Wizards' Jason Collins

[caulfield12]

You have to remember, ESPN has a huge demographic of Christian viewers as well.

 

His rant was the equivalent of the Tea Party's genesis...sort of a call to arms.

 

I even wonder now if an overtly Christian broadcaster is fired for his viewpoint (based largely on the Bible) that he can now consider himself a "protected" class and file a wrongful termination lawsuit for discrimination based upon his religious beliefs.

 

It's definitely a slippery slope...so many of the Founding Fathers were overtly Christian. I can't imagine they would support a country where the pendulum has swung so far back the other direction that Christians were almost being persecuted for their beliefs (not in a the Roman Colisseum, thrown to the lions sense...but the modern day equivalent).

 

He wasn't stating you should condemn Collins or spit on him or attack him (hate crimes), he was just saying he disagreed with his homosexuality...not even getting into the argument whether it's a choice/decision or based on genetic predetermination.

 

And I say all this never once having dreamed of voting Republican.

Edited April 30, 2013 by caulfield12

[Reddy]

You have to remember, ESPN has a huge demographic of Christian viewers as well.

 

His rant was the equivalent of the Tea Party's genesis...sort of a call to arms.

 

I even wonder now if an overtly Christian broadcaster is fired for his viewpoint (based largely on the Bible) that he can now consider himself a "protected" class and file a wrongful termination lawsuit for discrimination based upon his religious beliefs.

 

It's definitely a slippery slope...so many of the Founding Fathers were overtly Christian. I can't imagine they would support a country where the pendulum has swung so far back the other direction that Christians were almost being persecuted for their beliefs (not in a the Roman Colisseum, thrown to the lions sense...but the modern day equivalent).

 

He wasn't stating you should condemn Collins or spit on him or attack him (hate crimes), he was just saying he disagreed with his homosexuality...not even getting into the argument whether it's a choice/decision or based on genetic predetermination.

 

And I say all this never once having dreamed of voting Republican.

 

proof please.

 

[chw42]

proof please.

 

Well, back in the late 1700s, you were either Christian or you were hated, mocked, or beaten...something along those lines.

Edited April 30, 2013 by chw42

[chw42]

You have to remember, ESPN has a huge demographic of Christian viewers as well.

 

His rant was the equivalent of the Tea Party's genesis...sort of a call to arms.

 

I even wonder now if an overtly Christian broadcaster is fired for his viewpoint (based largely on the Bible) that he can now consider himself a "protected" class and file a wrongful termination lawsuit for discrimination based upon his religious beliefs.

 

It's definitely a slippery slope...so many of the Founding Fathers were overtly Christian. I can't imagine they would support a country where the pendulum has swung so far back the other direction that Christians were almost being persecuted for their beliefs (not in a the Roman Colisseum, thrown to the lions sense...but the modern day equivalent).

 

He wasn't stating you should condemn Collins or spit on him or attack him (hate crimes), he was just saying he disagreed with his homosexuality...not even getting into the argument whether it's a choice/decision or based on genetic predetermination.

 

And I say all this never once having dreamed of voting Republican.

 

I mean, if Broussard made the statement in the context of Collins being a devout Christian, then I can somewhat understand that. Maybe it was wrong for him to say that Collins is definitely not a Christian since everybody and their mother has a different interpretation of the Bible and Christianity. Religion, IMO, is up to interpretation. After all, religion is passed down from the interpretation of texts written thousands of years ago. So what's to say that somebody's interpretation of it is right or wrong as long as they can back up their statements through some proof in text?

 

[StrangeSox]

I mean, if Broussard made the statement in the context of Collins being a devout Christian, then I can somewhat understand that. Maybe it was wrong for him to say that Collins is definitely not a Christian since everybody and their mother has a different interpretation of the Bible and Christianity. Religion, IMO, is up to interpretation. After all, religion is passed down from the interpretation of texts written thousands of years ago. So what's to say that somebody's interpretation of it is right or wrong as long as they can back up their statements through some proof in text?

some denominations have gay bishops

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gene_Robinson

[LittleHurt05]

I don't recall his tirade of Wilt Chamberlain let alone the plethora of players who fathered multiple children without ever getting married. Sure he made a passing comment today but he never felt that he had to proactively comment on their un-Christian ways like he did with his anti-homosexuality stance.

 

EDIT: f*** that guy. I hope he gets fired and struggles to land work.

 

When exactly was there an ESPN roundtable discussion about players sexual lives off the court? If there had been before, I assume he would have mentioned this adultery stance too. It's funny how the loudest anti-discrimination people do the most discriminating if anyone disagrees with their opinion.

[southsider2k5]

When exactly was there an ESPN roundtable discussion about players sexual lives off the court? If there had been before, I assume he would have mentioned this adultery stance too. It's funny how the loudest anti-discrimination people do the most discriminating if anyone disagrees with their opinion.

 

That's my problem with it too. Firing Broussard for being a Christian is the same as not signing Collins because he is gay, IMO. If Broussard was in a position of power and wouldn't hire gay people, then we could talk.

