Disney sexies up Merida from Brave, parents upset about body image iss

[StrangeSox]

i.e., let's all be goo backs.

Yes, that's the choice. Either everything feminine and female is turned into something about sex, or nothing can ever be turned into something about sex ever. Fantastic comprehension, there.

[iamshack]

It isn't happening to men to anywhere near the level that it happens with women in virtually every aspect of our society. When a bunch of dudes respond to a feminist criticism of culture by saying "but some guys get a s***ty deal too!" it doesn't destroy anything but their own credibility.

 

 

 

 

More jenks-like intentionally bad-faith comprehension.

 

Men are judged on their looks. Nobody has said otherwise.

Women are judged on their looks damn near constantly and in probably every aspect of their lives. Their looks are central to any story if they're getting press coverage. They're a legitimate topic of conversation. Whether or not they give the President a tingle in his dingle is a legitimate comment for him to make at a press conference. They're not going to be a media figure without being at least moderately attractive.

Why do you suppose that is?

 

What do you suppose women judge men on?

[Jenksismyhero]

Yes, that's the choice. Either everything feminine and female is turned into something about sex, or nothing can ever be turned into something about sex ever. Fantastic comprehension, there.

 

That's exactly what you want! You didn't say let's LESSEN the femanization/sexualization of females, you said let's get rid of it entirely. Why the f*** would we do that? Let's pretend human nature and sexuality doesn't exist! That'll solve all of the worlds problems!

 

You're a f***ing joke.

[Jenksismyhero]

Why do you suppose that is?

 

What do you suppose women judge men on?

 

Exactly.

[illinilaw08]

Why can't he?

 

One is a serious medical issue. The other helps you work out. How are they even remotely similar?

[HuskyCaucasian]

It seems like the 2D version of Merida has been removed from the princess.disney.com site and replaced with the 3D Pixar version.

[StrangeSox]

You're so afraid of offending anyone (that you like) that you want the entire world to change over it.

 

No, I want the world to be a less-s***ty place where people are valued regardless of their looks.

 

I, on the other hand, could give two s***s if some morbidly obese kid of a morbidly obese mother has some self esteem issues because a non-morbidly obese cartoon character is projected in a movie. Maybe that'd be good for that morbidly obese family to see what is "attractive" and healthy and what is not. That's my point here.

 

Yeah, see, there's a huge range between "morbidly obese" and "literally unrealistically skinny." What was wrong with the character before?

 

Obesity and health sort of correspond in some aspects but not in others, and really only when you're in the "morbidly obese" range. Heavier people can be every bit as healthy as you or I, but they're going to be judged as lazy, out-of-shape fatties. For women, where so much comes back to sex appeal, this is even more of a problem.

 

I'm much more accepting of the idea that models that are airbrushed and put on covers of teen magazines is an actual issue worth discussing. Changing a cartoon character aimed at 5-10 year olds? GMAFB.

 

It's all part of the same context, and starting it at younger and younger ages only makes it worse.

[iamshack]

One is a serious medical issue. The other helps you work out. How are they even remotely similar?

Oh, is it that simple?

 

One involves girls thinking they need to be thinner or smaller, another involves boys thinking they need to be bigger or stronger.

 

Trying to do either incorrectly can be extremely dangerous and cause serious health consequences.

 

Trying to do either can be very difficult just based on genetic makeup, thereby causing even more problems.

 

 

[Soxbadger]

Strangesox,

 

 

Partially, but what is "good looking" is, again, culturally dependent. We're not hard-wired to like Barbie-doll like figures.

 

Response:

 

Okay so then what is the problem? Some American males like heavier women. They call skinny girls, twigs or say "I could break her". Some guys like barbie, some dont. I dont like blondes, never been a barbie fan. Should we change barbies hair to brunette so they dont have image issues?

 

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Why does a Disney character in a children's movie need to be sexed-up at all? What was wrong with the character before? Should every single character in every story be made to look as sexually attractive as possible?

