witesoxfan Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 QUOTE (lostfan @ Mar 20, 2013 -> 03:27 PM) Yes please. Not as the base offense, but as an added package to get on film for opponents? Yeah that'd be pretty awesome. Trestman is thinking of everything, I like it. Cutler isn't Wilson or Griffin but he does have wheels, and if you leave an open lane for him he'll run off 20 yards before your defense can recover. He only has to do this 2-3 times per game for it to be effective. I guess it's not really known that Cutler has above average athleticism because Tice ran a remedial first-grade offense, and moving the QB wasn't an integral part of the Martzfense. Cutler's best when he's on the move and not stationary reading defenses. I don't remember the exact number, but his last year in Denver, his QB rating rolling out to his right was like 110 or 120. It may have just been outside the pocket in general. He doesn't like to sit behind his OLine and hit spots. He can do that, and he can put the ball where it needs to be, but scrambling opens plays up more often and his athleticism creates problems for defenses. On top of that, the second you get out of the pocket, there should never be any interceptions or sacks. I'm honestly kind of excited to watch the Bears next year. I don't remember many of the head coaches, but when was the last time they had an offensive guru as head coach (as opposed to just being a former tight end, like Ditka)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Read option should be a no. The problem is that if you dont have experience with it, you are going to end up getting your QB killed as their responsibility is to hold the ball until the DE commits. So if you are scheming against the Bears, you just simply instruct the DE to crash the QB every single play and get as many free hits as possible. You need an QB who can legitimately make someone miss 1 on 1 to run this scheme. That is why it works for players like RGIII, Cam Newton, etc. If the DE crashes the QB and the DE misses, the QB is free, so when you are playing a legitimate run qb, the DE has to respect the outside. Does Cutler really need to be taking more free hits? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Mar 20, 2013 -> 04:53 PM) I don't remember the exact number, but his last year in Denver, his QB rating rolling out to his right was like 110 or 120. It may have just been outside the pocket in general. He doesn't like to sit behind his OLine and hit spots. He can do that, and he can put the ball where it needs to be, but scrambling opens plays up more often and his athleticism creates problems for defenses. On top of that, the second you get out of the pocket, there should never be any interceptions or sacks. I'm honestly kind of excited to watch the Bears next year. I don't remember many of the head coaches, but when was the last time they had an offensive guru as head coach (as opposed to just being a former tight end, like Ditka)? Never. You have to go back to Sid Luckman and the days of the T-formation. That is the history of the Chicago Bears, in a nutshell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Another dumb rule passed. It's football guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Mar 20, 2013 -> 04:01 PM) Read option should be a no. The problem is that if you dont have experience with it, you are going to end up getting your QB killed as their responsibility is to hold the ball until the DE commits. So if you are scheming against the Bears, you just simply instruct the DE to crash the QB every single play and get as many free hits as possible. You need an QB who can legitimately make someone miss 1 on 1 to run this scheme. That is why it works for players like RGIII, Cam Newton, etc. If the DE crashes the QB and the DE misses, the QB is free, so when you are playing a legitimate run qb, the DE has to respect the outside. Does Cutler really need to be taking more free hits? Read option is more than just the mesh action between a QB and a RB. I dont think he means running the inverted veer over and over with Cutler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Mar 20, 2013 -> 04:01 PM) Read option should be a no. The problem is that if you dont have experience with it, you are going to end up getting your QB killed as their responsibility is to hold the ball until the DE commits. So if you are scheming against the Bears, you just simply instruct the DE to crash the QB every single play and get as many free hits as possible. You need an QB who can legitimately make someone miss 1 on 1 to run this scheme. That is why it works for players like RGIII, Cam Newton, etc. If the DE crashes the QB and the DE misses, the QB is free, so when you are playing a legitimate run qb, the DE has to respect the outside. Does Cutler really need to be taking more free hits? It takes a quick juke or stutter step to gain 5 yards. Besides, you can just give it to Forte 5-7 times a game, and if he gains 40-50 yards, then teams will have to try and crash him more often. If they do so, Cutler is free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Mar 20, 2013 -> 05:01 PM) Read option should be a no. The problem is that if you dont have experience with it, you are going to end up getting your QB killed as their responsibility is to hold the ball until the DE commits. So if you are scheming against the Bears, you