[StrangeSox]

That's my problem with it too. Firing Broussard for being a Christian is the same as not signing Collins because he is gay, IMO. If Broussard was in a position of power and wouldn't hire gay people, then we could talk.

Broussard wouldn't be fired for "being a Christian"

 

edit: unless ESPN wants a huge lawsuit on their hands, that is

 

edit2: you're right that firing Broussard for "being a Christian" isn't the same as discriminating against someone based on sexuality; one of those is a legal in almost every state!

Edited April 30, 2013 by StrangeSox

[StrangeSox]

When exactly was there an ESPN roundtable discussion about players sexual lives off the court? If there had been before, I assume he would have mentioned this adultery stance too.

 

Well that's sort of the point. He'll throw in some plausible deniability "oh I'm against adultery too" but this is only a topic of discussion when it comes to LGBT people "living in sin."

[LittleHurt05]

Well that's sort of the point. He'll throw in some plausible deniability "oh I'm against adultery too" but this is only a topic of discussion when it comes to LGBT people "living in sin."

 

So apparently, he should have interrupted previous NBA discussion with a "Oh, by the way, I disagree with the way all these adulterous NBA players live their lives. Back to you Magic". Then everyone would believe him.

[StrangeSox]

So apparently, he should have interrupted previous NBA discussion with a "Oh, by the way, I disagree with the way all these adulterous NBA players live their lives. Back to you Magic". Then everyone would believe him.

He could have written columns on it or started a blog or something.

 

It's larger than Broussard, though, because the first openly gay male athlete in a major US sport (that's a lot of qualifiers!) sort of is a big deal, so it's going to be a point of discussion on ESPN etc. I guess I'm just generally incredulous towards the "oh I'm against adultery too" crowd because they seem to view and treat LGBT people differently than straight adulterers.

[cabiness42]

I agree. That is his belief. I hardly see that as a homophobic stance.

 

I dont care for the NBA but from what I've seen of Broussard, it seems like most consider him a joke. But if he gets fired or in trouble for that then this country is even worse off than I thought. I'm a non believer but it seems like you cant even be religious these days without catching major flack for it.

 

He can't get fired or get in trouble for what he said on OTL. It's an ESPN show and they asked him to appear on the show and they pretty much knew what he was going to say. I think it was a bad idea on ESPN's part to have one of their own employees take that view when they could have gotten the pastor of a church or someone like that to state the same view, but ESPN certainly can't sanction him for what he said.

 

Now, if he had gone on a local radio show or something like that without ESPN knowing about it and said the same things, that might have been different.

 

[StrangeSox]

I'm a non believer but it seems like you cant even be religious these days without catching major flack for it.

 

Right, like having some B-list sports commentator on a major national sports network telling you that you're not a real Christian because you're openly gay. The nerve of some people.

[LittleHurt05]

He could have written columns on it or started a blog or something.

 

It's larger than Broussard, though, because the first openly gay male athlete in a major US sport (that's a lot of qualifiers!) sort of is a big deal, so it's going to be a point of discussion on ESPN etc. I guess I'm just generally incredulous towards the "oh I'm against adultery too" crowd because they seem to view and treat LGBT people differently than straight adulterers.

 

Yes, maybe on the side he is banging chicks left & right behind his wife's back, who knows. But so far on air he hasn't treated them any differently than adulterers. He hasn't asked for Jason Collins to be banned from the NBA. He hasn't refused to cover a gay player's games. He just said that the religion he believes thinks homosexuality is a sin, just like adultery. I don't agree with his opinion, but I'll defend his right to believe in his religion.

[StrangeSox]

Yes, maybe on the side he is banging chicks left & right behind his wife's back, who knows. But so far on air he hasn't treated them any differently than adulterers. He hasn't asked for Jason Collins to be banned from the NBA. He hasn't refused to cover a gay player's games. He just said that the religion he believes thinks homosexuality is a sin, just like adultery. I don't agree with his opinion, but I'll defend his right to believe in his religion.

 

He didn't just defend his own particular version of religion, he claimed that Jason Collins couldn't be a real Christian because he's openly gay. That kind of language is frequently used against members of the LGBT community but not against adulterers and people who wear clothing made of more than one fabric, both serious sins in Leviticus.

 

edit: Broussard's free to say whatever he wants, but that doesn't mean he has to be given a platform to say it by ESPN. I don't personally care one way or the other if he stays or goes because I don't ever watch ESPN.

Edited April 30, 2013 by StrangeSox

[Jenksismyhero]

He didn't just defend his own particular version of religion, he claimed that Jason Collins couldn't be a real Christian because he's openly gay. That kind of language is frequently used against members of the LGBT community but not against adulterers and people who wear clothing made of more than one fabric, both serious sins in Leviticus.

 

Did someone ask him about adulterers? Or was he responding to a media driven hype machine about a gay basketball player?

