship players, 18 seniors

2014: 54 on scholarship, recruiting class of 20, -4 attrition: 69 (14 seniors)

2015: 55 on scholarship, recruiting class of 25, -4 attrition: 76 (16 seniors)

2016: Approx. 70 on scholarship plus a full class = max 85 scholarship players

[Balta1701]

The reason that the NCAA did this is because its semi-unclear if criminal actions unrelated to the sport were subject to sanctions by the NCAA in the first place.

 

I dont really see a booster situation as comparable seeing as I doubt many people would say that the reason Sandusky was raping kids was to help get Penn State recruits. Which is ultimately the NCAA's function, to keep a fair playing field.

 

NCAA is a joke regardless.

However, it is fair to say that covering up what he was doing and trying to protect the football team and football culture at Penn State would definitely matter in terms of recruiting and other things being done by the program.

 

They didn't cover it up because they support pedophilia (I presume), they most likely did so to protect their cash-cow program.

[RockRaines]

The reason that the NCAA did this is because its semi-unclear if criminal actions unrelated to the sport were subject to sanctions by the NCAA in the first place.

 

I dont really see a booster situation as comparable seeing as I doubt many people would say that the reason Sandusky was raping kids was to help get Penn State recruits. Which is ultimately the NCAA's function, to keep a fair playing field.

 

NCAA is a joke regardless.

Alot of the "scandals" had no bearing on performance on the field or gave the programs unfair advantages.

[iamshack]

The reason that the NCAA did this is because its semi-unclear if criminal actions unrelated to the sport were subject to sanctions by the NCAA in the first place.

 

I dont really see a booster situation as comparable seeing as I doubt many people would say that the reason Sandusky was raping kids was to help get Penn State recruits. Which is ultimately the NCAA's function, to keep a fair playing field.

 

NCAA is a joke regardless.

Bilas was on Cowherd this morning and pointed out that Penn St commissioned the Freeh Report, which was then used by the NCAA to beat them to death with it. Sort of sets a bad precedent for schools doing their own investigations. Why bother?

[Balta1701]

Bilas was on Cowherd this morning and pointed out that Penn St commissioned the Freeh Report, which was then used by the NCAA to beat them to death with it. Sort of sets a bad precedent for schools doing their own investigations. Why bother?

The internal thing that we rapidly heard after the punishment came down was that if they felt Penn State wasn't cooperating, their response was going to be a multi-year death penalty for the program.

[iamshack]

The internal thing that we rapidly heard after the punishment came down was that if they felt Penn State wasn't cooperating, their response was going to be a multi-year death penalty for the program.

Right, and then their penalties were basically "by decree." There was no appeal process.

 

They didn't handle this particularly well, as they usually don't, but let's not pretend that the whole country wasn't behind kicking the s*** out of PSU at the time.

[RockRaines]

Bilas was on Cowherd this morning and pointed out that Penn St commissioned the Freeh Report, which was then used by the NCAA to beat them to death with it. Sort of sets a bad precedent for schools doing their own investigations. Why bother?

Thats the only reason Ohio State got hit. Self reported. The reason most SEC schools dont get busted, denial.

[cabiness42]

Alot of the "scandals" had no bearing on performance on the field or gave the programs unfair advantages.

 

The extent of unfair advantages is impossible to measure, but you have to admit that at least some recruits are swayed by illegal gifts, and I also think you have to agree that it would be impossible for the NCAA to have any sort of system where it tries to measure the amount of advantage in each specific case.

 

[Balta1701]

Right, and then their penalties were basically "by decree." There was no appeal process.

 

They didn't handle this particularly well, as they usually don't, but let's not pretend that the whole country wasn't behind kicking the s*** out of PSU at the time.

Yeah, but again, I think that there was enough negotiation for the higher-ups at Penn State to know that they were effectively getting an appeal-style deal. I certainly got the impression that the NCAA seriously wanted the death penalty and Penn State basically said "we'll completely stop fighting this and we'll issue statements supporting you if you switch to the harshest non-death-penalty punishment you can do".

 

I certainly got the impression that there were a few very loud board members in the hours after the punishments came down who were threatening all sorts of lawsuits and then suddenly they shut up a few hours later, as if they were told "you file this and they shut the program down". Am I wrong?

[Soxbadger]

Right, and then their penalties were basically "by decree." There was no appeal process.

 

They didn't handle this particularly well, as they usually don't, but let's not pretend that the whole country wasn't behind kicking the s*** out of PSU at the time.

 

Exactly and now you reign in the penalties because the public isnt out for blood and the NCAA doesnt want actually have to fight this out.

 

Im also guessing that its not a coincidence that the NCAA is about to have meetings in October where some were speculating that the largest schools may want to break away from the NCAA...