Explosions at end of Boston Marathon

[Balta1701]

Why do you feel domestic terrorists deserve the same rights as regular U.S. citizens? More importantly, why should we take the moral high road with known terrorists? This kid brutally murdered and mutilated dozens of people, destroying numerous people's lives in the process. He did so with the intent to create as much pain and suffering as possible for these innocent people.

 

Why does he get your sympathy when he took none on his victims? How would you feel if you were left a cripple or lost a loved one? I'm guessing you'd be singing a different tune. The moral high ground is always easy from an outside perspective.

 

I'm not for prison rape or torture or anything else you may refer to barbaric, but unfortunately prison is a dangerous place and bad things happen to inmates all the time. If something bad happens to poor little Dzohkar, I will feel no sympathy for him whatsoever. Pure evil doesn't deserve our sympathy.

Nothing bad will ever happen to him in prison. We don't let that kind of crap go on at Supermax sites. We reserve these kind of disgusting fantasies for the general population.

[Soxbadger]

Why do you feel domestic terrorists deserve the same rights as regular U.S. citizens?

 

Because as long as we give the worst of us the same rights as the best of us, we will stay a free society. When we are presented with the most terrible acts, that is when we must be the most vigilant in protecting rights.

 

Because why does (insert) deserve the same rights?

 

Part of the price of being an american is that we believe in innocent until proven guilty. And regardless of how guilty the person may be, until that moment, they are guaranteed the same rights as anyone else.

 

You dont let them change you, thats what they want.

Edited April 22, 2013 by Soxbadger

[Reddy]

Because as long as we give the worst of us the same rights as the best of us, we will stay a free society. When we are presented with the most terrible acts, that is when we must be the most vigilant in protecting rights.

 

Because why does (insert) deserve the same rights?

 

Part of the price of being an american is that we believe in innocent until proven guilty. And regardless of how guilty the person may be, until that moment, they are guaranteed the same rights as anyone else.

 

You dont let them change you, thats what they want.

 

boom.

 

exactly.

[TaylorStSox]

Even the idea of giving the government the power to make that distinction is scary. You're basically taking away common rights. Imagine if the government had the power to deem Malcolm X a terrorist because he was both openly anti-establishment and Muslim.

[StrangeSox]

Why do you feel domestic terrorists deserve the same rights as regular U.S. citizens?

 

He's a US citizen. We had no problem prosecuting others like Eric Rudolph or Timothy McVeigh & Co. Or Gacy. Or any number of people who did things arguably worse than he has.

 

More importantly, why should we take the moral high road with known terrorists? This kid brutally murdered and mutilated dozens of people, destroying numerous people's lives in the process. He did so with the intent to create as much pain and suffering as possible for these innocent people.

 

Why does he get your sympathy when he took none on his victims? How would you feel if you were left a cripple or lost a loved one? I'm guessing you'd be singing a different tune. The moral high ground is always easy from an outside perspective.

 

Possibly my views would be changed, but I would hope that my convictions are deep enough that I wouldn't throw them away. Plenty of people face tragedies and yet do not advocate for abandonment of their principles. Why shouldn't we take the moral high road, to uphold a fair, just and humane justice system even in the face of horrible acts? We have a constitution that explicitly guarantees due process and explicitly prohibits cruel and unusual punishment. Those are important and worthwhile ideals that shouldn't be discarded out of a thirst for vengeance.

 

Nowhere do you see me expressing sympathy for him. You see me arguing that he deserves his full constitutional protections and that we are better than him, that there is no justification for stooping to barbaric actions in response, and that if we do, our system loses legitimacy and integrity. This person did absolutely terrible things, but I'm also very troubled by the reaction of many Americans who want us to discard our rules of law and our morals in a quest for revenge.

 

I'm not for prison rape or torture or anything else you may refer to barbaric, but unfortunately prison is a dangerous place and bad things happen to inmates all the time.

 

Yeah, well, if people didn't say inmates deserve rape and frequently look to it as a reasonable punishment, maybe there would be a will or a desire to do something about it. Many of the statements in this thread and elsewhere go far beyond "eh, I've got better things to worry about" when they're trying to justify rape as a deserved punishment. It's absolutely disgusting.