 

[LittleHurt05]

He didn't just defend his own particular version of religion, he claimed that Jason Collins couldn't be a real Christian because he's openly gay. That kind of language is frequently used against members of the LGBT community but not against adulterers and people who wear clothing made of more than one fabric, both serious sins in Leviticus.

 

edit: Broussard's free to say whatever he wants, but that doesn't mean he has to be given a platform to say it by ESPN. I don't personally care one way or the other if he stays or goes because I don't ever watch ESPN.

 

Well I doubt Jason Collins wants anything to do with Broussard's version of Christianity anyway

[Reddy]

Well, back in the late 1700s, you were either Christian or you were hated, mocked, or beaten...something along those lines.

 

 

yeah no. most of the founding fathers were Deists

[Jenksismyhero]

yeah no. most of the founding fathers were Deists

 

Yeah no. SOME of them were, including some of the more prominent ones (Jefferson, Franklin and possibly Washington). Though it's still debated how to classify their beliefs since they agreed with Deist principles yet also believed God impacted human activity. The majority were, or had significant roots in, Christianity.

 

http://www.adherents.com/gov/Founding_Fathers_Religion.html

[StrangeSox]

Did someone ask him about adulterers? Or was he responding to a media driven hype machine about a gay basketball player?

It's larger than just Broussard's comments on an NBA player. The LGBT community is singled out for all sorts of hate and attacks claiming to be based on religion while so many other things get a blind eye. People break all sorts of religion's rules without being told that they can't be Christian or that they're living in "open rebellion of Christ." Thankfully, that hateful side is pretty rapidly losing the cultural struggle over this issue. You can see this by their reactions largely being "oh well, big deal!" instead of the outrage and condemnation we'd have seen even just a few years ago.

 

also lol @ "media driven hype machine," no he was responding to a pretty significant moment for sports/LGBT and being paid money to say bigoted things. he is a paid employee of the media.

 

I think this article in The Nation gets why this was an important moment. Jason Collins felt that he had to hide who he really was because of the bigotry of others. He took a brave first step and hopefully others will feel comfortable being open about who they are in the future. In 10 years, I can't imagine anyone will care if an athlete is gay or straight.

Edited April 30, 2013 by StrangeSox

[RockRaines]

yeah no. most of the founding fathers were Deists

A few of those guys probably had boys in their beds too. Just like alot of the folks that edited that novel called the Bible over the centuries.

[illinilaw08]

Or was he responding to a media driven hype machine about a gay basketball player?

 

Come on Jenks. You have to understand that Collins coming out is, in fact, a big deal.

 

On Broussard, I put the blame on ESPN for providing that platform. Broussard should have been smarter about what he said, but ESPN shouldn't have tried to cover this from anything other than a sports angle.

[Jenksismyhero]

It's larger than just Broussard's comments on an NBA player. The LGBT community is singled out for all sorts of hate and attacks claiming to be based on religion while so many other things get a blind eye. People break all sorts of religion's rules without being told that they can't be Christian or that they're living in "open rebellion of Christ." Thankfully, that hateful side is pretty rapidly losing the cultural struggle over this issue. You can see this by their reactions largely being "oh well, big deal!" instead of the outrage and condemnation we'd have seen even just a few years ago.

 

also lol @ "media driven hype machine," no he was responding to a pretty significant moment for sports/LGBT and being paid money to say bigoted things.

 

I think this article in The Nation gets why this was an important moment. Jason Collins felt that he had to hide who he really was because of the bigotry of others. He took a brave first step and hopefully others will feel comfortable being open about who they are in the future. In 10 years, I can't imagine anyone will care if an athlete is gay or straight.

 

The LGBT community has just gotten louder the last decade, as has the "cause," so the "anti-" crowd has been equally loud in response. The Christian faith has ALWAYS had a problem with adultery. It was made illegal in most states because of it and some states still have laws on the books making it illegal (Illinois included). There's not much more to be said about how Christians shouldn't do it.

 

And LOL if you don't believe this was all about PR. Yes, it's great that he finally felt comfortable to do this, but people were falling all over themselves trying to praise the guy. Oh! Obama even called him! Remember? The guy that didn't want gays to be married 6 months ago because they lived in sin?

 

Oh, but he's a hero! f*** that. He's a professional basketball player who came out at the end of his career to an overwhelmingly accepting/apathetic country. He's not a hero. Gays are everywhere in our culture. Stop pretending like 99% of the country wants to persecute gays and what this guy did is equal to Rosa Parks. You'll notice that the collective response from your average American was "oh, ok."

[Jenksismyhero]

Come on Jenks. You have to understand that Collins coming out is, in fact, a big deal.

 

On Broussard, I put the blame on ESPN for providing that platform. Broussard should have been smarter about what he said, but ESPN shouldn't have tried to cover this from anything other than a sports angle.

 

I think it's significant, I don't think it's something to give the guy a medal for.

[Balta1701]

I think it's significant, I don't think it's something to give the guy a medal for.

Who exactly has done that?