just simply instruct the DE to crash the QB every single play and get as many free hits as possible. You need an QB who can legitimately make someone miss 1 on 1 to run this scheme. That is why it works for players like RGIII, Cam Newton, etc. If the DE crashes the QB and the DE misses, the QB is free, so when you are playing a legitimate run qb, the DE has to respect the outside. Does Cutler really need to be taking more free hits? He is not going to be doing it the whole game. A handful of times. Cutler is not a human blur, he is deceptively elusive, though. The only way this has manifested itself in Chicago is when he played for Martz, and he'd slip the pass rush long enough to make a play. If he'd had a coach who knew how to properly execute this last year, freezing LBs for a second then making a play, he could've lit up Green Bay last year. Instead we had Tice sending Forte up the middle (which he sucks at) without even using Bush, and neglecting the middle of the field. Lots and lots of fail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 QUOTE (RockRaines @ Mar 20, 2013 -> 05:04 PM) Read option is more than just the mesh action between a QB and a RB. I dont think he means running the inverted veer over and over with Cutler. ^^What he said. Running that same play, just waiting for the DE to slip - that would be stupid, an extremely predictable kind of offense. OTOH if this was on film the pass rushers (DEs or LBs) would need to think carefully before they crash and open up the offense for other plays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 QUOTE (RockRaines @ Mar 20, 2013 -> 04:04 PM) Read option is more than just the mesh action between a QB and a RB. I dont think he means running the inverted veer over and over with Cutler. QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Mar 20, 2013 -> 04:04 PM) It takes a quick juke or stutter step to gain 5 yards. Besides, you can just give it to Forte 5-7 times a game, and if he gains 40-50 yards, then teams will have to try and crash him more often. If they do so, Cutler is free. Either way Im not a fan of putting a QB at risk of getting injured. I dont even like that RGIII is doing it that often because I think its a recipe for disaster and injury. I mean I have no problem with them calling a play out of shotgun and giving Cutler the option of handing off to Forte or going play action pass. I just think that you do not want QBs taking RB hits. For example, Russel Wilson almost never actually runs read option. Most of his running comes off of boot/option or broken passing plays. In college he never used the read one time, and in the pros Ive only seen it as a decoy, hes never actually kept the ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Mar 20, 2013 -> 05:08 PM) Either way Im not a fan of putting a QB at risk of getting injured. I dont even like that RGIII is doing it that often because I think its a recipe for disaster and injury. I mean I have no problem with them calling a play out of shotgun and giving Cutler the option of handing off to Forte or going play action pass. I just think that you do not want QBs taking RB hits. For example, Russel Wilson almost never actually runs read option. Most of his running comes off of boot/option or broken passing plays. In college he never used the read one time, and in the pros Ive only seen it as a decoy, hes never actually kept the ball. Wilson beat the Bears with his arm, in part because they were afraid of his legs and because they were tired from containing him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Well I honestly dont know what it means. Because any time Ive ever seen a "read-option" it meant "zone read". If he is just using the term and talking about something else, than maybe it will work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 QUOTE (lostfan @ Mar 20, 2013 -> 03:27 PM) Yes please. Not as the base offense, but as an added package to get on film for opponents? Yeah that'd be pretty awesome. Trestman is thinking of everything, I like it. Cutler isn't Wilson or Griffin but he does have wheels, and if you leave an open lane for him he'll run off 20 yards before your defense can recover. He only has to do this 2-3 times per game for it to be effective. I guess it's not really known that Cutler has above average athleticism because Tice ran a remedial first-grade offense, and moving the QB wasn't an integral part of the Martzfense. Cutler's best when he's on the move and not stationary reading defenses. I'm more or less ambivalent. If implemented as you describe, I can try to just trust our "guru." With that said, nobody will be happy when Cutler gets hurt because we ran designed run plays for the QB. The film is no good if Josh McCown ends up in the game. On the other hand, he does need to move. I know he wasn't eager to do it himself last year, but I think that is because had some nagging issues. Now that he's fresh, it is something he's good at and is generally a good way to open a bad offense (especially a bad one with bad pass protection). QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Mar 20, 2013 -> 04:08 PM) Either way Im not a fan of putting a QB at risk of getting injured. I dont even like that RGIII is doing it that often because I think its a recipe for disaster and injury. I mean I have no problem with them calling a play out of shotgun and giving Cutler the option of handing off to Forte or going play action pass. I just think that you do not want QBs taking RB hits. For example, Russel Wilson almost never actually runs read option. Most of his running comes off of boot/option or broken passing plays. In college he never used the read one time, and in the pros Ive only seen it as a decoy, hes never actually kept the ball. When well-executed, these plays can be absolutely deadly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 He said, in so many words, that he is going to add read option looks to the offense (not that he is going to run an actual read-option offense - don't have the QB to do that). