2013 MLB Catch-All thread

[iamshack]

Exactly, which further adds to our collective frustration (save Balta, of course, he believes in everyone who may someday wear the Pale Hose and is a true saint and true fan).

I don't think he truly believes that. He's just trying to highlight the hypocrisy in many of the fans asking for a rebuild, while at the same time being impatient with the development of our prospects.

[Balta1701]

I don't think he truly believes that. He's just trying to highlight the hypocrisy in many of the fans asking for a rebuild, while at the same time being impatient with the development of our prospects.

I really find the contrast between the belief in Garcia and the declarations that "Viciedo sucks" to be quite remarkable.

 

Aside from Garcia having better speed, you can literally say almost word for word the exact same thing about each of them, both positive and negative. "Moved up through the minors aggressively". "Started having success at AAA at age 22". "Solid power, could develop into big time power". "Approach at the plate might not translate into the big leagues". "Swings at too many pitches out of the zone". "Doesn't take enough walks". "Vulnerable to the type of pitchers in the big leagues". "Quite raw, if called up now might need a couple years".

 

I mean I feel like I can pencil in the date next year when it is declared that "Garcia sucks donkey balls" because he's not immediately hitting.

[cabiness42]

I really find the contrast between the belief in Garcia and the declarations that "Viciedo sucks" to be quite remarkable.

 

Aside from Garcia having better speed, you can literally say almost word for word the exact same thing about each of them, both positive and negative. "Moved up through the minors aggressively". "Started having success at AAA at age 22". "Solid power, could develop into big time power". "Approach at the plate might not translate into the big leagues". "Swings at too many pitches out of the zone". "Doesn't take enough walks". "Vulnerable to the type of pitchers in the big leagues". "Quite raw, if called up now might need a couple years".

 

I mean I feel like I can pencil in the date next year when it is declared that "Garcia sucks donkey balls" because he's not immediately hitting.

 

That's true, except that Garcia is two years younger and has a wider range of potential paths. In the last two years, Viciedo has gone from where Garcia is now to the lower end of that range.

 

 

 

[witesoxfan]

That's true, except that Garcia is two years younger and has a wider range of potential paths. In the last two years, Viciedo has gone from where Garcia is now to the lower end of that range.

 

Compare Viciedo's numbers to Adrian Beltre's. Seriously.

[Dick Allen]

I really find the contrast between the belief in Garcia and the declarations that "Viciedo sucks" to be quite remarkable.

 

Aside from Garcia having better speed, you can literally say almost word for word the exact same thing about each of them, both positive and negative. "Moved up through the minors aggressively". "Started having success at AAA at age 22". "Solid power, could develop into big time power". "Approach at the plate might not translate into the big leagues". "Swings at too many pitches out of the zone". "Doesn't take enough walks". "Vulnerable to the type of pitchers in the big leagues". "Quite raw, if called up now might need a couple years".

 

I mean I feel like I can pencil in the date next year when it is declared that "Garcia sucks donkey balls" because he's not immediately hitting.

 

Actually, Viciedo had a higher walk rate and lower K rate than Garcia in the minors. He also came up really young and produced on the major league level. Garcia runs better, but if you were down on Viciedo, I can't see how you could be excited about Garcia.

[cabiness42]

Compare Viciedo's numbers to Adrian Beltre's. Seriously.

 

So you're saying you expect Viciedo to have a ridiculous spike in production the year before he hits free agency?

 

Or are you saying people should stop touching Viciedo's head?

Edited August 7, 2013 by HickoryHuskers

[Balta1701]

So you're saying you expect Viciedo to have a ridiculous spike in production the year before he hits free agency?

It certainly wouldn't stun me if as a 26-27 year old he suddenly put up a 50 HR season. He certainly has the power to do that and it may very well be like a lightswitch for him if he figures out how to stay in that "locked-in" mode for an entire season.

[Rowand44]

Compare Viciedo's numbers to Adrian Beltre's. Seriously.

Ya but who is going to be his Elvis Andrus?

[iamshack]

It certainly wouldn't stun me if as a 26-27 year old he suddenly put up a 50 HR season. He certainly has the power to do that and it may very well be like a lightswitch for him if he figures out how to stay in that "locked-in" mode for an entire season.

It would stun me.

[Dick Allen]

It certainly wouldn't stun me if as a 26-27 year old he suddenly put up a 50 HR season. He certainly has the power to do that and it may very well be like a lightswitch for him if he figures out how to stay in that "locked-in" mode for an entire season.

Please don't say 50 HR season. No White Sox has ever done that, and the last young guy on here I heard was capable of doing it was Josh Fields.

[witesoxfan]

So you're saying you expect Viciedo to have a ridiculous spike in production the year before he hits free agency?

 

Or are you saying people should stop touching Viciedo's head?

 

Not at all, but it's definitely a possibility. Or it's possible he just figures out how to hit.