 

If something bad happens to poor little Dzohkar, I will feel no sympathy for him whatsoever. Pure evil doesn't deserve our sympathy.

 

It's not about sympathy for Dzokhar--it's about saving ourselves for moral deprivation. Frederick Douglass noted slavery's impact on the morals of white slave owners, and I see this in the same light.

 

My mistress was, as I have said, a kind and tender-hearted woman; and in the simplicity of her soul she commenced, when I first went to live with her, to treat me as she supposed one human being ought to treat another. In entering upon the duties of a slaveholder, she did not seem to perceive that I sustained to her the relation of a mere chattel, and that for her to treat me as a human being was not only wrong, but dangerously so. Slavery proved as injurious to her as it did to me. When I went there, she was a pious, warm, and tender-hearted woman. There was no sorrow or suffering for which she had not a tear. She had bread for the hungry, clothes for the naked, and comfort for every mourner that came within her reach. Slavery soon proved its ability to divest her of these heavenly qualities. Under its influence, the tender heart became stone, and the lamblike disposition gave way to one of tiger-like fierceness. The first step in her downward course was in her ceasing to instruct me. She now commenced to practise her husband's precepts. She finally became even more violent in her opposition than her husband himself. She was not satisfied with simply doing as well as he had commanded; she seemed anxious to do better. Nothing seemed to make her more angry than to see me with a newspaper. She seemed to think that here lay the danger. I have had her rush at me with a face made all up of fury, and snatch from me a newspaper, in a manner that fully revealed her apprehension. She was an apt woman; and a little experience soon demonstrated, to her satisfaction, that education and slavery were incompatible with each other.

 

We are worse off as a whole when we allow, if not actively embrace, injustices committed on others.

[Balta1701]

Anywho, federal charges filed against him today, for using a weapon of mass destruction against persons and property in the U.S. resulting in death.

 

Charges can qualify for the death penalty.

[southsider2k5]

Because as long as we give the worst of us the same rights as the best of us, we will stay a free society. When we are presented with the most terrible acts, that is when we must be the most vigilant in protecting rights.

 

Because why does (insert) deserve the same rights?

 

Part of the price of being an american is that we believe in innocent until proven guilty. And regardless of how guilty the person may be, until that moment, they are guaranteed the same rights as anyone else.

 

You dont let them change you, thats what they want.

 

Its funny how reaction to stuff varies based on which amendment we are talking about.

[Chi Town Sox]

LOL. It amuses me at no end that there are people that ridiculously stupid in this world.

 

Me or Glenn Beck?

[Balta1701]

This is from the federal complaint filed against him, summary of what they have on video:

The Forum Restaurant video shows that Bomber Two remained in the same spot for approximately four minutes, occasionally looking at his cell phone and once appearing to take a picture with it. At some point he appears to look at his phone, which is held at approximately waist level, and may be manipulating the phone. Approximately 30 seconds before the first explosion, he lifts his phone to his ear as if he is speaking on his cell phone, and keeps it there for approximately 18 seconds. A few seconds after he finishes the call, the large crowd of people around him can be seen reacting to the first explosion. Virtually every head turns to the east (towards the finish line) and stares in that direction in apparent bewilderment and alarm. Bomber Two, virtually alone among the individuals in front of the restaurant, appears calm. He glances to the east and then calmly but rapidly begins moving to the west, away from the direction of the finish line. He walks away without his knapsack, having left it on the ground where he had been standing. Approximately 10 seconds later, an explosion occurs in the location where Bomber Two had placed his knapsack.

 

[snip]

 

I can discern nothing in that location in the period before the explosion that might have caused that explosion, other than Bomber Two’s knapsack.

[StrangeSox]

he only gave himself a 10s window to get away?

[Soxbadger]

Its funny how reaction to stuff varies based on which amendment we are talking about.

 

Not really, its sad. Most people just argue for whatever position most helps them, very few people selflessly argue against their position, just because it may be the right thing to do.

 

Its the dividing line.