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 QUOTE (lostfan @ Mar 20, 2013 -> 04:13 PM) He said, in so many words, that he is going to add read option looks to the offense (not that he is going to run an actual read-option offense - don't have the QB to do that). I just read the quote, it does not even say that the Bears will use it, just that they are looking at it. http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/eye-on-f...ize-read-option coach Marc Trestman said he’s open at looking at the read opinion. “every team is looking at it right now,” Where are the journalism police? The headline doesnt match the content. Well he should be open to looking at anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Mar 20, 2013 -> 05:18 PM) I just read the quote, it does not even say that the Bears will use it, just that they are looking at it. http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/eye-on-f...ize-read-option coach Marc Trestman said he’s open at looking at the read opinion. “every team is looking at it right now,” Where are the journalism police? The headline doesnt match the content. Well he should be open to looking at anything. That is what I get for not reading the whole article. But I'm still in favor of what I described. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 At the very least, it's less gimmicky than the Wildcat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Im not really a fan of either wildcat or read option in NFL. If you come up with something new that teams werent ready for, you are going to have success with it for a while. It is going to be interesting to see what happens when teams have thought and schemed for zone read for a year. This isnt college, DEs are going to start obliterating QBs. Its the same reason why regular option just never sticks in the NFL. You cant leave QBs to get decimated. The risk/reward is to low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Is it wrong that I don't care Urlacher is gone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Mar 20, 2013 -> 04:35 PM) Im not really a fan of either wildcat or read option in NFL. If you come up with something new that teams werent ready for, you are going to have success with it for a while. It is going to be interesting to see what happens when teams have thought and schemed for zone read for a year. This isnt college, DEs are going to start obliterating QBs. Its the same reason why regular option just never sticks in the NFL. You cant leave QBs to get decimated. The risk/reward is to low. Yes, but once again you are focusing on a subset of the read option package. Its not all reading the DE then giving based on his actions. You could be running a jet sweep option where you have a run and pass read both concentrating on reading the actions of the OLB and the QB isnt really a run threat. There are alot of ways to use the option without running the IZ or the Belly. Second, the NFL is MUCH more careful about protecting QB's than the college game. On this page, check out the two plays under power/dave. One is a run/pass option and the other has the QB going outside. http://www.elevenwarriors.com/2013/02/2009...e-base-run-game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 QUOTE (RockRaines @ Mar 20, 2013 -> 05:51 PM) Is it wrong that I don't care Urlacher is gone? It was time. Shell of former self. Hope he retires. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 QUOTE (Brian @ Mar 20, 2013 -> 05:58 PM) It was time. Shell of former self. Hope he retires. Word has it he was asking for another multi-year deal with a ton of money up front. At some point you have to realize you just arent that good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Urlacher, Bears part ways Well, like I said at the end of the season, if Emery cleans house he is really going to clean house. And boy has he Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 QUOTE (Brian @ Mar 20, 2013 -> 05:58 PM) It was time. Shell of former self. Hope he retires. He will not retire but I wish he would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maggsmaggs Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 "It was a ultimatum, not a negotiation,'' Urlacher said. "I wanted to be in Chicago. I wanted to finish here." From Rotoworld. Bears did the right thing here. Was not worth really what he was probably asking for. Time to move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Hey Brian, it's hard to feel sorry for you when you came into training camp a few years ago and forced the Bears to give you a new deal when you still had 2 years left on your current deal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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