 

I know you weren't writing off Viciedo by any stretch, and I hold a similar view to yours, but the idea of 24 year old who has struggled through his first 1100 MLB plate appearances figuring it out is not unprecedented. Lumping Garcia and Viciedo together is not crazy at all.

[cabiness42]

Not at all, but it's definitely a possibility. Or it's possible he just figures out how to hit.

 

I know you weren't writing off Viciedo by any stretch, and I hold a similar view to yours, but the idea of 24 year old who has struggled through his first 1100 MLB plate appearances figuring it out is not unprecedented. Lumping Garcia and Viciedo together is not crazy at all.

 

Yes, but I'm just saying that the 22 year old has two more years to "figure it out" than the 24 year old so I like his odds better.

 

[southsider2k5]

It certainly wouldn't stun me if as a 26-27 year old he suddenly put up a 50 HR season. He certainly has the power to do that and it may very well be like a lightswitch for him if he figures out how to stay in that "locked-in" mode for an entire season.

 

In this day and age? Yes it would stun me.

[Chisoxfn]

Please don't say 50 HR season. No White Sox has ever done that, and the last young guy on here I heard was capable of doing it was Josh Fields.

Lol....good ole Josh Fields. And I'd be freaking stunned if Tank hit 50 in a year. In this non-steroid era that is extremely unlikely.

[daa84]

Mike Trout has 1.6 Wins above replacement more than the sum of the WAR of each non-pitcher Sox player COMBINED (and I only counted the offensive players who have a WAR above 0)

Edited August 8, 2013 by daa84

[zenryan]

Archer leaves game after 1.2 innings b/c of tightness of forearm. Not thought to be serious. And now Wil Myers being lifted because of an apparent injury. Ugh

[LittleHurt05]

Mike Trout has 1.6 Wins above replacement more than the sum of the WAR of each non-pitcher Sox player COMBINED (and I only counted the offensive players who have a WAR above 0)

 

2nd player in MLB history to homer on his birthday twice by the age of 22.

[Steve9347]

Mike Trout has 1.6 Wins above replacement more than the sum of the WAR of each non-pitcher Sox player COMBINED (and I only counted the offensive players who have a WAR above 0)

Now there's a fun fact.

[Balta1701]

Phillies extend Utley through 2015.

[LittleHurt05]

Phillies extend Utley through 2015.

 

Give the Phillies credit for going against the grain. Who needs to get younger?

[Balta1701]

Give the Phillies credit for going against the grain. Who needs to get younger?

I'd wager there's some degree of "if we can get one more healthy year out of Roy next year, with Lee and Hamels in that rotation as well, and Utley can play like he has this year, we're now getting production from Domonic Brown, we've got a legit shot at competing again next year".

[witesoxfan]

I'd wager there's some degree of "if we can get one more healthy year out of Roy next year, with Lee and Hamels in that rotation as well, and Utley can play like he has this year, we're now getting production from Domonic Brown, we've got a legit shot at competing again next year".

 

I'd imagine there's also some Ruben Amaro Jr fighting for his job too.

 

It really is amazing how Pat Gillick can lead these teams to success and then see them absolutely fall apart after he leaves.

[lostfan]

I was looking at another thread on another board from a couple years ago where a Phillies fan was defending the Phillies giving Howard 22 mil for 6 years, where everyone was saying the contract was an overpay and going to start looking awful a couple years into the deal. Adrian Gonzalez was brought up as a comparison and how much better a player he was than Howard, and how Howard's contract won't look that bad once Pujols and Fielder get their deals. Funny, now... ALL of those mega-contracts look bad now except Fielder. There are some truly terrible contracts, in otherworldly-bad territory right now, over 20 million for players who've been just average or are truly bad.

 

For all the arguing done about Gonzalez in that thread he's been a pretty much above-average player nowhere near worth his deal.

A-Rod... nuff said, this one was easy to call at the time too

Pujols - nobody really understands this one

Hamilton - could have been called at the time

Teixeira - pretty much paying for the '09 World Series, really meh since then, coulda been called at the time too

Sabathia - can be excused from this list since he's been great for most of his deal but is really expensive from here in the rest of it

Crawford - not even remotely close to worth the money

 

Compared to these guys Cabrera's deal looks downright cheap. It's like MLB GMs got NBA GM syndrome from like 2009 to 2013.

[Balta1701]

Prince Fielder has a .785 OPS on the season. Here it is by month:

April/March 1.009

May 0.738

June 0.788

July 0.656

August 0.630

 

That contract only doesn't look bad if you haven't paid much attention or if you only care about winning a world series right now and the last years are a write-off.

 

[lostfan]

Prince Fielder has a .785 OPS on the season. Here it is by month:

April/March 1.009

May 0.738

June 0.788

July 0.656

August 0.630

 

That contract only doesn't look bad if you haven't paid much attention or if you only care about winning a world series right now and the last years are a write-off.

I didn't want to put him on this list because his mehness just started this year and I'm not sure if it's a trend yet. Having the Tigers stuck with 23 million for the next 5 years or whatever of a mediocre player wouldn't be the worst thing in the world, though.