2013 Spring Training catch all thread

[southsider2k5]

The Sox have historically made a killing doing that. Pierzynski, Dye, Iguchi, Thome, Quentin, Floyd, Youkilis, Rios, even Peavy - the Sox have generally been very good about buying low and either selling or not bringing back at high value.

 

They have been especially good at this with pitchers, but that shows they have hit on plenty of position players as well. You don't just get players through the draft. The only guy on the team the Sox paid max price for is Adam Dunn.

[balfanman]

It is a poor point to assume that the Sox will get zero contribution from their minor league players. Especially when the Sox got big contributions last year, and all indications are that the system has better quality in it that it has in a long time.

 

I agree, but I'm really talking about a bat that is more than just a contributor. We really need at least one of our younger guys to turn into a real impact, top/middle of the order bat. Ordonez and Lee, even Crede as short as his career was are good mentions. Konerko wasn't really a product of our system, but you're right, we can always trade for pieces.

[witesoxfan]

They have been especially good at this with pitchers, but that shows they have hit on plenty of position players as well. You don't just get players through the draft. The only guy on the team the Sox paid max price for is Adam Dunn.

 

Swisher too, and the Sox are still kicking themselves for that one, but they wouldn't have won the division in 2008 without the miniscule contributions of Nick Swisher.

 

I agree, but I'm really talking about a bat that is more than just a contributor. We really need at least one of our younger guys to turn into a real impact, top/middle of the order bat. Ordonez and Lee, even Crede as short as his career was are good mentions. Konerko wasn't really a product of our system, but you're right, we can always trade for pieces.

 

Mike Cameron was though.

[southsider2k5]

Swisher too, and the Sox are still kicking themselves for that one, but they wouldn't have won the division in 2008 without the miniscule contributions of Nick Swisher.

 

 

 

Mike Cameron was though.

 

I have a hard time with Swisher, as I really think Ozzie f***ed that one up more than anything.

[balfanman]

I really appreciate all of the responses here, you've picked me up. I guess I'm just in a down mood this morning and worried about the future if none of these guys ever amount to much offensively. Maybe I should rephrase my original point.

 

"It sure would be nice if at least one of our younger guys turned into a solid middle of the order hitter this year".

 

 

Now, can the season start?

[ScottyDo]

I really appreciate all of the responses here, you've picked me up. I guess I'm just in a down mood this morning and worried about the future if none of these guys ever amount to much offensively. Maybe I should rephrase my original point.

 

"It sure would be nice if at least one of our younger guys turned into a solid middle of the order hitter this year".

 

 

Now, can the season start?

I'm actually on your side here. Replacing our 3, 4 and 5 hitters all by free agency sounds awfully inefficient. Currently, none of the younger players on our roster are capable of hitting in those spots. Courtney Hawkins is still years away from playing at that level, and Rios, Dunn and Konerko are probably gone before then. Of the players in our system, it seems like Viciedo, Thompson, Hawkins and maybe Mitchell could be middle of the order bats, but we need a couple of them to step up soon or the Sox will be risking a ton of money in the notoriously dangerous FA market. I've got my fingers crossed for a monster -- or at least extremely promising -- season from Viciedo.

[maggsmaggs]

Carlos Lee, Paul Konerko. They haven't really had many decent prospects in a while though either. They've had Konerko in there for close to 15 years now, and they've done a pretty good job of finding good replacements in those spots for about 8 years now too.

 

You hope Thompson can develop the sort of contact ability to hit .250, because he could hit 30+ homers with that sort of average, and then you hope Hawkins develops really nicely too.

Konerko really wasn't developed by the White Sox in the true sense like Carlos or Maggs. He was traded to us and inserted into the Sox lineup as a youngster.

[elrockinMT]

I have a hard time with Swisher, as I really think Ozzie f***ed that one up more than anything.

 

 

I liked Ozzie but I agree with your take on Swisher. I think it must have been a personality clash. Swisher can rub people the wrong way and we know Ozzie does for sure. The two of them just didn't seem to get on the same page

[southsider2k5]

I liked Ozzie but I agree with your take on Swisher. I think it must have been a personality clash. Swisher can rub people the wrong way and we know Ozzie does for sure. The two of them just didn't seem to get on the same page

 

And more than anything, his one year with the Sox is the outlier.

[LittleHurt05]

And more than anything, his one year with the Sox is the outlier.

 

That's what sucks about that second Gio trade. If Swisher had been producing at his normal level, that trade would look so different. Look at his yearly OPS since 2006: .864, .836, .743, .869, .870, .822, .837

[southsider2k5]

That's what sucks about that second Gio trade. If Swisher had been producing at his normal level, that trade would look so different. Look at his yearly OPS since 2006: .864, .836, .743, .869, .870, .822, .837

 

Yep. I really feel like the Sox made the choice of Ozzie over Swisher. I wonder what we would have looked like if we had gone the other way. (Granted I know, Ozzie's team had just won a division for the 2nd time in 4 years so he wasn't going anywhere, but still).