[illinilaw08]

Not really, its sad. Most people just argue for whatever position most helps them, very few people selflessly argue against their position, just because it may be the right thing to do.

 

Its the dividing line.

 

Not to go down this road, but there are already reasonable restrictions on the 4th and the 5th (and the 1st). Adding reasonable restrictions to the 2nd, I don't think, is inconsistent with that position. The argument, of course, is over what a reasonable restriction might be. Which is a different argument for a different thread.

 

Back to the point of this thread, glad to see the feds brought charges quickly.

[StrangeSox]

Will Mass. follow up with charges quickly or let the federal case play out?

[RockRaines]

Me or Glenn Beck?

LOL, Glenn Beck

[Swingandalongonetoleft]

How would you feel if you were left a cripple or lost a loved one? I'm guessing you'd be singing a different tune. The moral high ground is always easy from an outside perspective.

 

This is a difficult thing to consider and I've given it a lot of thought over the years. My conclusion is that the world doesn't revolve around me. If something were to happen to a friend or relative (or to me), it would hurt, but I wouldn't be the first in the history of the world to suffer an injustice at the hands of someone else. I think it's kind of disgusting to watch families of victims screaming for blood or taking great pleasure in telling the offender about how they're going to "burn in hell" (bonus points if they claim to be God-fearing Christians- a recent example being the family of the first wife Drew Peterson was recently convicted of murdering). It's animalistic and repulsive. Compose yourself and think before you talk out of your ass, Ass. Think about all the people that will see the petty way you act before you throw your adult hissy fit.

[Chi Town Sox]

LOL, Glenn Beck

 

LOL just checking

[Soxbadger]

Why does he get your sympathy when he took none on his victims? How would you feel if you were left a cripple or lost a loved one? I'm guessing you'd be singing a different tune. The moral high ground is always easy from an outside perspective.

 

An eye for an eye and the entire world goes blind.

 

I understand rage, which is why I try so very hard to control mine. No one will win, there will just be more suffering, and for what? So for one brief second I can feel better?

 

It doesnt bring them back, it just makes me like the people who hurt them.

 

 

[Big Hurtin]

You couldn't make this up: 'Best Friend' Of Boston Bombing Suspect Was Victim In Brutal Unsolved Murder 2 Years Ago: goo.gl/2G6Zb

— JΞSTΞR™(@th3j35t3r) April 22, 2013

<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8">

 

[lostfan]

Its funny how reaction to stuff varies based on which amendment we are talking about.

Well, it'd really help if people read the Bill of Rights past the Second Amendment.

[lostfan]

You don't get to decide which American citizens get rights - start doing that, and yours are not far behind. And when that happens, you deserve it. This is pretty cut and dry, it's not even something more esoteric like debating what to do with Gitmo detainees. This one's settled, in black and white, and the fact that it's even up for debate is kind of creepy. People wanna talk about the government being the ones to take their rights but they're ready to give them away.

[lostfan]

Also I want people to stop acting like they just finished reading the Wiki entry for "false flag" and start making some sense or at least speak in coherent sentences.

[southsider2k5]

You don't get to decide which American citizens get rights - start doing that, and yours are not far behind. And when that happens, you deserve it. This is pretty cut and dry, it's not even something more esoteric like debating what to do with Gitmo detainees. This one's settled, in black and white, and the fact that it's even up for debate is kind of creepy. People wanna talk about the government being the ones to take their rights but they're ready to give them away.

 

See also; tax code.

[Soxbadger]

You don't get to decide which American citizens get rights - start doing that, and yours are not far behind. And when that happens, you deserve it. This is pretty cut and dry, it's not even something more esoteric like debating what to do with Gitmo detainees. This one's settled, in black and white, and the fact that it's even up for debate is kind of creepy. People wanna talk about the government being the ones to take their rights but they're ready to give them away.

 

All I can do is break out Star Wars:

 

http://vimeo.com/25741586

 

So this is how liberty dies, with thunderous applause.

[pettie4sox]

Well said lostfan.

[Steve9347]

The ambassadors are Jedi Knights, I believe.