 

Response:

 

To make money? Its their character, they can do what they want? If they want her to be sexier because they think it will sell more, why should I care?

 

 

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This sounds like a bunch of nonsense. What is the evidence that they lost money because Brave wasn't sexualized before?

 

Response:

 

I dont need evidence. Its their character. Are you trying to suggest that Disney is doing this for some other sinister reason? That its not just purely profit driven?

 

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Disney creates some characters like that, but they aren't universally so. They also haven't gone back and sexed-up characters in movies released just a couple of years ago, either. Did they make Brave's father more attractive and sexual?

 

Response:

 

Who cares? They are rebranding the main character. Youd think that people would focus on the fact that there is a female lead character, not her looks. But it just shows the cultural obsession with looks. Who cares who she is, how she looks (to sexy) is the most important. What about the fact that hot girls are viewed negatively? Maybe Disney wants to break the stereotype that pretty girls are useless?

 

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There's nothing "nonsense" about not wanting every female character increasingly sexualized. Her agenda appears to be to not have things for little girls sexualized, and of course it's trying to push her own agenda. That's the point of an argument.

 

Response:

 

If you dont want that, then create your own characters. If you think it will be so successful, prove Disney wrong. Prove the world wrong. Nothing is stopping Hollywood from hiring ugly male/female leads. Nothing stops them from hiring fat models. So why not start your own business and see how well it goes.

 

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Yes, there are. There's a much larger issue with body image and sexualization of women, and this story is very clearly about sexualizing a female. Not every argument and issue needs to address every possible related thing in the world.

 

Response:

 

That is your opinion. In mine its a societal issue that transcends gender. Its not male or female, its human. By suggesting its not, you create hypocrisy.

 

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There's nothing biologically deterministic that says we need to sexualize everything and everyone feminine, that we need to judge women primarily on their looks and certainly much more than we judge men.

 

Response:

 

Men and women are judged by differently depending on the situation. Men are judged by looks, abilities, success. Women are judged by looks, abilities, success.

 

I dont know what ratio each person decides. I do know that sex sells, so if Im making a movie, Im going to sexualize everything.

 

Pretty things make money.

 

Shocker.

[StrangeSox]

Why do you suppose that is?

 

What do you suppose women judge men on?

Perhaps if we were in an inverted universe where women controlled most of the world and promoted and hired and elected other women with little or no regard for their looks, this would be relevant. As it is now, men aren't judged like this on their looks in damn near every aspect of their lives while women are.

[StrangeSox]

That's exactly what you want! You didn't say let's LESSEN the femanization/sexualization of females, you said let's get rid of it entirely.

 

Quotation needed

 

Why the f*** would we do that? Let's pretend human nature and sexuality doesn't exist! That'll solve all of the worlds problems!

 

if this were the Olympics of "Not getting a single damn thing," you'd be taking home the gold.

 

You're a f***ing joke.

 

wee bit ironic.

[iamshack]

Perhaps if we were in an inverted universe where women controlled most of the world and promoted and hired and elected other women with little or no regard for their looks, this would be relevant. As it is now, men aren't judged like this on their looks in damn near every aspect of their lives while women are.

But what are we judged on?

 

Or do women just not judge men?

 

 

[StrangeSox]

Strangesox,

 

not responding to that wot until you learn how to use the quote function

[Steve9347]

links are broken

 

but past Disney movies/princesses haven't escaped criticism over the years. Characters like Brave and Mulan were lauded for breaking from those stereotypes.

I can still see the pictures, am I the only one?

[Soxbadger]

One is a serious medical issue. The other helps you work out. How are they even remotely similar?

 

Steroids help you work out, they dont cause any serious medical issues for a 13 year old?

[Jenksismyhero]

No, I want the world to be a less-s***ty place where people are valued regardless of their looks.

 

OK great, where's the outrage that Don Draper/Jon Hamm is a sex symbol on TV. I certainty don't look that good in a suit!

 

 

[StrangeSox]

But what are we judged on?