[The Ginger Kid]

Joe Crede developed into a really solid bat by 2006, but then his back imploded.

This. I think Crede was on track to become one of the premier 3b's in the league. We would have lost him of course, given that Boras was his agent. But he was definitely on track to stardom, imo.

[The Ginger Kid]

Sounds like Danks threw well in live BP today. Welcome news. A year of the old sub 4.00 ERA Johnny Danks would be sweet.

[ScottyDo]

Sounds like Danks threw well in live BP today. Welcome news. A year of the old sub 4.00 ERA Johnny Danks would be sweet.

Just saw this. I admit to being unreasonably excited about a February bullpen session. It might be the caffeine I'm mainlining.

[Cali]

I have a hard time with Swisher, as I really think Ozzie f***ed that one up more than anything.

 

So true. Swisher got a lot of unwarranted hate around here for what was more of an Ozzie issue.

 

The short porch of Yankee stadium helped, but you saw what happened with Swish's productivity once he left the South Side and got away from Guillen.

[The Ginger Kid]

Just saw this. I admit to being unreasonably excited about a February bullpen session. It might be the caffeine I'm mainlining.

so true. I need to get a grip.

[ScottyDo]

so true. I need to get a grip.

Hey, man, embrace the irrational elation! Just admit that it makes little-to-no sense and all is well. Next BP session, you and I can fire up the chat room and rock out to some 85 mph cutters

[southsider2k5]

Just saw this. I admit to being unreasonably excited about a February bullpen session. It might be the caffeine I'm mainlining.

 

This is more than just a spring training thing. If we get back the real John Danks, this team has a pretty bad ass starting rotation, with two really good lefties at the top.

[southsider2k5]

So true. Swisher got a lot of unwarranted hate around here for what was more of an Ozzie issue.

 

The short porch of Yankee stadium helped, but you saw what happened with Swish's productivity once he left the South Side and got away from Guillen.

 

Sure. It went back to where it has always been.

[witesoxfan]

Call it a hunch, but I don't think it was just Ozzie. I just don't think Swisher was very popular in the locker room. The whole bat incident seemed to rub a lot of people the wrong way. It seemed that team had a lot of conflicting personalities and egos, yet they won the division.

[witesoxfan]

I think thinking about 2008 made me remember this video, and thankfully, it still works.

 

http://www.tmz.com/videos?autoplay=true&am...3;id=0_658ihpm5

[elrockinMT]

Call it a hunch, but I don't think it was just Ozzie. I just don't think Swisher was very popular in the locker room. The whole bat incident seemed to rub a lot of people the wrong way. It seemed that team had a lot of conflicting personalities and egos, yet they won the division.

 

 

Maybe... He isn't well liked by other players it seems, but he is a talent you kind of like on your team. I remember when he was in Oakland and the Big Hurt signed there. Swisher was excited and worshipped Frank.

[Cali]

Call it a hunch, but I don't think it was just Ozzie. I just don't think Swisher was very popular in the locker room. The whole bat incident seemed to rub a lot of people the wrong way. It seemed that team had a lot of conflicting personalities and egos, yet they won the division.

 

Well his personality didn't seem like an issue is NY... It had something to do with Ozzie, but I'm willing to bet it also had something to do with guys like Konerko/AJ/Dye running the clubhouse in a more quiet, buttoned up way and Swish didn't mesh with that.

 

I'm a firm believer in having some personality in the clubhouse to keep it loose. I don't think Paulie et al agree with that.

[The Ginger Kid]

I'm a firm believer in having some personality in the clubhouse to keep it loose. I don't think Paulie et al agree with that.

Carl, AJ, Uribe, Blum...seems like they had some genuine characters in the past and Paulie had no problem with that. If Swisher could've backed up his big personality with his play on the field, I think he would've been hugely popular, both with fans and players. For whatever reason, he just had a really bad year at the plate. Our bad luck.

[Balta1701]

Carl, AJ, Uribe, Blum...seems like they had some genuine characters in the past and Paulie had no problem with that. If Swisher could've backed up his big personality with his play on the field, I think he would've been hugely popular, both with fans and players. For whatever reason, he just had a really bad year at the plate. Our bad luck.

I think he was also a particularly bad matchup for the coaching staff, Walker in particular. We've heard stories about Walker basically giving up on even trying with Swisher, or something like that, after Swisher had refused his suggestions/help for so long.