Santiago vs. Axelrod

[caulfield12]

The bolded... what does that even mean? How many pitchers have MANY swing and miss pitches, taking away their "good stuff"?

 

 

I was trying to be kind.

 

I should have said, when he had a consistent low 90's fastball, he still had a tendency to struggle with putting batters away (just like Quintana in much of the 2nd half last year) post 2008/2009. Not great stuff, like Sale or Floyd/Javy on a good day, but "very good" stuff.

 

Now, post-surgery, he doesn't have that. Which means he needs to have pinpoint command/control.

 

Yet even Danks has acknowledged he's still struggling with that issue in the minors.

Edited May 22, 2013 by caulfield12

[witesoxfan]

The bolded... what does that even mean? How many pitchers have MANY swing and miss pitches, taking away their "good stuff"?

 

Henry Rowengartner

[southsider2k5]

The bolded... what does that even mean? How many pitchers have MANY swing and miss pitches, taking away their "good stuff"?

 

JAKE f***ING PEAVY!

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

My prediction. Ax stays in the rotation. Because of the Sale tendonitis, Santiago will get a start on short rest and after throwing his bullpen session. He is not in a a position to succeed. Also with Thornton and Veal shaky Santiago won't be the long man, he'll be a set up guy. Omogrosso is long relief if he can handle it. Maybe keeping Omogrosso leaves too many pitchers on the roster. I haven't bothered counting but Veal will be sent back down.

 

It's also possible Danks gets one start and then gets sent back down for another 30 days if that's even possible without claiming another rehab stint. Help me out here.

Edited May 22, 2013 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

I know you have an irrational hatred for Axelrod, but here is the breakdown.

 

Providing statistics shows irrational hate? Interesting. I guess most people here have irrational hate for Axelrod then, because most want Santiago in the rotation over Axe.

[southsider2k5]

Providing statistics shows irrational hate? Interesting. I guess most people here have irrational hate for Axelrod then, because most want Santiago in the rotation over Axe.

 

Most can just stick to criticizing his performance, instead of his looks. That is what makes it irrational.

[caulfield12]

Bring back Jon Garland, Brian Anderson and Kirk McCaskill.

 

Need more "hunnies" in the stands.

 

 

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

Most can just stick to criticizing his performance, instead of his looks. That is what makes it irrational.

 

Oh my god, you people are so sensitive. Acting as if no one has ever called Bartolo Colon fat, or even called him "Fatolo". I make a joke about Axelrod being ugly and I get warned about being suspended because apparently it's against forum rules to make fun of a professional athlete's looks.

[Buehrle>Wood]

Despite even more misuse by the White Sox, #TeamSantiago is looking good again.

[caulfield12]

Despite even more misuse by the White Sox, #TeamSantiago is looking good again.

 

Yep, he couldn't have had more obstacles for success thrown in his way...and yet he still persevered and recovered from the shaky start.

 

TWTWBVSTGTO

 

(The Will to Win Before Ventura Surrendered the Game To Omogrosso)

Edited May 23, 2013 by caulfield12

[caulfield12]

To make room for Danks on the 25-man roster, the Sox optioned left-hander Donnie Veal to Triple-A Charlotte. But the biggest decision may occur this weekend and affect Santiago because Dylan Axelrod is scheduled to start Sunday against the Marlins.

 

"I'll be like a Swiss Army Knife,'' quipped Santiago, mentioning the comparison that manager Robin Ventura gave him earlier this year. "I'll be ready for any role."

 

Santiago could be dispatched to the bullpen since Matt Thornton now is the lone left-hander, but Ventura said a decision would be made this weekend.

 

Santiago labored during a 29-pitch first inning in which he allowed a two-run single to David Ortiz on a one-handed swing.

 

"I think that was the best slider I threw this season," Santiago said.

 

Unfortunately for Santiago, Clay Buchholz outpitched him, tossing seven innings of five-hit ball to improve to 7-0 with a 1.73 ERA.

 

Santiago left the Sox with the comfort of knowing they could insert him into the rotation again in the event of an injury or if a starter struggles over an extended period.

 

Since joining the rotation after Gavin Floyd was shut down for the season because of an elbow injury, Santiago has posted a 2.30 ERA in five starts.

 

Gonzales/chicagotribune.com/sports

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

My prediction. Ax stays in the rotation. Because of the Sale tendonitis, Santiago will get a start on short rest and after throwing his bullpen session. He is not in a a position to succeed. Also with Thornton and Veal shaky Santiago won't be the long man, he'll be a set up guy. Omogrosso is long relief if he can handle it. Maybe keeping Omogrosso leaves too many pitchers on the roster. I haven't bothered counting but Veal will be sent back down.

 

It's also possible Danks gets one start and then gets sent back down for another 30 days if that's even possible without claiming another rehab stint. Help me out here.

 

[cabiness42]

It's also possible Danks gets one start and then gets sent back down for another 30 days if that's even possible without claiming another rehab stint. Help me out here.

 

Once he's reinstated from the DL, he would have to go back on the DL in order to come off the roster and pitch in more minor league games.