 

Generally speaking, depends on the field. Sports? Merit for men, primarily looks for women. Most other fields? Mixes of who you know, race, class, educational background, some merit etc. etc.

 

Or do women just not judge men?

 

Sure, but not constantly on sexuality. They're also not in a dominant position of power so to whatever extent women judge men in a sexual manner in a non-sexual context, the actual impact is much less. Plus our culture as a whole doesn't reinforce the constant sexualization of men.

[Soxbadger]

not responding to that wot until you learn how to use the quote function

 

I did quote, I just removed the brackets because it was to long and would look really stupid.

 

Hence why I used:

 

Quote:

 

Response:

 

------

 

But if that is your excuse for tapping out, so be it.

[iamshack]

not responding to that wot until you learn how to use the quote function

You're being so elitist because he doesn't use the quote function...how judgmental and terrible of you...we need to eliminate all intellectual elitism from the world and act like mediocre idiots.

[caulfield12]

Another recent example is the NBA cheerleader who was called out, of course by another woman....I think a blogger, for "being pretty but pudgy" around her waistline.

 

http://now.msn.com/claire-crawford-a-cbs-h...retty-but-pudgy

 

http://search.yahoo.com/search;_ylt=AsFq.2...mp;fr=yfp-t-900

 

 

Sure, this issue has been around in popular since Marilyn Monroe/Jayne Mansfield and the fixation on the hourglass/Barbie figure and Playboy Playmate look, accentuated even more by top-heavy plastic surgery victims in recent years.

 

There's another good recent example from real life of girls caught up in this "body image" issue, it's Amanda Bynes. Look at her pictures from when she was younger, and what she is today. Lindsay Lohan is yet another example. Paris Hilton, Kim Kardashian....

 

Girls are being taught if they're not popular or successful enough or attracting attention....go out and get plastic surgery.

 

And while yes, more men are also going in for procedures....

 

 

 

I'll give an example. I taught for a year in Colombia. Over half of the girls in my class at age 16 or 17 had had liposuction (some twice, because the mother was a pageant winner and her daughter was also "pudgy" in her mom's eyes), breast implants, nose jobs (to help them "breathe better"), ears tucked back or shaped, etc.

 

Here in Asia, the double eyelid surgery is popular, especially in South Korea.

 

Men here and elsewhere are taught that if they control lots of money/power, they can "buy" a beautiful girl...but they don't want that girl to be smarter than them, or have opinions (usually), it's all about who has control in a relationship.

 

So girls are willing to do almost anything to win the competition to attract men who will give them "security/stability," everything from their boyfriends paying for plastic surgery or accepting that their husband/b-f/fiancé will cheat on them and that they should learn how to deal with it in return for having an easier life financially.

 

In Shanghai, any girl over 50-55 (110-122) KG is considered "fat." It's amazing how the Chinese/Asian culture has totally changed in the last five years, with economic progress (with reality tv and numerous dating shows, music videos, tv and movies, heck, a very famous saying is now "I'd rather ride in the backseat of a BMW than on the back of a bicycle"....where women are more fashionable and more scantily dressed in clubs than anything you'd find in South Beach, LA, NYC, etc.

 

All these are examples of this beauty concept that starts out with simple modifications in cartoon characters and gets more and more built into the subconscious or psyches of women/girls (even parents) over time.

Edited May 14, 2013 by caulfield12

[Steve9347]

[Steve9347]

[Kyyle23]

back er down with the "f***ing joke"s and "assholery"

[StrangeSox]

OK great, where's the outrage that Don Draper/Jon Hamm is a sex symbol on TV. I certainty don't look that good in a suit!

Where's the case where men are sexualized and judged on their attractiveness constantly?

 

Go read some articles covering female CEO's, actors, and politicians and note how many times their appearance is deemed a legitimate topic of discussion. Then go read some articles about male CEO's, actors and politicians. Look at how many unattractive men hold prominent positions versus how many women.

[Steve9347]