[pettie4sox]

Santiago will be an MLB starter at some point but that bullpen needs help and one of the two young studs will be able to assist in that manner.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

No need to brag about Veal getting sent down. I think everyone and their mother knew he doesn't belong on an MLB team and he was the guy to go.

It's my party. I only see people griping . You'll see most of what I said will happen. Veal was the 1st step. Next is Santiago as a set up guy and Ax still in the rotation.

 

[southsider2k5]

Look at the line up card for tonight

 

https://twitter.com/DanHayesCSN/status/3380...4425089/photo/1

 

Santiago is listed as reliever now. That probably means Axe is the fifth starter for now.

[caulfield12]

They weren't supposed to decide on that until over the weekend...

[southsider2k5]

Hector Santiago favorited the post on Twitter.

 

https://twitter.com/SoxNet/status/338048506772193280

[Buehrle>Wood]

What an absolute joke if true. However not surprising from this often clueless organization.

[justBLAZE]

What an absolute joke if true. However not surprising from this often clueless organization.

 

Stoney said this was gonna be the case days ago on CSN's Sports Time Live.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

What an absolute joke if true. However not surprising from this often clueless organization.

Axelrod is an effective starter, not so good in the pen. Santiago can be effective at both. The pen needs more help than the rotation. If Ax keeps being effective he becomes a useful trade chip. I said it in a post at the beginning of the season. The Sox had to find out what they have in Axelrod. He's been better than anyone could've expected. He may not have the stuff but he's a pitcher. He knows what he's doing up there on the mound. This helps the team in 2 different ways. Santiago will get his chance to start later. I fail to see how helping the team in 2 ways is an absolute joke.

[caulfield12]

It's only going to make sense if they start using Santiago in place of Jones, Omogrosso, Thornton and Lindstrom...in high leverage situations where the team has the lead, instead of when we're already 3-4-5 runs down.

 

If he stays the long-man and last guy out of the pen, it's pointless.

 

They might as well just bring up Jason Berken and send Santiago to AAA to start every 5 days.

 

 

And this whole idea of eventually trading Santiago to get something useful in return...I'll believe it when I see it.

 

[Buehrle>Wood]

ITT people actually try to defend the decision to diminish the role of a talented starter with a sub 3 ERA. Proof that some will defend anything.

 

In the very least, we need to stop f***ing with the development of one of the most valuable and talented players in our organization.

 

Oh well, back to having the most talented mop up man in the game. How valuable! .

Edited May 25, 2013 by Buehrle>Wood

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

ITT people actually try to defend the decision to diminish the role of a talented starter with a sub 3 ERA. Proof that some will defend anything.

 

In the very least, we need to stop f***ing with the development of one of the most valuable and talented players in our organization.

 

Oh well, back to having the most talented mop up man in the game. How valuable! .

He won't be a mop up man. Haven't you been paying attention ? He'll be a set up guy. If not, then I would agree with your assessment. It's not really that much of a problem having too many good starters. But it is a problem not having enough competent set up guys. Young guys often pitch out of the bullpen before finding their proper place. Seeing good start after good start wasted because of hitting woes can cause a young starter , any starter for that matter to press. Maybe the Sox can turn Ax and something else into finding a bat. That's my hope , to make the team better. You put Ax in the pen and he's worthless. He keeps going as he has been ,now you got something. That is not defending anything. That is having a plan.

[caulfield12]

He won't be a mop up man. Haven't you been paying attention ? He'll be a set up guy. If not, then I would agree with your assessment. It's not really that much of a problem having too many good starters. But it is a problem not having enough competent set up guys. Young guys often pitch out of the bullpen before finding their proper place. Seeing good start after good start wasted because of hitting woes can cause a young starter , any starter for that matter to press. Maybe the Sox can turn Ax and something else into finding a bat. That's my hope , to make the team better. You put Ax in the pen and he's worthless. He keeps going as he has been ,now you got something. That is not defending anything. That is having a plan.

 

 

Show any evidence from 2012 (after he was demoted from closer) and early 2013 that Santiago will be used as a set-up guy...

 

To replace Thornton? That would be ONE PLAN (to get through this year competitively). Trading Thornton and investing the money back in the team.

 

Replacing Nathan Jones or Lindstrom with Santiago? Are they really planning to do that?

 

Otherwise, this whole idea of young starters starting to press....how is that changed by addressing the bullpen instead of the offense/starting line-up (for example, catcher)?

 

Axelrod is the shortest RH starter in the game of baseball and has the lowest average fastball. He's worth more to the White Sox (because of his low salary) than he is in trade return. You can't trade Axelrod and getting a starting catcher in return for him. It's just not going to happen.

 

With a premium being placed more and more on power pitching...Axelrod is fine as the last pitcher on the roster, but he's not going to help lead your rotation to the playoffs. And he's probably going to struggle more at UCSF when the weather (and offenses) start to heat up.

 

The White Sox already made one mistake in bringing back Floyd and not trading him when they had the opportunity. Now they're making another one by utilizing Santiago incorrectly. If they're building towards the future, then Santiago really needs to be starting for the Charlotte Knights, so he doesn't have to spend 2014 wearing down in the end...like Chris Sale in the second half of 2012.

Edited May 25, 2013 by caulfield12